I can see them selling the Avon lake hall it only had 1 congregation with avg.att.of around 40 pubs. But the berea and seven hills had 2 vibrant congregations each. so there is no excuse to upend 400 publishers and kick them out. How desperate must the org. Be to have to do this?!
Congregation Reassignments in Ohio?
How desperate must the org. Be to have to do this?!
They are in existential crisis. It’s not clear if KH sales will be enough to reverse the situation. Selling KHs will bring in some quick money, but it will also result in a pretty swift reduction in donations. They are on a downward spiral, and the amazing thing is that the financial cost of settling abuse cases is bound to get much worse before it gets any better. If they are already in this much trouble, is there much chance the organisation can survive this crisis?
slimboyfat - "Closing KHs is an absolute disaster for morale and long term growth."
I'm inclined to agree.
But since, IMO, the Org actually wants to pare down the rank-and-file to a more manageable size, it's all good. Anything that makes it easier for the fakers, faders, and fence-sitters to WTexit.
And since when has "morale" ever really been a factor?
I don’t think the GB would ever voluntarily lose membership or contract their presence if they had any other option. If there was any possibility of growing and remaining afloat they would pursue it full on. The idea that you can have a controlled decline of the religion is probably a bit like trying to have a controlled fire in a barn full of hay. Anyone stupid enough to attempt it will soon have a pile of ashes for their trouble. Because loss of morale can take on a decisive downward trajectory of its own and declines can compound before you know it. Credibility, once lost, can be difficult to impossible to regain.
Plus as former Witnesses I think there is a tendency to overstate the strategic prowess of the GB. If it looks like they are presiding over an incompetent almighty mess, then that’s probably because that’s exactly what it is. Arguing that it’s really part of some ingenious strategic plan is just another variety of exceptionalism akin to the pedestal of “faithful and discreet slave”.
Vid - if they're MO is to run off more people they get a gold star! They must not be too worried about money - I realize there are a few 'haves' that contribute in a big way but seems the 'have-nots' would give their dollar bills here and there and more in that boat than ones that are affluent.
WOW - it's interesting.
They are in serious trouble. I told you so. (Where’s Morph?)
Ahh another day, another collapse thread.
You take anecdotal evidance regarding some local halls being sold and take that as a broad spectrum referendum on all things jw while at the same time ignoring facts that contradict your preordained conclusion .
A lot of halls have been sold. That is a fact. Its certainly happened in the washington dc area... but it hasnt hurt moral on bit. They plod on. They sustain the small growth. They realease the revised nwt in new languages.
I applaude your efforts to see gloom and doom and ignore the reality but it is reality: they arnt dying, they are changing.
If it looks like they are presiding over an incompetent almighty mess, then that’s probably
because that’s exactly what it is.
Well, when you promote people to leadership roles based, not on competence, intelligence, ability, or anything like that, and instead base it primarily on "spiritual qualifications", that's what you get.
An organization of guys who can make slick comments a Watchtower study, and have an uncanny ability to memorize arcana from the organization's "literature", but who wouldn't last 2 weeks in any position above "mailroom clerk" in a "worldly" corporation.
Eventually you start to run out of the mildly competent "spiritual men" as the organization grows and relentlessly punishes originality and creativity in its lower ranks. And you get - what? "An incompetent almighty mess".
Morph do you really still believe that?
“Some local Halls”? Why the weasel words? Every Hall is “local”, right? Try hundreds of KHs that are being sold in lots of different countries. And those are just the ones we’ve heard about!
Yes they are changing alright. They are in a period of swift transition from a functioning worldwide religion into...
Why is your faith in the organisational and strategic abilities of Watchtower so implacable? That the idea that the current mess is truly as bad as it looks is not an option for you?
It's not a collapse thread but all opinions re/WT's method of madness/future are interesting. Without a crystal ball re/cults in the equation, it's great to hear/watch their new business model develop.
I challenge you to cite any evidence of “hundreds of kingdom halls in lots of different countries”.
Also i have no particular faith in their strategic ablities and i suspect they bumble along. Im simply being realistic about the facts and not superimposing a desire the org fall apart.