Water Fluoridation

by still thinking 136 Replies latest jw friends

  • still thinking
    still thinking

    AND YET these organizations are not advocating the end to water flouridation. Hmmm?

    Some people really are painful to talk to. Are you trying to tell me the ARE advocating water fluoridation?

    Or do you think they might just possibly be reporting the facts. And the FACTS don't stand up to what you are saying.

    You can see from their information that water fluoridation does NOT have the results claimed. And that worldwide fluridation really has had little or NO impact when compared to other countries that do not fluoridate at all. But then, I guess you just want to ignore THAT fact.

    And no one has claimed that chemicals companies make a huge profit getting rid of their toxic waste product in our water supplies, but they do make some money whilst getting rid of their toxic waste product in our water supplies. That's pretty convienient. So I'm not sure who you are trying to prove that too JeffT.

  • still thinking
    still thinking

    Ahhh hah. Are you familiar with the Military Industrial Complex? How about Smeddly Butler? Chevron in Niger, Dow in Bopal.....................the list goes on.

    Nope...nothing to see there Berengaria....just lazy stupid people....LOL

  • still thinking
    still thinking

    mP...I'm not even interested in debating the size of Hamilton with you. It is irrelevant.

  • mP


    good thing you did.

  • sammielee24

    Not having toxins put in your water should be a human right. It should be the right of all people to be able to drink water that is not purposely altered by artificial substances. Water is the basic food for life - why the heck should humans have the right to put junk in it because they can't take care of their own teeth themselves? So if half the population needs cholestral drugs are you okay with putting those drugs in the water so you can medicate everyone else? How about half the population that now faces type 2 diabetes - let's put drugs in the water and everyone can benefit. Fluoride is, if you believe the use for cavities, considered a medicinal substance? If that's the case, what right has anyone to medicate an entire population because a few people might need it? sammieswife


    Almost all of Europe has now removed fluoride from the water supply either dur to health concerns or has refused the attempts to place it in the water to begin with. In order to verify the fluoridation status, please click on the link for the original source document discussing the issue.

    European counties rejecting fluoride

    November 2004: After months of consulation, Scotland - which is currently unfluoridated - rejected plans to add fluoride to the nation's water.

    April 9, 2003: The City Parliament of Basel, Switzerland voted 73 to 23 to stop Basel's 41 year water fluoridation program. Basel was the only city in Switzerland to fluoridate its water, and the only city in continental western Europe, outside of a few areas in Spain.


    "Generally, in Germany fluoridation of drinking water is forbidden. The relevant German law allows exceptions to the fluoridation ban on application. The argumentation of the Federal Ministry of Health against a general permission of fluoridation of drinking water is the problematic nature of compuls[ory] medication." (Gerda Hankel-Khan, Embassy of Federal Republic of Germany, September 16, 1999).fluoridealert.org/germany.jpeg.


    "Fluoride chemicals are not included in the list [of 'chemicals for drinking water treatment']. This is due to ethical as well as medical considerations." (Louis Sanchez, Directeur de la Protection de l'Environment, August 25, 2000). fluoridealert.org/france.jpeg


    "This water treatment has never been of use in Belgium and will never be (we hope so) into the future. The main reason for that is the fundamental position of the drinking water sector that it is not its task to deliver medicinal treatment to people. This is the sole responsibility of health services." (Chr. Legros, Directeur, Belgaqua, Brussels, Belgium, February 28, 2000). fluoridation.com/c-belgium.htm.


    "Fluoride has never been added to the public water supplies in Luxembourg. In our views, the drinking water isn't the suitable way for medicinal treatment and that people needing an addition of fluoride can decide by their own to use the most appropriate way, like the intake of fluoride tablets, to cover their [daily] needs." (Jean-Marie RIES, Head, Water Department, Administration De L'Environment, May 3, 2000).www.fluoridealert.org/luxembourg.jpeg


    "We do not favor or recommend fluoridation of drinking water. There are better ways of providing the fluoride our teeth need." (Paavo Poteri, Acting Managing Director, Helsinki Water, Finland, February 7, 2000).www.fluoridation.com/c-finland.htm

    "Artificial fluoridation of drinking water supplies has been practiced in Finland only in one town, Kuopio, situated in eastern Finland and with a population of about 80,000 people (1.6% of the Finnish population). Fluoridation started in 1959 and finished in 1992 as a result of the resistance of local population. The most usual grounds for the resistance presented in this context were an individual's right to drinking water without additional chemicals used for the medication of limited population groups. A concept of "force-feeding" was also mentioned.

    Drinking water fluoridation is not prohibited in Finland but no municipalities have turned out to be willing to practice it. Water suppliers, naturally, have always been against dosing of fluoride chemicals into water."(Leena Hiisvirta, M.Sc., Chief Engineer, Ministry of Social Affairs and Health, Finland, January 12, 1996.)www.fluoridealert.org/finland.jpeg


    "We are pleased to inform you that according to the Danish Ministry of Environment and Energy, toxic fluorides have never been added to the public water supplies. Consequently, no Danish city has ever been fluoridated." (Klaus Werner, Royal Danish Embassy, Washington DC, December 22, 1999).

    "In Norway we had a rather intense discussion on this subject some 20 years ago, and the conclusion was that drinking water should not be fluoridated." (Truls Krogh & Toril Hofshagen, Folkehelsa Statens institutt for folkeheise (National Institute of Public Health) Oslo, Norway, March 1, 2000).www.fluoridation.com/c-norway.htm


    "Drinking water fluoridation is not allowed in Sweden...New scientific documentation or changes in dental health situation that could alter the conclusions of the Commission have not been shown." (Gunnar Guzikowski, Chief Government Inspector, Livsmedels Verket -- National Food Administration Drinking Water Division, Sweden, February 28, 2000). www.fluoridation.com/c-sweden.htm


    "From the end of the 1960s until the beginning of the 1970s drinking water in various places in the Netherlands was fluoridated to prevent caries. However, in its judgement of 22 June 1973 in case No. 10683 (Budding and co. versus the City of Amsterdam) the Supreme Court (Hoge Road) ruled there was no legal basis for fluoridation. After that judgement, amendment to the Water Supply Act was prepared to provide a legal basis for fluoridation. During the process it became clear that there was not enough support from Parlement [sic] for this amendment and the proposal was withdrawn." (Wilfred Reinhold, Legal Advisor, Directorate Drinking Water, Netherlands, January 15, 2000). www.fluoridation.com/c-netherlands.htm

    Northern Ireland:

    "The water supply in Northern Ireland has never been artificially fluoridated except in 2 small localities where fluoride was added to the water for about 30 years up to last year. Fluoridation ceased at these locations for operational reasons. At this time, there are no plans to commence fluoridation of water supplies in Northern Ireland." (C.J. Grimes, Department for Regional Development, Belfast, November 6, 2000).


    "Toxic fluorides have never been added to the public water supplies in Austria." (M. Eisenhut, Head of Water Department, Osterreichische Yereinigung fur das Gas-und Wasserfach Schubertring 14, A-1015 Wien, Austria, February 17, 2000).

    Czech Republic:

    "Since 1993, drinking water has not been treated with fluoride in public water supplies throughout the Czech Republic. Although fluoridation of drinking water has not actually been proscribed it is not under consideration because this form of supplementation is considered:

    • uneconomical (only 0.54% of water suitable for drinking is used as such; the remainder is employed for hygiene etc. Furthermore, an increasing amount of consumers (particularly children) are using bottled water for drinking (underground water usually with fluor)
    • unecological (environmental load by a foreign substance)
    • unethical ("forced medication")
    • toxicologically and phyiologically debateable (fluoridation represents an untargeted form of supplementation which disregards actual individual intake and requirements and may lead to excessive health-threatening intake in certain population groups; [and] complexation of fluor in water into non biological active forms of fluor." (Dr. B. Havlik, Ministerstvo Zdravotnictvi Ceske Republiky, October 14, 1999). www.fluoridealert.org/czech.jpeg
    Q2: I heard that Europe offers fluoride in it's salt. Isn't that the same as fluoridating the water supply?

    A2: Yes, some European counties offer salt with fluoride. This allows anyone whio still wishes to ingest fluoride do so and be able to regulate the dose or not use it at all.

    Offering the public a choice of purchasing fluoride in salt permits Europeans to follow their health care provider's advice, their own medical needs and their own preferences and not be forcibly medicated.

    However, France has now banned even salt products containing fluoride removing even the choice of it's residents to use fluoride because of health concerns.

  • sammielee24

    By Dr. Mercola

    Water fluoridation is considered one of the most notable advancements in public health, and cities around the US spend millions adding fluoride to communal water supplies each year.

    99 percent of that fluoridated water ends up on your lawn and in your toilet, where it’s really nothing but an environmental pollutant. Then there’s the issue of safety when ingested on a daily basis...

    An increasing number of dentists and scientists are raising serious concerns about these chemicals, which by the way have never been approved by the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) — the agency responsible for food and drug safety.

    Many do not realize that fluoride is a drug that is available only with a prescription. Yet it's added to municipal water supplies used by more than 180 million Americans, including infants and the elderly without any attention to personalized dosing or potential interactions.

    This is a significant problem, because once you add it to the water supply, you have no way of determining how much of the drug any particular person will consume on any given day.

    Also consider this: It is illegal, medical malpractice, and unethical for a physician to prescribe a drug without specifying dosage, and to fail to monitor your health for side effects from the drug.

    Yet, your water authority is not only allowed, but encouraged to add a toxic drug — fluoride — to your drinking water without your consent and without any way of knowing who in your household is drinking it, how much, and the effect it is having.

    Worse yet, while scientific studies have been done on pharmaceutical grade fluoride, none have been made on the fluoride that is actually used for water fluoridation. This chemical (hexafluorosilicic acid) is an industrial waste product that is likely to be even more toxic than medical grade fluoride.

    It’s illegal to dump it into rivers and lakes or release the parent gases into the atmosphere. In fact, municipalities that decided to stop fluoridating their water had to keep going until all the chemicals were used up because they couldn’t afford the hazardous waste disposal fees!

    Dr. William Hirzy from the EPA has even pointed out that if it goes into the air, it's a pollutant. If it goes into the local water, it's pollution. But if the public water utilities buy it and purposely pour it in our drinking water, it's no longer a pollutant. All of a sudden, by some magic sleight of hand, it's a beneficial public health measure...

  • sammielee24

    ******According to a 2006 report on water fluoridation produced by the US National Research Council, the benefits from fluoride are topical only, and cannot be achieved through ingestion. It also detailed positive associations between fluoride ingestion and bone fractures, cancer, reduced IQ and dementia.

    Meanwhile, the American Dental Association (ADA), which is mired in conflicts of interest with the amalgam industry, has had “amalgam safety” and “universal water fluoridation” as their top two highest goals for their National Oral Health Agenda 2 as of 2009. Furthermore, the ADA, one of the most influential trade lobbies in the US 3, 4 believes that: 5

    “All communal water supplies containing less than the optimal level of fluoride should be adjusted to an optimum level. Toward this end, the ADA is urging Congress and state legislators to make capacity-building funds readily available to help communities establish, upgrade and maintain an effective public water fluoridation infrastructure.”

    The ADA spent $2.56 million on their lobbying efforts last year, and more than half of its lobbyists (11 out of 20) have previously held government jobs, 6 again demonstrating the revolving doors between government and industry. This is a key feature found among most highly effective lobbying groups.

    The ADA is also one of the most secretive when it comes to its funding. It was one of just a handful of groups that declined to provide information to The Chronicle about their responses to Senator Charles E. Grassley, who in 2009 asked 33 nonprofit health and medical groups to report how much money they received from pharmaceutical, medical-device, and insurance companies, and how they disclose such information to the public. 7, 8

    The association has also spent much of its time defending the dental profession against lawsuits that charge the mercury used in fillings causes health problems.

    The ADA has close ties with the world’s leading supplier of dental mercury (amalgam) fillings, Henry Schein, and has steadfastly refused to admit that placing neurotoxic mercury in your mouth might not be a good idea. In recent years, many dentists have reconsidered this archaic practice and about half of all American dentists are now mercury-free, but the ADA’s dismissal of the evidence has led to low-income children being disproportionately harmed. Amalgam is still the primary filling material used in many underprivileged children due to it being the least expensive alternative. Henry Schein also makes sure uninsured children receive their toxic wares via “charity” programs like the annual Give Kids a Smile program 9 to which it donates dental supplies.

  • sammielee24

    Some people question the money made or profit in regard to fluoride. The substance is a waste product - from aluminimum, steel etc. The waste product would cost the companies a lot of money to dispose of according to environmental guidelines however, if it is packaged and sold as a medicinal substance - that waste now becomes a profit instead of a loss. Smart? Sure for the company. Getting politicians and countries to buy into the fact that a waste product from aluminim is good for the public and then contracting to sell them your waste now repackaged as 'medicine' is a stroke of genius. Further getting the people to buy into it is amazing - imagine, being able to medicate whole countries with your garbage and getting them to pay for that garbage so you still get a profit! Way to go! No brainer there!

    If people were so vested in using fluoride, then those people should be able to go and get it and use it. I guess those same people should be able to go and buy lead paint for their crafts if they want - or coat their water pipes with lead ..bottom line is that this is not a need for good health for all people. Target those people who choose to ingest fluoride instead of medicating and poisoning everyone. sammieswife


    Fluoride is the ionic form of fluorine. Some common forms compounds are hexafluoric acid, sodium fluoride, and calcium fluoride.


    Although fluoride naturally exists as calcium fluoride (CaF 2 ), other fluoride complexes derived from man-made resources increase environmental fluoride levels and our own exposure to fluoride. Fluoride is used often in pesticides, dentistry, and is added to municipal water supplies to prevent cavities in the community.

    Current commercial toothpaste is fortified with sodium monofluorophosphate or sodium fluoride. Fluoride toothpaste and water fluoridation have been touted by some health organizations as major contributors to dental caries reduction in the United States and arguably a public health success.

    Several fluoridation additives are used in treating drinking water in the United States, the most common of which are, in order, hexafluorosilicic acid (H 2 SiF 6 ), sodium fluoride (NaF), and sodium hexafluorosilicic acid (Na 2 SiF 6 ). Sources of fluoridating agents can be found naturally in volcanic ash and as fluorite and apatite in geological mineral deposits (#Urbansky, 2002). While small-scale water treatment utilities use NaF, larger ones operate with high quantities of fluorosilicates, whose lowered costs make up for its greater handling expenses (#Urbansky, 2002). The demand for fluoride additives benefits companies that can market their waste products as fluoridating agents to water utilities. Industries such as USSteel, DuPPont, Alcoa, Allied Chemical, and the Florida phosphate fertilizer industry all profit from selling fluoride byproducts they have generated (#Kauffman, 2005).

    Various other forms of organic and inorganic fluoride complexes such as acetyl fluoride (CHCOF) and liquid hydrofluoric acid i.e. hydrogen fluoride gas (HF) can increase fluoride in water, too. Care should be taken when investigating potential fluoride sources, however, as not all chemical substances containing the element fluorine necessarily yield fluoride ions. Teflon polymer is composed of -CF 2 -, whose chemical structure offers great stability and so does not readily produce fluoride ions (#Kauffman, 2005). Fluorine-containing chemical groups incorporated into drugs serve the purpose of slowing drug metabolization in the body (#Kauffman, 2005). The likelihood of fluoride contribution from fluorine in drugs is debatable. Synthetic and natural substances with fluorine or fluoride display a variety of chemical structures, which affect the chemical properties of each substances and thus, the degree to which the substances act as fluoride-releasing agents.

    Pharmacology and Metabolism

    Fluoride ions convert to hydrofluoric acid in the gut. Around 50% of the fluoride is excreted in urine while a minute is excreted through saliva and sweat. The half life of these ions is short (1-5 hours).

    Fluoride accumulates in people most often if they have impaired kidney function. The ions settle in the bones and teeth (#Limeback and Gingrich, 2007).

    Health Effects

    The health effects of fluoride is contentious. It has generally been thought that small levels offluoride (0.7 - 1.2 ppm in drinking water for example) increase bone density and increase calcium fluorapatite in teeth which is generally thought to lead to fewer cavities. Fluoride regulation in drinking water supplies at the .7 - 1.2 ppm level is recommended still by the American Dental Association and the World Health Organization. But, many are beginning to believe that chronic fluoride exposure can lead to liver damage, kidney damage, and dental fluorosis among other things. Amidst these negative findings, the American Academy of Allergy and Immunology, the American Academy of Diabetes, the American Cancer Society, the American Diabetes Association, the American Nurses Association, the American Psychiatric Association, the National Kidney Foundation, and the Society of Toxicology have discounted fluoride as a beneficial additive and no longer support its use (#Kauffman, 2005). Additionally there is an ethical argument surrounding city officials adding fluoride to drinking water supplies.

    Fluoride is one of the most highly toxic substances present in our environment today. There are many different levels of toxicity:

    In areas where fluoride compounds are naturally elevated in the drinking water, fluorosis are common (#Limeback and Gingerich, 2007).

    Exposure levels of 1-5 mg/kg body weight can create acute fluoride toxicity symptoms such as nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, abdominal pain, and in rare cases cardiac arrhythmias and death (#Fallon, 2006). Acute ingestion of fluoride can be fatal. Skin or eye contact with gaseous fluoride results in irritation of the skin or eyes.

    Fluoride is everywhere. It is present as a mineral and is ubiquitously present in natural water sources throughout the world. It is also added to toothpaste to prevent cavities and decay. The most common problem associated with fluoride exposure is fluorosis.

    Dental fluorosis occurs in areas with a fluoride exposure level higher than 1.0 ppm (#Fallon, 2006). Fluoride intake can cause mild symptoms such as white, opaque mottling of teeth and enamel wear. At higher levels of exposure, severe dental fluorosis occurs with pronounced brown or black discoloration and pitting of teeth. Staining only happens with developing teeth below the gum line. As such, any noticeable characteristic of dental fluorosis only indicates the fluoride exposure level an individual has had up to age 8-10 (#Meenakshi, 2006). Dental fluorosis symptoms, in effect, are more of a time capsule rather than a present indicator of fluoride exposure and may fail to determine alone whether adults currently suffer from excessive fluoride intake. Additionally, although fluoride fosters bone formation, the new bones develop abnormally (#Fallon, 2006).

    Skeletal fluorosis happens at the advanced stage of fluorosis. Fluoride deposits in the joints of the neck, knees, pelvic and shoulder bones and hinders movement. In the early stages, back stiffness, burning sensations, tingling or prickling, and muscle weakness arise and irregular calcium deposits show up in ligaments and bones. Advanced skeletal fluorosis creates osteoporosis, growth of bony spikes at the joint, vertebral fusion, and even osteosarcoma (bone cancer). Damage to the entire musculoskeletal and nervous systems marks the end stage of advanced fluorosis (#Meenakshi, 2006).

    Overexposure to fluoride affects more than just bone and teeth. It can cause physical damage to human physiology by lowering hemoglobin count, distorting red blood cell shape, suppressing immunity, destroying enzymes and disrupting the normal mechanisms of the excretory, digestive, and respiratory systems (#Meenakshi, 2006). Children who drank water with fluoride levels exceeding 2.0 mg/L had kidney and liver function damage, the latter independent of dental fluorosis (#Xiong et al., 2007). Excessive fluoride intake can also cause mental harm in the forms of depression, nervousness and symptoms similar to those of Alzheimer's disease as well as reproductive harm such as male sterility, still birth, and abortion (#Meenakshi, 2006).

  • jgnat

    "For 65 years, community water fluoridation has been a safe and healthy way to effectively prevent tooth decay. CDC has recognized water fluoridation as one of 10 great public health achievements of the 20th century."


  • jgnat

    No bureaucrat is going to set out to poison people. - JG

    And you know this how? You sound VERY confident in your assertian (sic). I guess crime never happens....anywhere. Because no one ever sets out to commit one. That's just a logical (sic). - ST

    No bureaucrat is going to set out to poison people because the cardinal rule of the bureaucrat is not to embarrass your government. Embarrassed governments don't get voted in. It's all a matter of survival.

    Now, are there individual cases of excess or corruption? Sure. But something like water flouridation or other claimed examples of conspiracy, just can't be pulled off.

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