Ayahuasca / DMT.... anyone else curious? (page 4)

Viviane

If you cant handle life without a drug there is an underlying problem .

False dichotomy is false.

It is hard to decribe what happens to you on ayahuasca, other that the mind get energized and you have visions and dreams. The results for the better seem to happen after one has time to sort of process the experience. In my case even years latter.

Some confusion too, as I think your finding old programs and making new more effective programs to use in the psyche. Not a very good explaination I know but it the only way I can discribe it so many years after the fact.

Here is a link to some stuff I posted about this subject years ago.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/134500/1/The-Psychedelic-Mind#.U0_tAvldUWY

Band on the Run

As a child of the sixties, it is better to not do it. My college profs. dropped acid with Timothy Leary at Harvard. The Witnesses led me to believe I was losing my mind. They preached and I hated it. Everyone else adored it. One prof in a major lecture hall told us to do cocaine bc it was not addictive. I lived through drug times. I never met anyone trasnformed by a drug experience. Later in life, I met many one time drug fiends who had permanent brain damage. One person was taking a battery of tests at a major teaching hospital to see if it could be reversed. A brain is precious.

On the other hand, I read a First Amendment Free Exercise case about some Native Americans in the Southwest. For countless generations, their ancestors and they used mescaline and peyote in sacred ceremonies. Their DNA must have been comfortable. I forget the exact state but the state did not mind. The Justice Department had placed these substances on a banned list with items like heroin. Some joker enforced it against the tribe. The Supreme Court said it was a legitimate use of the federal government's power and religion was not affected. It infuriated me. All they had to do was carve out a very small exception for this tribe's shamans. It was easy to establish which persons should be granted the exception. The decision ran along party nomination lines.

nonjwspouse

Katewild, from my understandong so far just readig this thread, it seems to create REM sleep or mimic it. If someone has trouble achieving REM sleep I would imagine it could be helpful for sleep. Otherwise, REM sleep is not restful. It is the cycle that creates dreams and that is not the restful phase. Narcoleptics have only REM sleep which causes the excessive daytime sleepiness. No restful sleep, so they are always sleepy.

frankiespeakin

I think Ayahuasca helps uncover your Shadow(Jungian) and reveal to you your dark surpressed side, sorta like facing your demons which causes these 'demons' to find a new home or IOW loose its power over you once you faced it. The supposedly chaotic cascade of thought paterns that emerge into consciousness durring and Ayahuasca session are just the tip of the iceberg as to what is happening in the unconscious part of our psyche. Seems that a sort of perhaps a hard drive defragging thingy happens, maybe a Norton's type thingy illustration to make a good analogy, hard to say. I think it helps the brain latter with better processing power, it may make one more whole as he learns to intergrate these denied aspects of one's self and so becomes more conscious, and more tolerant IMO.

Somethings can be eating away at us and because we supress it or use the natural defence of denial we don't know what it is perhaps some birth trama coming into the world or something we learned/thought virus/meme when we were a kid that is screwing with us now, so due to neural plasticity once some bad program is recognized an epiphany happens and the person may become born again(poor choice of words I know for some) or get a real good make over. A religous experience or mystical experience has some of the same effects, thus Jung once told his patient that he would never be cured of his addiction unless he had a similar type of experience.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meme

A meme ( / ˈ m iː m / meem ) [1] is "an idea, behavior, or style that spreads from person to person within a culture." [2] A meme acts as a unit for carrying cultural ideas, symbols, or practices that can be transmitted from one mind to another through writing, speech, gestures, rituals, or other imitable phenomena with a mimicked theme. Supporters of the concept regard memes as cultural analogues to genes in that they self-replicate, mutate, and respond to selective pressures. [3]

The word meme is a shortening (modeled on gene) of mimeme (from Ancient Greek μίμημα Greek pronunciation: [míːmɛːma] mīmēma, "imitated thing", from μιμεῖσθαι mimeisthai, "to imitate", from μῖμος mimos "mime") [4] and it was coined by the British evolutionary biologist Richard Dawkins in The Selfish Gene (1976) [1] [5] as a concept for discussion ofevolutionary principles in explaining the spread of ideas and cultural phenomena. Examples of memes given in the book included melodies, catch-phrases, fashion, and the technology of building arches. [6]

frankiespeakin

LSD and the treatment of Alcoholism:

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2012/03/120308224524.htm

Revisiting LSD as a treatment for alcoholism

Date: March 8, 2012 Source: SAGE Publications Summary:

Several decades ago, a number of clinics used LSD to treat alcoholism with some success. But until now, no research has pulled together the results of these trials to document exactly how effective LSD was. Now a new meta-analysis of randomized controlled trials of the drug provides evidence for a clear and consistent beneficial effect of LSD for treating alcohol dependency....

snare&racket

I really didn't want to go down this route, because this isn't a lecture, it is a chat.... but people are talking about these 'drugs' without realising it is a chemical reaction seen in many common medicines and interactions already.

People are imagining sitting in a room injecting or smoking this 'drug' with a dodgy, dangerous atmosphere painted and implications of runining your brain. BUT.. this is ignorany of the chemistry, we also already use sister molecules with psych issues, depression, ADHD, parkinsons, mood disorders, anxiety disorders. All these chemicals alter the seretonin (5HT) levels, they just do it different ways.

People keep giving anecdotal opinion about drug abuse, totally missing the point.

I am honestly interested in the visual and auditory hallucinations experienced, I think it can teach us much about such pathology as schizophrenia, something we know VERY, VERY little about.

Then there is the potential with such REM sleep disorders such as narcolepsy. Then there is the uses of a psychadelic as an anaesthetic experience, end of life management, palliatuive care.... NOT that there is currently any resear h in these areas..... which is my exact point.

Now back to the people who have experienced it.....

How long did it last? What did you see hear? Did you experience things outside of your own historical experiences or imagination? Could you still see, hear and interact with the world around you? Did you consciously realise it was a false experience?

frankiespeakin

If you manage to basify it and get a realitively pure amount say 30-50ml (matchhead size)in a glass pipe it is pretty instantanious, I've done 5meodmt and blasted off so intensly from normal state of consciousness to this undiscribable state that has great intensity, that last for about 10 to 5 minutes, touch down and walk ability say in 15 minutes and tremendous after glow feeling where your still able to speak in tongues and what not. About an hour and most effect are gone but a energectic type of inflated ego is the best way I could discribe it. It was scary and some times my hands would shake real bad when I was trying to fire up a big hit, so I would often clam my nerves with some good whiskey to keep the hand more steady and get the proper hit of this wonder Drug/medicine.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5-MeO-DMT

Yoppo snuff are rather hard to do as they involve a measure of pain from snorting about 4 beans mixed with white ash or pickleing lime. A good snort usually requires a good timming blower to help you get the finely ground admixture through out your sinus cavity. The trip last about 15 -30 minutes with a euphoric come down and a running burning nose. I remember seeing this intricate extremely shining Orb and then I was some other place with thoughts racing while peaking, and then becoming more empathetic and kind, once I had too much psychological shadow material come up and I went thru a Dark Night of the Soul, death seemed every where confronting me at every turn, suicide was contemplated and slowly got better and better and better to where I feel it was worth the experience even though negative.

snare&racket

Have you ever told your doctor about your use and experiences?

Apognophos

Please don't take this in an antagonistic manner, s&r... I'm just genuinely curious. You don't seem like the spiritual type, so why are you interested in experiencing the substance? You surely don't believe that you can actually learn something from a trip any more than you can learn something from a dream, right? As someone mentioned, it's not like we can trust advice that comes to us in a vision.

You mentioned that the substance can teach us about the brain, and that may be true, but I think that's an orthogonal statement to, "I would like to try it" because personal experiences are not very useful in scientific research. So are you curious personally, or curious scientifically? I feel like I'm getting a mixed message from your posts.

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To answer your OP question: nope, I'm not the least bit interested in trying it. The brain is a roiling mixture of animal desires with a big weight placed on top of them which could be called the super-ego and/or social conformity, which prevent us from acting on our desires. I have no interest in upsetting that balance and being not in my right mind for even a few minutes unless I'm tied down, nor do I want to risk damaging my chemical balance, as this study indicates can happen with marijuana: http://time.com/61940/recreational-pot-use-harmful-to-young-peoples-brains/.

Ayahuasca / DMT.... anyone else curious?

Revisiting LSD as a treatment for alcoholism

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