JWs have more good points than bad

by lsw1961 183 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Ucantnome

    In the publication, The Nations Shall Know That I Am Jehovah-How? (WTB&TS 1971) page 61 it asks the question 'Whom could the real "chariot of Jehovah's organization roll up to and confront that He might bestow upon this qualified one the commission to speak as a prophet in the name of Jehovah?'

    and it appears on page 66. to be not Christendom but 'the anointed proclaimers of the heavenly kingdom of God... commissioned to speak to all the nations in His name.'

    On the previous page it tells me.

    "They recognized the real kingdom of God had been established in the hands of Jesus Christ in 1914, and now more vigorously than ever they undertook to preach it 'in all the inhabited earth for a witness to all the nations.' They did so with the additional help of The Golden Age (now the magazine Awake)"

    As the Watchtower I quoted from in 1968 shows them to be doing this in 197 lands and islands. The Awake magazine on the inside front cover at one point carried this as to why it was published.

    ,Most importantly, 'Awake' builds confidence in the Creator's promise of a peaceful and secure new order within our generation.,

    In the book "Man's Salvation Out Of World Distress At Hand" (WTB&TS 1975) on page 29 it says.

    "After all that we have gone through since 1914, our generation would be, of all generations the "most to be pitied".Think of it, though! Worthy ones of this generation of mankind will be saved alive out of the rest of this world distress so as to survive the worst of it and enter into God's Messianic new system of things and not need a resurrection from the dead to life on earth! This is a valid hope well founded on what was said by Jesus Christ..."

    (bold mine)

    This is referring to 1 Corinthians 15:18,19 where the apostle Paul is talking about the resurrection of Jesus and it therefore tied to this from (Man's Salvation Out Of World Distress At Hand. (1975,WTBTS page 48)

    'The glorification of Jesus Christ in heaven after his extraordinary sufferings as a man on earth was good news, Gospel, Evangel. “Nevertheless,” writes the apostle Paul with special reference to his own people , “they did not all obey the good news. For Isaiah says: ‘Jehovah, who put faith in the thing heard from us?” So faith follows the thing heard, In turn the thing heard is through the word about Christ” –Romans 10:16,17'

    His resurrection and glorification was good news.

    The reason I am showing this is to show that this 'They proclaim the good news that the millennial rule of Christ will begin with this generation' was part of the good news and when Paul says this at Romans 10

    Nevertheless, they did not all obey the good news. For Isaiah says: “Jehovah who has put faith in the thing heard from us?17 So faith follows the thing heard (NWT)

    and Man's Salvation Out Of World Distress At Hand. 1975,WTBTSpage 48 says this

    'In the face of the relatively small proportion of the world’s population that has put faith in the “thing heard” from us or proclaimed by us, it can truthfully be said: “They did not all obey the good news.”'

    and the good news is from God it wasn't something that was just in the mind,

    As the generation teaching was linked to the resurrection teaching of Christ here"Man's Salvation Out Of World Distress At Hand" (WTB&TS 1975) on page 29 to me it would be as if Paul after saying what he said in 1Cor. 15 later changed his teaching, if the generation teaching was changed and it wasn't shown to be true, but Paul says in 1Cor. 15:13-15

    13 if, indeed, there is no resurrection of the dead, then Christ has not been raised up. 14 But if Christ has not been raised up, our preaching is certainly in vain, and your faith is also in vain. Moreover, we are also found to be false witnesses of God, because we have given witness against God by saying that he raised up the Christ,.. (NWT)

    For me it calls into question whether they were commissioned in 1919 and I believe one of the first things they had was a campaign Millions now living will never die my grandfather was alive at that time and lived a long life and died of old age related problems almost 40 years ago.

    Isa1961 we can all imagine a lot of things in our mind but having faith in what God's mouthpiece is saying is different.

  • Ucantnome

    So good points and bad points. How they are paid at Bethel to me means little

    I didn't leave because of the change in the generation teaching. I had already left.

    The idea behind my stand is that first you live out your faith by creating the New World in your mind. Then it does not matter when God’s Kingdom is going to come.

    in my view it does if you have preached when it would come by and said you are God's mouthpiece and expect people to have faith in what you have preached.

  • Bonsai


    If you are so happy,

    if you are so content,

    why are you here?

    Half your sentence structures don't make any sense.

    Are you here to blow your trumpet? Are you here to show off your righteousness?

    I suspect you are here just to run the gauntlet to see if your faith holds up.

    I suspect you are counting your time.

    It doesn't seem like you are interested in change. It seems like you are entirely satisfied with the status quo.

    if you serve happily as an elder despite knowing of the injustices and abuse going on within this organization, then...

    I'm at a loss for words...

  • adjusted knowledge
    adjusted knowledge

    Equal monthly pay to all members of the Bethel community regardless of whether they are BC members or sweepers. This is something that still remains as an unattainable dream for the world. But JWs have successfully done it in all their Offices throughout the world for over a century. This is no insignificant accomplishment as this has the potential to solve virtually all the problems of the world.

    After reading this drivel I read no further..... Mixing of Marxism with JW Theology yes that will solve all the world's problems

  • OzGirl

    I was criticised for watching the Dateline program on the two witness rule used to cover up the pedophile problem in the WT. I was told that this was an "apostate lie."

    Geoffrey Jackson gave testimony to the Australian Royal Commission and said that the WT uses the two witness rule to handle child abuse.

    If there is no such thing as a pedophile cover up, how can Geoffrey Jackson be making the same statement as the so called "apostates?"

  • Frazzled UBM
    Frazzled UBM

    I am not sure there is a lot to be gained by quibbling with ISJW1961 about whether there are some good points in JW dogma - it is uncontroversial that the principle 'do onto others as you would have them do to you' is a good starting point for any moral code. The debate about Bethel pay seems to be a big distraction. The real argument is where the balance lies and to help ISJW1961 see how far the balance is weighted to the negative.

    ISJW1961 - I noticed that you have not responded to my post. I know you are busy responding to others but I would appreciate if you have time if you could respond to my post a couple of days ago. I woudl be itnerested to hear your perspective ont he issues I raise. Thanks Frazzled

  • lsw1961

    If you watch only the last scene of a movie, there is a possibility that you may mistake the hero as the villain. Similarly, if you have read only last verse of my last reply, you may end up calling me self-righteous. [It was my reply to the question whether I really believe in the promised New World, to which I replied: I am already in the New World as I have brought change in my mind as a first step. Everything begins in the mind first. And what is going on in the mind is more important. For example, people may be enjoying a movie; but you may not be enjoying the movie if your mind is wandering somewhere else. That means physical presence matters not, but where the mind is matters]

    Now even if I am trying to be self-righteous as you accuse me of, what do I gain by that? We are not going to have any contact with each other, and you will never know where I am, and so on.

    The spirit of all my replies is actually to the contrary—I was saying one can still be among JWs choosing to believe whatever he likes to believe rather than going for a confrontation with JW leadership proving to be self-righteous. I myself is the example. I do not believe everything JWs teach, but I keep it to myself without publicizing what I believe and what I do not, thus do not disturb the peace of the community. I believe New World will come, and the ones who lead New World life now will qualify to inherit New World. New World life means what? Jesus himself has made it absolutely clear in Mathew 25:31-40. If one does this, all other JW teachings are unimportant.

  • Ucantnome

    I keep it to myself without publicizing what I believe and what I do not, thus do not disturb the peace of the community.

    I agree with you.

    However, I have found that on quite a few occasions some Witnesses have insisted on talking about their beliefs with me.

    One elder when I first had a problem with the beliefs came to my house unexpectedly and I asked due to having small children if he could call later or we might make another arrangement to meet insisted with doing it there and then which we did but he didn't come into the house.

    Another time some years after I had stopped attending and one of my children wished to go to the hall I took them. At one of the meetings an elder came up to speak with us and explained some of his beliefs then pointing at me he said 'you don't want to listen to him' My child was only just 16 and living in my house.

  • azor
    ISW1961 have you reviewed jwfacts.com or any of the YouTube videos I recommended?
  • Diogenesister
    See how correctly Albert Einstein identified the problem: “We experience ourselves, our thoughts and feelings as something separate from the rest, a kind of optical delusion of consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison for us, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few persons nearest to us.” Bible too says: "Widen out."

    Love that quote ISW 1961 thank you for sharing😀

    Please please don't be offended by some posts here believe me they only fear for your physical & emotional safety💕❤❤❤

    Lee Elder is/was a respected elder who, with other hospital Liason Commitee Jehovahs Witnesses started 'Associated Jehovahs witnesses for Reform On Blood' to lobby for change & to educate regarding the Watchtower confused dangerous doctrine on blood.

    I urge you tocheck out their site. That witnesses may now use fractions is largely down to their ceaseless canvasing. Please take care & do not refuse blood transfusions for you or your family should it be nesessary! The command is to abstain from eating blood - transfusions are not nutrients, they are not food. White & red blood cells are exchanged between mother &baby via placenta too which is the reasoning behind why they accept some fractions - so why not red cells too?!

    All the best & keep researching !

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