Most solid evidence I've seen linking WT to Mason, somebody try to debunk this lol

by EndofMysteries 147 Replies latest watchtower scandals

• 

  EntirelyPossible

  I can't physically alter it, but I have the freedom to suggest correction.

  Nope, sorry, you make up stuff and call it fact, I can do the same about you. Your violent, constant day and night fantasies about me are now fact as well.

  However you have an agenda that is at odds with mine. That makes us enemies and that means to me that I have learn to love you because enemies can easily be hated. Hate awlays leads to the dark side.

  Enemies? Wow, you have a strange idea of an enemy. You are not my enemy. Why would you be? You have no power to affect my life, to hurt me, to help me. You are not in a position of power over me, you don't work for me.

  I have literally no idea where you are getting "enemy" from.
• 

  sabastious

  PS my pointing out that Masons believe in supernatural beings is a basic fact that Sab seemed to be unaware of. Pointing out the actual beliefs of Masons in a thread called "Most solid evidence I've seen linking WT to Mason, somebody try to debunk this lol" is not OT: it's very MUCH on topic AND important, since some participants were trying to rewrite basic facts.

  I study the Masons because of my belief that the Watchtower is deeply connected to them. This is a good example of you jumping to an unwarranted conclusion about me based on bias and prejudice. You simply assume that I would make a stupid mistake of not looking into the religious framework of the Masons and then speak presumptuously. You don't know what I know and don't know, you really shouldn't be acting like you do.

  He is speaking what he believes, however silly and wrong it is and he gets called out on it. You are two sides of the same coin. You say whatever you want, no matter how silly or wrong it is and you get called out on it. The "programming" you speak of is a dangerous line of thinking. Some people, myself included, think that anything that promotes obvious falshoods, fundamentalist Christianity, conspiracy theories that promote wild speculation, ignoring facts and reason to get at a desired conclusion is dangerous thinking.

  You obviously don't understand Watchtower programming as well as I do. I can't teach you what you think you already know.

  Yet, I don't want you banned. I'll just point out the silliness and let you keep going. Recovery didn't hurt anyone. The WT ideas are literally just as valid as the stuff you make up and spout dogmatically.

  Why is what YOU specifcally would do in any given circumstance pertinent at all? Some said that they felt I should be banned for calling for the banning of Recovery which you and I disagree with. I don't use Watchtower programming to emotionally manipulate posters.

  Oh, I already think our conversations are awesome because I already know your meter is broken.

  That just means you are the weakest link.

  -Sab
• 

  sabastious

  Enemies? Wow, you have a strange idea of an enemy. You are not my enemy. Why would you be? You have no power to affect my life, to hurt me, to help me. You are not in a position of power over me, you don't work for me. I have literally no idea where you are getting "enemy" from.

  You are an arch nemesis of mine as are all anti-theists, but adversarial collaboration can be very effective:

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sW5sMgGo7dw

  But you have to be ok with a draw, which you don't seem ok with, imo. I am ok with not winning, I just want my points presented next to their oppositional points.

  -Sab
• 

  EntirelyPossible

  You don't know what I know and don't know, you really shouldn't be acting like you do.

  Well, sabby, perhaps YOU shouldn't run around saying why other people say the things they do and claiming to know what they think. Hypocrit, thy name is Sabastious.

  You obviously don't understand Watchtower programming as well as I do. I can't teach you what you think you already know.

  Hypocrit, thy name is sabby. You are right, there is NOTHING you can teach me. You simply made up too much stuff. You assume that I don't know as much about the WT as you (despite the fact that I was a JW longer than you have been alive, was an MS, have an ex-wife still in and two kids that go to the meetings when they are with her).

  You are laughable. You do the exact same think that Recovery does, spout made up stuff as fact and can't even begin to see how you are exactly the same.

  Why is what YOU specifcally would do in any given circumstance pertinent at all? Some said that they felt I should be banned for calling for the banning of Recovery which you and I disagree with

  Because, Sabby, it's a community. It's a collaborative process. When someone needs defending, there needs to be people to do it. Just the same as I would defend you if someone called for you to be banned.

  That just means you are the weakest link.

  It's adorable when name calling is all you have left.

  But you have to be ok with a draw, which you don't seem ok with, imo.

  I'm very ok with a draw. When we have 50% of our elected officials as atheists, when 50% of western civilizations says they are atheists, then it will be a draw.

  But, seriously, it's not a draw. It's painfully obvious how ridiculous the things you say are and how obviously made up and weird they are. There is no draw between us.
• 

  King Solomon

  Sab said:

  You are an arch nemesis of mine as are all anti-theists, but adversarial collaboration can be very effective:

  Sab seemingly thinks he has an archnemesis in EP (and Sab, you can only have ONE archnemesis: the other opponents are simply your nemeses). How long have you two been going steady?

  Sab, you're not a Luke Skywalker to Darth Vader, Harry Potter to Valdemort, David to Goliath, etc. You need to give up the mental junk-food of superheroes, comic books, conspiracy theories, DND, halo, LOTR, the Bible, vampires/werewolves, pixies/fairies, etc.
• 

  sabastious

  Well, sabby, perhaps YOU shouldn't run around saying why other people say the things they do and claiming to know what they think. Hypocrit, thy name is Sabastious.

  For one, I'm not a doctor with a degree, or an accomplished businessman who claims to be a deity, I am just a simple farmboy. People here understand that I will make assessments and they are free to challenge them. However, I don't just presume that they know nothing about what they are talking about before I am given direct evidence. I can be corrected, you and KS really cannot unless the person doing the correction has the right credentials based on your bias view of the world around you. You are a good ole boys club just like the Masons and the Watchtower.

  Hypocrit, thy name is sabby. You are right, there is NOTHING you can teach me. You simply made up too much stuff. You assume that I don't know as much about the WT as you (despite the fact that I was a JW longer than you have been alive, was an MS, have an ex-wife still in and two kids that go to the meetings when they are with her).

  I KNOW you don't know as much as me in this regard because I have not given a fraction of my research to this forum. I have witnessed obvious behavior from you that proves that you understand very little on the subject of mind control. Comparing your experience with the JW's with mine based upon your family circumstance has no value in determining who "knows" more. You don't know the reasearch I have been doing and you are full of assumptions, which I find amusing. I understand, though, and I don't completely blame you for your ignorance in the matter. It's a tough subject.

  You are laughable. You do the exact same think that Recovery does, spout made up stuff as fact and can't even begin to see how you are exactly the same.

  I know many laugh, but I have assessed those reactions and have concluded that they are just human defense mechanisms that tell more about that person's psychology than it does the validity of their opinion.

  Because, Sabby, it's a community. It's a collaborative process. When someone needs defending, there needs to be people to do it. Just the same as I would defend you if someone called for you to be banned.

  You put undue importance on yourself (which you acuse of me). I claim to have a spiritual awareness that you lack, but I can demonstrate this in my own life whereas you can only demonstrate what other people have taught you. You are not original and therefore you melt when put up against something that is.

  It's adorable when name calling is all you have left.

  I really do think you are weak and pitiful, but you are able to conceal this through secular strength. You perfectly resemble the words of Reveltion 3:

  Revelation 3 - These are the words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the ruler of God’s creation. 15 I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were either one or the other! 16 So, because you are lukewarm—neither hot nor cold—I am about to spit you out of my mouth. 17 You say, ‘I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.’ But you do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind and naked. 18 I counsel you to buy from me gold refined in the fire, so you can become rich; and white clothes to wear, so you can cover your shameful nakedness; and salve to put on your eyes, so you can see.

  Without spirituality, there is no hope, so anybody trying to discredit it as a whole is an enemy of the realm.

  There is no draw between us.

  Then the battle continues, I look foward to more conversations

  -Sab
• 

  King Solomon

  Sab said:

  I KNOW you don't know as much as me in this regard because I have not given a fraction of my research to this forum. I have witnessed obvious behavior from you that proves that you understand very little on the subject of mind control.

  Let me guess: research you conducted over the internet?

  Soooo, being prone to these vast conspiracies that the "others" (the mysterious "they" and "them") are carrying on around you, do you think these super-intelligent humans that you assume exist (without proof, yet again) who've developed these mind control techniques are going to allow them to LEAK to the public?

  Much like your supernatural beings which you believe in (without proof), you would be completely unaware of these people's presence, as they would be able to avoid detection and keep their methods a secret. Seeing a common theme here in your beliefs, Sab? Masons? Brain-washers? Angels?

  ---

  Besides, since you think WT is in on the secret (Recovery was apparently an "agent") then how does the WTBTS use their super-powerful and top-secret methods without such knowledge leaking out (or have you NOT noticed the BOE letters that leak HERE, after even BEFORE they make it to elders in the mail)? How does it get to the KH level, without it's being leaked?

  ANSWER: it's no secret. THEY USE THE BIBLE AND POLICY TO CONTROL. People GIVE them permission to allow themselves to be controlled.

  Sab, you don't need to resort to the hyperbole and "writer's embellishment" for this stuff: the REAL STORY of what is happening (say, in the BOE child abuse letter) is shocking enough, so resorting to complex theories (like Masons and WT) is simply nonsense, with zero benefit to be gained by wasting brain cycles on it.

  Sab said:

  Without spirituality, there is no hope, so anybody trying to discredit it as a whole is an enemy of the realm.

  Who said EP or I are not spiritual? Assuming again?
• 

  EntirelyPossible

  I can be corrected, you and KS really cannot unless the person doing the correction has the right credentials based on your bias view of the world around you.

  So let's get this right, simple farmboy..... you, once again, presume, haughtily, to tell me how I can be corrected? You presumptiously attempt to claim humility and that you can be correct, but deign to tell KS and I how we think and act?

  You are simple, indeed, if you thought that BS would stick.

  I KNOW you don't know as much as me in this regard because I have not given a fraction of my research to this forum. I have witnessed obvious behavior from you that proves that you understand very little on the subject of mind control.

  Oh, so sorry, simple farmboy. You said you CAN be corrected and now you ARE being corrected. You don't know anything about what I know. You claim that you are simple. You claim I am smarter than you. You claim your facts are from spiritual awareness, your own mind.You claim humility and display hubris. As I said, you are laughable.

  You know nothing about me other that what you make up in your own mind.

  I have assessed those reactions and have concluded that they are just human defense mechanisms that tell more about that person's psychology than it does the validity of their opinion.

  What is SHOULD tell you is that I have no problem with laughing at ridiculous things. I am not sure what you think I am defending against when I laugh, it's certainly not you. The boot does not worry about the ant.

  I claim to have a spiritual awareness that you lack, but I can demonstrate this in my own life whereas you can only demonstrate what other people have taught you. You are not original and therefore you melt when put up against something that is.

  Newsflash, farmboy, you have no idea what I lack or don't. You're making shit up again. And you aren't original, people have been making up ridiculous things about the Bible, making up conspiracy theories, trying to find connections where there are none, living their entire life making up weird theories. Yours aren't any different.

  I really do think you are weak and pitiful, but you are able to conceal this through secular strength.

  What you think of me matters no more than what a cow thinks of a grill.

  Without spirituality, there is no hope, so anybody trying to discredit it as a whole is an enemy of the realm.

  The realm? What realm? WTF are you going on about?

  Then the battle continues, I look foward to more conversations

  Again, there is no battle, I am not your enemy.
• 

  maisha

  “Elsewhere in this book will be found some reproductions of beautiful photos taken of the surface, showing the "Pyramid" and Head Stone with inscription, likewise the plat beneath which is hidden the ashes of one who we believe is now crowned both King and Priest.

  there was no doubt he was part of the anointed,,, back then,,, imagine if he were here now what he would say to this current GB.. probably throw them out like th emoney changers in the temple!...

  LOL
• 

  sabastious

  Much like your supernatural beings which you believe in (without proof), you would be completely unaware of these people's presence, as they would be able to avoid detection and keep their methods a secret. Seeing a common theme here in your beliefs, Sab? Masons? Brain-washers? Angels?

  Mind control is something that can be scientifically demonstrated, but the science is not completely there yet. I hope to add to it. On the subject of supernatural beings that's a religious belief of mine and is not the same thing. It's YOU who are seeing a pattern that doesn't exist. A perfect example of confirmation bias on your part.

  So let's get this right, simple farmboy..... you, once again, presume, haughtily, to tell me how I can be corrected? You presumptiously attempt to claim humility and that you can be correct, but deign to tell KS and I how we think and act?

  I never claimed humility, I claimed simplicity. You are just reading into my words.

  Oh, so sorry, simple farmboy. You said you CAN be corrected and now you ARE being corrected. You don't know anything about what I know. You claim that you are simple. You claim I am smarter than you. You claim your facts are from spiritual awareness, your own mind.You claim humility and display hubris. As I said, you are laughable. You know nothing about me other that what you make up in your own mind.

  Again, I never used the word humble, you are erecting and striking down straw men again. My personal obvservation is that you are an arrogant bigot who would never be able to be corrected by a simple farmboy, even if he was right.

  What is SHOULD tell you is that I have no problem with laughing at ridiculous things. I am not sure what you think I am defending against when I laugh, it's certainly not you. The boot does not worry about the ant.

  That's a false analogy unless your ant has self-resurrection abilities. Your statement is reminiscent of when you called me a dung beetle and you a lion in the savana. Why do lions concern themselves with dung beetles?

  Newsflash, farmboy, you have no idea what I lack or don't. You're making shit up again. And you aren't original, people have been making up ridiculous things about the Bible, making up conspiracy theories, trying to find connections where there are none, living their entire life making up weird theories. Yours aren't any different.

  I'm not original? Surely you are just jealous of my originality.

  What you think of me matters no more than what a cow thinks of a grill.

  You think you can best me with metaphor? Have you learned nothing in our discussions? Oh wait, that's right I can't teach you anything because I am an insect, gotcha.

  The realm? What realm? WTF are you going on about?

  Something you don't understand.

  Again, there is no battle, I am not your enemy.

  I am a theist and you are an anti-theist. That makes us enemies from where I stand. You don't get to define who I consider an enemy. If you want to remain in friendship status with someone who claims to be your enemy then that's your choice, I question it however. If someone calls for my banning I would be ashamed to have someone like you rise in my defense.

  -Sab