How do we protect the abuser?

by ???? 104 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse

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  Sirona

  ????

  Welcome.

  (for anyone reading this, I mention things here which may trigger, so please don't read if you might be upset)

  My opinion is

  * The watchtower society issued a letter saying that police must be informed where the law requires it. This indicates that if you live in a state / country where there is no such law then you are OK to keep your mouth shut, if you want to. (Imagine the accused is a friend of the elder who is told about the abuse. That elder may choose to follow the WTS judicial system rather than telling the police that his good friend was accused)

  * If the police are not told IMMEDIATELY, physical evidence of the abuse might be lost. If the abuse happened days ago for instance, there might still be traces of bodily fluid and / or marks on the victim. The elders taking their time wondering whether to report it is just time for the abuser to get away with it through lack of evidence.

  * Whether the elder keeps his mouth shut or not, the judicial committee usually ensues. This means that over and over again the elders interview the alleged victim and often they force the victim to confront the alleged abuser. This is the worst thing that the elders could possibly do! They are NOT trained to deal with this sort of scenario, they are NOT psychologists! This just empowers the abuser even more and makes the victim even more of a victim.

  * The alleged abuser may be going through a court process and it stands to reason that he / she would be removed from congregation "priveleges". Remember, most abuse cases would never even get to court if there was no evidence whatsoever. There always needs to be some evidence for the police to even proceed with a proper prosecution. Unfortunately there have been cases where the abuser is convicted but still supported by the elders because they appear "repentant". This is all very well from a spiritual standpoint for the elders, but the problems arise years later when he has served his time and he is back in the cong. He might go to a different hall and those individuals in the hall are not informed of his past. He will then go from door to door. I don't care what you say, I know that they won't always watch who he is with when he is out on the ministry (what if he is with a 14-16 year old for instance?)

  Overall there should be an admittance from the WTS regarding the many victims they have hurt. Then they should

  1. Check all ministerial servants and elders past records for convictions (they do this with jobs why not in the church?)

  2. ALWAYS report abuse to the authorities IMMEDIATELY

  3. Abandon the WTS "judicial system" because all it really does is control people and harm people. JWs should be attending because they want to serve Jehovah and they should be moral because of their faith, not because some elder is watching over their shoulder. The whole thing is just like the scribes and pharisees putting unnecessary burden on people.

  Sirona
• 

  shamus

  ???, you need to look more closely at what this WTBTS has done and continues to do to this very day. "leave it for jehovah". That is a lame excuse made up by lame men. Shame on the WTBTS, and shame on them for harboring this disgusting attitude to those who are potential victims. And shame on anyone who honestly believes that garbage. Shame on them for letting convicted child molesters go door to door, 'preaching the good news of jehovahs kingdom'. Now what does that look like to joe blow living right next door to you?

  What you really need to do is stop looking at every little thing that could happen, and see what actually does happen. Many people close they're eyes, plug they're ears, and scream "la la la la la!" as loud as they can.

  Hear no evil. See no evil. There is no evil. Trouble is, people don't want to open they're eyes.

  My question to you is are you one of them? That is only something that you can decide. Do you go door to door and preach about 'false religion' and sexual abuse scandals, while the WTBTS has just as much blood on they're hands? I recall Jesus calling that Hypocritical.
• 

  shamus
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  ????

  Maybe its just me but a can't see a parent letting the elders stop them from going to the police. Even if they say they will disfellowship them who cares! this is your child! To me if this happens i think the parents are partly to blame if there is in fact a cover up.

  In all the years i have been a witness there have been countless wt studys reminding the cong the elders are imperfect and mess up so why let them play a role in some so serious. Parents have HAVE to do what is best for the child regardless or the outcome. But I have a hard time beleaving that every time parents go to the police they will be disfellowshiped.
• 

  Odrade

  So you take the responsibility away from the elders and give it to the parents? Fine, that's as it should be. But how does that absolve the elders of responsibility to protect others in the congregation? And how does that excuse the fact that the parents have to WORRY about doing the right thing and going to the authorities... WORRYING if their right actions would get them in trouble with the ELDERS?

  I don't think parental responsibility is the question here, and even if it is... many think that Jehovah will "take care of it" by using the elders. So when the elders discourage them from going to the police, they may believe that it is in their and their child's best interests to follow "Jehovah's direction" and do what the elders say.

  I don't think you or the JWs get out of this wrong-headedness by throwing it all back on the parents. Besides, what if the PARENT is the abuser? What then?

  edited because it looks like I'm contradicting myself. Clarify: The parents or whatever adult is acting in the best interest of the child should be the one to go to the authorities. Yes, granted. The elders though, by inserting themselves in the matter with their judicial committees are wholely responsible for how the matter procedes after that. Once they are involved, it is as much their burden as anyone else'. As long as they continue to hold that clerical position, they will have to answer for their actions or lack of.
• 

  Big Tex

  But I have a hard time beleaving that every time parents go to the police they will be disfellowshiped.

  If it happens once, that's once too many. A religion should be there to help, not hinder.

  Jehovah's Witnesses have trumpeted the child abuse problem in the Catholic Church. These articles, which look down their nose and then pronounce judgment on another religion smack of arrogance and hypocrisy. While I have little sympathy with the Catholic Church, at the very least they are not guilty of excommunicating victims' families who tried to report an abusive priest.

  Big Tex you took my sentence out of context I was saying that if a person was accused of this a second time and their was no proof and the police couldnt do anything and the elders had no proof IT DOESNT MATTER BECAUSE WEATHER THERE IS PROOF OR NOT THE PERSON WILL NOT SERVE IN ANY CONG EVER AGAIN it shows a pattern. This is our ploicy.

  My apologies. At the risk of taking you out of context again, may I say you present quite a lot of conditions for a pedophile to lose his status.

  Again I'll say, it baffles me why elders want to get involved in such a complex and delicate matter. Keep the congregation "clean" fine, but if you counsel victims to "wait on Jehovah", why don't you "wait on the law" and let trained professionals determine guilt or innocence? You've mentioned the possibility of the law making a mistake, however may I say that I have more confidence in the legal system coming to the correct determination than a bunch of poorly trained, inexperienced men who judge the world through the narrow prism of Watchtower philosphy.

  You keep saying you wouldn't let elders stop you from going to the police. Good for you, I wouldn't either. But again, for emphasis, it has happened. And that the Society has not addressed the problem only allows it happen again, and again. Blame whomever you want, but in the meantime there are sick and evil men who are hurting innocents. If you, or other Witnesses, are willing to blame the Catholic Church for the individual child abusers, then you and your organization must also accept blame for your child abusers that are still running loose.
• 

  Nosferatu

  Maybe its just me but a can't see a parent letting the elders stop them from going to the police.

  There's something here that's missing; how the child is seeing everything. This doesn't always have to do with the parents and the police. Sometimes, it has to do with the elders and the child.

  There are many typical abuse cases where the abuser threatens the victim if they tell anybody about what has happened. As the child gets older, the abuse still affects them. When the child (not the parent) finally reaches out for help from the elders (instead of the parents who may also be the abusers), the child gets shot down and the elders defend the abuser because of his spirituality, his age, his status, etc. Trust me, I've been through it.

  This doesn't help the child. This makes things worse. The child was taught to trust the elders with anything all their life. The only authority the child knows of is the elders. Sure they're aware of the police, but they need to keep things inside Jehovah's organization to avoid bringing reproach among his name. They need to set a good example to the worldly in hope that maybe one bible study is started because of the JWs good conduct and trouble-free life.
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  shamus

  But I have a hard time beleaving that every time parents go to the police they will be disfellowshiped.

  Who told you that?

  I am having a hard time believing that you honestly believed that statement. Or could this just be 'another scenario' in your mind?
• 

  shadow

  I have personal knowledge of a case where child told parents (father an elder). First call made was to a therapist. Therapist called police. Then elders were called. Elders did call Legal Dept. Parents would not permit, nor did elders ask to speak to child until after advised by therapist.

  Never even a hint of suggestion that this course was inappropriate.
• 

  shadow

  Disclaimer:

  No dispute that many cases seriously screwed up and WT policy was more concerned with image than children.

  Just trying to correct some misinformation.