Polytheism - Jehovah has same status as other gods

by Sirona 117 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • funkyderek
    funkyderek
    Funky your either nieve (sic) or dishonest

    Naive perhaps, but I don't think so. I'm certainly not dishonest and I'm baffled as to why you think I am.

    You have presupositions and assumptions that you start off with also.

    Like your start with the notion that the claims of Christ are a bunch of crap, and this is before you look at any evidence.

    I didn't start with that notion. I came to that opinion (or a similar one, less crudely stated) because of the evidence.

    Do you see the difference between the presuppositionalist approach (you believe in Christ because you pre-suppose him to be real) and the evidential approach (I looked at the evidence for Christ's claims and existence, and found that they did not correspond with objectively measurable reality). I may be wrong, and if further evidence comes my way, I may be compelled to change my mind, whereas you can never change your mind because your opinion is based on presupposition, not evidence.

  • Sirona
    Sirona
    Why should you care about polythiesm?

    JR, why should any of us care? LOL. Some of us like to talk about our beliefs, thats all.

    Or any discorse on the objective truth or reallity of any of theism. To you your god is like Mr. Potato Man a silly little god you get out of a toy box which you fasion after your likes. Or to put it another way your god is like a McDonalds Big Mac made to order just the way you want (hold the onions, extra mayo)

    mmmm McDonalds. Yum.

    I don't "fashion" gods, but yes, I think you might just be understanding something about what I said. I said that our human way of interpreting God(s) has to be something we can as humans 1. experience with senses available to us and 2. comprehend with our feeble human minds.

    Those in the bible who saw God in vision as an old man sitting on a throne in heaven were seeing THEIR INTERPRETATION of what/who God is. The Bible says god is a spirit, so in fact God is not in entirety an old man with a white beard - that is just a symbol that we can understand. A spirit as far as we know it is formless, but is energy / power.

    If you were an alien with 10 eyes and 6 legs (and twelve yapping mouths, in your case) then you'd see your God as an alien with 10 eyes and 6 legs.

    Anyway, stop trying to hijack my thread with your shallow and ill thought-out arguments.

    Sirona

  • Sirona
    Sirona

    Seedy,

    I too think we can "tap into" this energy. How does that mean I'm not Pantheist? What word describes your belief?

    Sirona

  • clash_city_rockers
    clash_city_rockers

    Funky writes:

    I looked at the evidence for Christ's claims and existence, and found that they did not correspond with objectively measurable reality)

    First your interpratation of any evidence is flawed be cause you already set your peramaters of interpratation to reject any evidence from Christ, Your problem was that same as the Rich Man's brothers that Christ said to the Rich man.

    Luke 16:27-31

    27 "He answered, 'Then I beg you, father, send Lazarus to my father's house, 28 for I have five brothers. Let him warn them, so that they will not also come to this place of torment.'
    29 "Abraham replied, 'They have Moses and the Prophets; let them listen to them.'
    30 " 'No, father Abraham,' he said, 'but if someone from the dead goes to them, they will repent.'
    31 "He said to him, 'If they do not listen to Moses and the Prophets, they will not be convinced even if someone rises from the dead.' "

    The lost have evidence but that doesn't save them. Your assuming that faith comes though human accomplishment (evidential and human reason) this was the error of Palageus. Even though Faith in Christ is the most logical and reasonable thing the noetic effects of our sin (through the fall) clowds our minds to eccepted this reasonable truth. Believing only comes by grace. Grace from God enables man to believe the gospel.

    As for:

    correspond with objectively measurable reality

    Are you talking in the same catagories as David Hume?

    Sirona,

    God is not Fasioned after the imaginations of man nor by his hands. God is TRANSENDENT!

    Your god is some sort of cut and paste project out of the immaganations of your heart.

    Listen to Paul at Mars hill

    Acts 17:22-33

    22 Paul then stood up in the meeting of the Areopagus and said: "Men of Athens! I see that in every way you are very religious. 23 For as I walked around and looked carefully at your objects of worship, I even found an altar with this inscription:|sc TO AN UNKNOWN GOD. Now what you worship as something unknown I am going to proclaim to you.
    24 "The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples built by hands. 25 And he is not served by human hands, as if he needed anything, because he himself gives all men life and breath and everything else. 26 From one man he made every nation of men, that they should inhabit the whole earth; and he determined the times set for them and the exact places where they should live. 27 God did this so that men would seek him and perhaps reach out for him and find him, though he is not far from each one of us. 28 'For in him we live and move and have our being.' As some of your own poets have said, 'We are his offspring.'
    29 "Therefore since we are God's offspring, we should not think that the divine being is like gold or silver or stone--an image made by man's design and skill. 30 In the past God overlooked such ignorance, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent. 31 For he has set a day when he will judge the world with justice by the man he has appointed. He has given proof of this to all men by raising him from the dead." 32 When they heard about the resurrection of the dead, some of them sneered, but others said, "We want to hear you again on this subject." 33 At that, Paul left the Council. 34 A few men became followers of Paul and believed. Among them was Dionysius, a member of the Areopagus, also a woman named Damaris, and a number of others.

    cheers,

    jr

  • clash_city_rockers
    clash_city_rockers

    Funky,

    Evidentialism wont save you if anything it will make you look more and more foolish as you are exposed as someone who is less and less reasonalble.

    If I give you pressupositional apologetics all I am doing is pointing you to Jesus Christ by means of faith and repentance. Delivering the Holy Spirit to you by means of the Word of God the Bible

    chers,

    jr

  • clash_city_rockers
    clash_city_rockers

    Funky,

    Evidentialism won't save you if anything it will make you look more and more foolish as you are exposed as someone who is less and less reasonalble and intellegable.

    If I give you pressupositional apologetics all I am doing is pointing you to Jesus Christ by means of faith and repentance. Delivering the Holy Spirit to you by means of the Word of God the Bible

    chers,

    jr

  • clash_city_rockers
    clash_city_rockers

    Tap into the panthiestic any way you wan't have it your way the Force

    Luke has been working out so watch out he might kick your #@%&*#% if you make fun of the force

  • funkyderek
    funkyderek
    Evidentialism won't save you if anything it will make you look more and more foolish as you are exposed as someone who is less and less reasonalble and intellegable.

    But amazingly, only to you. To almost everyone else, the reasonable conclusion is the one best supported by the evidence. Indeed, it's hard to see how you could call someone reasonable or intelligent if they based their beliefs on anything other than the available evidence.

    If I give you pressupositional apologetics all I am doing is pointing you to Jesus Christ by means of faith and repentance. Delivering the Holy Spirit to you by means of the Word of God the Bible

    But what's the difference between presupposing the existence of Jesus (and all that goes with it) and presupposing the existence of Allah, or Luke Skywalker, or the Invisible Pink Unicorn?

  • funkyderek
    funkyderek

    I bet Luke Skywalker can kick his ass!

  • Reborn2002
    Reborn2002

    Undoubtedly Jehovah has the same status as other gods. (note the lower case "g", I do not believe invisible, imaginary beings warrant my respect)

    It all depends on an individual's environment. It depends on what culture or religion you were subjected to.

    god? To which do you refer? Jehovah? Yahweh? Allah? Buddha? Krishna? Zeus? Ra?

    All of them are credited with performing miracles by millions of people who followed them over a period of generations.

    None of them can prove it.

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