I understand your separating yourselves from the Org...BUT~

by Revealed 83 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • MeanMrMustard

    I guess I'll be more straightforward with my objection to the OP:

    Revealed, you say that "understand" separating ourselves from the org .... BUT are confused as to why we might have left God and his son.

    First, in your view, since you understand, what would it look like, practically, to leave the WT, and yet not "leave God and his son"? What would that person believe?

  • smiddy3

    I seperated myself from Jehovah`s Witnesses ,God , and the Bible, because of what the Bible reveals about what sort of being God is.

    If it really is Gods word , then her/his own words condemn him / her .

  • Rivergang


    And I have read the bloody thing from cover to cover - which proved to be the greatest disappointment of the lot!

  • Revealed

    Very good! At least you gave it you best!

    Because of Adam & Eve's rebellion, mankind had a primitive and corrupt start.

    The Bible shows that- as well as archaeology.

    Unlike every other writing of human history, the faults of even the most revered individuals is shown,

    The brief accounts often left pieces out- but then if included would have made it impossibly long,

    Science and history go hand it hand- except when getting far back in time!

  • Vanderhoven7


    Here is a guy named Mack who left the Org and kept his faith

    "I am a former Jehovah’s Witness. I didn’t lose my faith, for my faith was never in the organization. Perhaps I was an unusual Witness in that respect.

    My faith was in the Creator. He was still with me, and I with him, after leaving the Witness organization.

    Dissociating myself from a corrupt and abusive religion is nothing like losing my faith.

    My faith was stressed perhaps, but not lost. It was stressed because of my false belief in the lies Jehovah’s Witnesses conditioned me to accept, including the one that they are God’s unique representative on Earth, and that leaving them meant leaving him.

    I saw for many years how much suffering their lies cause. I struggled to understand how God could use such a corrupt organization.

    But it was the Creator himself, in answer to a prayer, who guided me to leave the Witnesses. If they were the unique representatives of God, as they claim to be, then he would not have done that.

    My exit and recovery began suddenly one day when I got a sign from the Creator that I should leave the Witnesses. That sign told me they were not “his people” after all. That was the day in 1997 that my recovery from a 28-year nightmare began.

    In retrospect, it is obvious, for “God is love” (1 John 4:8), but the Witnesses condemn unconditional love, and there is no other kind. Conditional love isn’t love at all—it’s just approval.

    Faith retained, freedom gained."

  • truth_b_known

    The Gregorian calendar is not evidence of Jesus existence. The Romans made the Julian calendar and it was later modified into the Gregorian calendar. The Romans were the world empire of the day. They imposed the calendar on the world they controlled just as the they imposed Christianity as the official state religion. Probably because the Romans invented Christianity.

    The argument that Jesus did exist because of a calendar that is based on his alleged birth is just that - an argument. That is the fallacy of apologetics - it's not evidence, but just an argument.

    True faith is letting go of beliefs and accepting truth as you experience it. Belief is a highly venerated opinion that one clings to in spite of any evidence that proves it false.

    Not to switch the topic, but I would like to make it clear that just because there is no evidence in Jesus' existence does it mean there is no value in the Gospels or being a follower of Christ. Jesus didn't say a whole lot, but the things he did teach are profound.

    Look at Matthew 6: 25-34 -

    25 “Therefore I tell you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or drink; or about your body, what you will wear. Is not life more than food, and the body more than clothes?26Look at the birds of the air; they do not sow or reap or store away in barns, and yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not much more valuable than they?27Can any one of you by worrying add a single hour to your life?
    28 “And why do you worry about clothes? See how the flowers of the field grow. They do not labor or spin.29Yet I tell you that not even Solomon in all his splendor was dressed like one of these.30If that is how God clothes the grass of the field, which is here today and tomorrow is thrown into the fire, will he not much more clothe you—you of little faith?31So do not worry, saying, ‘What shall we eat?’ or ‘What shall we drink?’ or ‘What shall we wear?’32For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them.33But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well.34Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own.

    "Can any one of you by worrying add one hour to your life?"

    Wow! Powerful words to live by. In fact, neuroscience has come to the realization of the power of mindfulness - being in the present moment. However, modern Christians seem to completely miss this. Christians are full of anxiety these day. Why? Because people are leaving the church and, if someone loses their faith, maybe they will lose their faith too.

    How would it affect you if you were presented with undeniable evidence that there never was a Jesus?


  • waton
    Science and history go hand it hand- except when getting far back in time!

    R: Everything we receive is from the past, even sunlight which is 500 seconds old. Biblical "history" is not accurate messages, but hilarious stories from the past. such as: The planet Earth created in the Beginning with the "heavens", or like Eve, cloned from Adam.

    Life is greater than the caricatures that the bible and the wt Bible, & tract Society inc. has made of it.
    for you.

  • Revealed

    Mr V- I really appreciated that reference! I feel somewhat differently, however.

    I realize that Israel underwent changes, and they are too. After all, they were responsible for me learning the TRUTH, despite their misconceptions. Now that being said; they dumbed by the translation, the meetings, and caved in to the government propaganda.

    So, I wait for the day when they are faithful again...

  • TD

    don't personally believe acceptance of the flood story is necessary for one to be Christian (Because the moral lesson of a story is no less real when it is clearly allegorical, symbolic or mythological..)

    --No more so than the idea that the antediluvian world was entirely vegetarian

    When people say these stories, as they are told in the Pentateuch, are scientifically impossible, it's not just coffee talk.

    For example, humans have driven enough species to the brink of extinction that we know what it takes to bring them back via captive breeding programs. With higher mammals it takes in the neighborhood of 30 individuals, provided there is enough genetic diversity to start with. Even then, records have to be kept so that the pairings can be carefully selected, deformities have to be weeded out, and the offspring must be immunized because within a few generations they will be so closely related that a disease that kills one could kill them all.

    This is not speculative. There are entire books on the subject based on direct experience.

    With humans, this problem is multiplied 10 fold; not only because it is not in our nature to accept that level of control, but because we are less tolerant to inbreeding than any other species. That's why humans all over earth developed such elaborate marriage customs. That's why Native American tribes kidnapped and/or traded for wives from other tribes. That's why Aboriginal peoples divided their tribes into moieties and marriages had to take place across moiety lines. Without these or equivalent customs, indigenous populations simply did not last and again, there are entire books on the subject.

    The idea of an animal population going down to a single breeding pair is ridiculous. The idea of the human population going down to three viable couples is even more ridiculous, especially when the three males were all brothers.

  • Revealed

    TD- those were PRE-historic times.

    The fact that there was an original man & woman is confirmed by genetics, I believe, and is just a matter of common sense. But you're statement " The idea of an animal population going down to a single breeding pair is ridiculous" is so TRUE!

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