What were Satan and his demons "doing" up in heaven, before being "cast down" in 1914?

by Dunedain 62 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Fisherman
    Fisherman

    The Lord's prayer, spoken in the first century by Jesus, is an acknowledgement that God's will had already been completed in heaven.

    That is your interpretation and conclusion. I disagree that God's will was being done in heaven in an absolute sense before Satan is kicked out and that event had not occured when Jesus uttered those words. Compare Rev 1:1 (soon) with Rev 12:7,8. It was not God's will (for one thing) for Satan to reside in heaven, (his activities there, converting angels to demons, etc.and as my previous post explains) and that is why God had him kicked out. In a relative sense, God's will was being done on earth when Jesus prayed to God for the cup to pass him but it did not as it was also being done in heaven when God manipulated events so that Jesus could come to earth and save mankind. God's will is being done in heaven in an absolute sense when God becomes king and that happens after Jesus died loyal, is resurrected, exalted, becomes the Messianic king in heaven and that had not happened when Jesus said the Lords prayer. The basis of ousting Satan if you take the time to read the book of Revelation is the blood of the lamb and there was no basis when Jesus said the Lords prayer because the Lamb had not died faithful to God yet. READ REv 12:10

    Anyway, that is what it seems to me. Just my opinion.

  • jookbeard
    jookbeard

    the longer I've been out of this craziness the harder it is to wrap my head around this story, there are too many hows and whys?

    how and why did angels transform themselves in literal human type bodies and copulate with the women on the earth they found attractive? this is meant to be a literal event yet goes beyond the boundaries and imagination of the most ludicrous scfi book or movie

    why are humans caught up in the crossfire over this bet between the creator and the devil? haven't humans had it hard enough for the last 5000 years? isnt it time to give us break at long last, is God pissing himself laughing in his voyeuristic sick perverted realm all these years?

    Why couldn't Satan and his buddies be dispatched to some far flung part of the universe to play their dick waving game with the Creator and leave mankind to get on with their own lives, why keep bothering mankind in these dick waving games, we're not interested any more and our interest faded very quickly after the flood.

    Believers,Theists keep on waving the carrot that the end is close and the sovereignty issue is soon to be resolved! well how much longer !

    This event loses more ad more credibility as each year passes , I wonder how much longer it can be believed?

  • paradisebeauty
    paradisebeauty

    good point. It is not like the demons dominated the heavens before 1914.... their doctrine for 1914 has no basis

    1914 was just a year wen a war on earth started. Nothing to do with God's kingdom.

  • atomant
    atomant
    How stupid this whole situation has become (if its true) we might be in a matrix.Heres satan in the heavens converting angels to demons (how dumb ass must the angels be)? and god is worried because one third have already been converted so he thinks shit l better do something before l lose the lot (then what) so he casts the demons to the earth to harass mankind even more thereby cleansing the heavens. What about the poor suckers (humans)on the earth.We didnt ask for any of this shit.But god with his infinite wisdom and endless compassion and love thought what the hell let the human infidels suffer in their jocks so l can have some well earnt peace and quiet up here for a while and watch the show from above. lf god really can see into the future youve got to ask yourself why did he bother? Surely there could have been a better way.
  • Diogenesister
    Diogenesister

    Good point about the Lords Prayer..." As in heaven". So how could there be a war..or any shenanigans ( converting angels, job etc )without Gods approval???

    Atomant well summed up.

  • Fisherman
    Fisherman

    Whether or not what the Bible records is true or whether or not 1914 is the date when war broke out in the heavens does not change that the Bible says so.

    without Gods approval???

    There is a difference between allowing something to happen and approving of something to happen because you do not stop it. You can think of some examples on your own (if you can think.) But here is one example: You discover that your house has become infected with cockroaches. You can immediately set fire to your house or you can call an exterminator and wait until he comes over and wages war with those little devils -either way the roaches' activities ain't your will.

    Whether or not something seems crazy to you, or you whether or not you understand it from your your point of view or from the facts that you have at hand does not change if from being true if it happens to be the case. You just do not know.

    What did Jesus mean in the Lord's prayer? He certainly did not mean that he approved of any of Satan's activities on earth or in heaven.

    Surely there could have been a better way.

    Maybe you should be God and do things your way or in a way that suits YOU. There are a lot of factors at play that make up the nature of reality. Maybe if you were God, you would not have created roaches to begin with? Sounds smart to you? But you are not God, and God in his Al-mightiness and All Knowingness surely has his reasons for doing things the way he pleases.

  • Fisherman
    Fisherman

    good point. It is not like the demons dominated the heavens before 1914

    Try living in the same house with vermin.

  • tor1500
    tor1500

    Hi All,

    Matt. 28:18:Jesus approached and spoke to them, saying: “All authority has been given me in heaven and on the earth". That was way before 1914, & maybe that's when Satan was tossed out of Heaven forever...God didn't want Satan & Jesus in the same space. It's difficult to really know from the bible because it's written where at times you can't figure if some things are written for the future or the past...Did the war in heaven break out already or in the future, & if in the future, than Satan is still going back and forth from Heaven & Earth....

    Tor

  • Fisherman
    Fisherman

    Jesus answered him: “You would have no authority over me at all unless it had been granted to you from above."

    Jesus did not have any power to use his authority when he was held captive in death for 3 days needing a resurrection.

    God entrusted Jesus with all authority as Jesus said at that time, but Jesus did not have the power to exercise it all until after he died loyal and resurrected and in kingdom power. Fact is they killed him -authority and all. As a human creature Jesus certainly did not have the power at that time

    Authority involves the duties that are delegated to an individual while power is the possession of control that allows an individual to influence the actions of others.

    But even in-spite of having both power and authority, there also exists other factors why a person does not use it. God has both and he did not immediately burn down the house.

    You need to think a little bit instead of making wild guesses about everything.

  • Mephis
    Mephis

    Being bitten by a radioactive spider to get Spider powers, that I can understand. An eternal superbeing of infinite power needing to be crucified by the Romans before he can do anything? Not so much.

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