Unconditional Love-How would you describe it?

by rip van winkle 239 Replies latest members private

  • rip van winkle
    rip van winkle

    Talesin- My mother is dying. I choose to show her love (or is it pity?) for an old, suffering woman, who NOW realizes she never gave her daughter unconditional love. It's too late for me to love her the way she wants .... after 50+ years of neglect and abuse. It was a difficult choice to make, but I could only begin to 'go there' after I learned, as you say, to love myself. Recently. :) Thanks Tal! You are living what it is to love unconditionally. It doesn't matter if you need to replace the word "love" to "pity". Pity is an action that applies also to forgiveness and mercy. Tal, you are caring for the mother who failed to love, nurture and protect you. By your actions, by your choice, you are defining unconditional love.

    Ziddinia- you're killing me! " Rip, in all seriousness, I know myself well enough to state that I would turn in my own flesh-and-blood if they turned out to be vicious killers - or even embezzlers..." Z- I said I believe you!!! I do! But Z, I really think it has to do with choice. I think years ago had I been asked for my description of unconditional love my answer would be different. I may have even claimed, as you have, that it doesn't exist. From my own experiences in life I've learned that it does exist. And I have also learned how to give it. I think it is a behaviour by choice, by experience, by forgiveness and by accepting that everyone makes mistakes in life. None of us are perfect. And if we ever are lucky enough to have been given unconditional love we want to be able to pass that gift to others.

    ShirleyW- So true!!!

  • talesin
    talesin

    wow, thanks rvw, I am all choked up now. It took a lot of work to get to that place in my heart. I just want her to feel loved, and how could I not have forgiveness for someone who is suffering so much, and for many years?

  • ziddina
    ziddina

    Hee hee hee heeee!!

    Rip, if you think that you're capable of expressing "unconditional love", I suspect you'd change your mind after spending a week with the board's She-Devil... she devil smiley

    I'd knock that fluffy-bunny-rainbow-unicorn stuff right outta you!!!

  • still thinking
    still thinking

    rip...you're a sweetie...

  • ziddina
    ziddina

    I think that my biggest issue with "unconditional love" is that I don't see how it can efficiently co-exist along with effective critical thinking abilities...

    Effective critical thinking will analyse situations with the intent of determining whether the situation will be beneficial or detrimental to one's happiness and ability to thrive - well, heck, I might as well say, ability to survive.

    "Unconditional love" can be manipulated by others into something that benefits THEM but is detrimental to the one giving out the "unconditional love".

    Which brings me right back around to: unconditional love = codependency...

    As I've realized when taking care of my pets, I have to stay alive, healthy, efficient in order to take care of THEM. If I'm being too self-sacrificing, EVERYONE suffers - and that's NOT beneficial!!

    Speaking of which, it's bedtime. G'nite!

  • still thinking
    still thinking

    Unconditional love cannot be manipulated...it is just unconditional and it requires a certain amount of critical thinking to remain that way. You have to separate your feelings from your need or want to try to control a situation. It'a about accepting life on lifes terms and making decisions based on that WITHOUT loosing your self in the process. Unconditional love is strong and unshakeable.

    Co dependency is NOT unconditional...it is damaging behaviour that tries to manipulate another person to be or do what you want, It tends to be passive aggressive...it is the opposite of unconditional love.

  • ziddina
    ziddina

    Let's take a look at the definition of co-dependency...

    From this website: http://mentalhealthamerica.net/go/codependency

    "Co-dependency is a learned behavior that can be passed down from one generation to another. It is an emotional and behavioral condition that affects an individual's ability to have a healthy, mutually satisfying relationship. It is also known as "relationship addiction" because people with codependency often form or maintain relationships that are one-sided, emotionally destructive and/or abusive. The disorder was first identified about ten years ago as the result of years of studying interpersonal relationships in families of alcoholics. Co-dependent behavior is learned by watching and imitating other family members who display this type of behavior. ..."

    There's nothing in that definition about the co-dependent person "[trying] to manipulate another person to be or do what you want. It tends to be passive aggressive..."

    In fact, it's usually the addicted person in the relationship who is being "manipulative... passive-aggressive", because such behaviors stimulate the co-dependent to support the addict's sickness...

    Which is what I meant when I mentioned "Unconditional love" can be manipulated by others into something that benefits THEM but is detrimental to the one giving out the "unconditional love"...

    The article I quoted above goes on to state:

    "Attention and energy focus on the family member who is ill or addicted. The co-dependent person typically sacrifices his or her needs to take care of a person who is sick. When co-dependents place other people's health, welfare and safety before their own, they can lose contact with their own needs, desires, and sense of self."

    I don't need to quote the whole article, but many of the characteristics being mentioned as part of "unconditional love", appear in the listing of characteristics of codependency.

    An exaggerated sense of responsibility for the actions of others [feeling responsible for others' happiness]
    A tendency to confuse love and pity, with the tendency to “love” people they can pity and rescue
    A tendency to do more than their share, all of the time [or to allow those who have caused great harm in the past, further access to do still MORE harm, under the guise of having "forgiven" them]

    Interesting.

  • still thinking
    still thinking

    For a start....in this type of relationship...the unconditional love...is never unconditional. It is unhealthy. It may be giving, yes, it may be abused, yes, but it is not unconditional.

    More often than not the giver of the supposed''unconditional love" is wanting/needing love in return, they are usually needy and have low self esteem. So it is not possible for the love they give to be unconditional at all. The hope is that if you give give give...you will get love back. Maybe manipulitive was the wrong phrase to use. There are many ways to give, it could be by buying the love, it could be by being a doormat. It is unhealthy giving. And it is not giving with no expectation.

    For the alcoholic say, you give money to help them out of debt. Yes you do it to help them, but you also do it to fix them and their problem. You cannot fix anothers problem. This is not love. It is a way to feel needed and rescuing. You may keep taking them back even though you KNOW it is not helping them. But it makes YOU feel better and needed/wanted. This is not love...it is dysfunction. If you truly want to help them, you stop taking them back. But that is hard when you are needy.

    This is how abusers find enablers, and enablers find abusers...it is a behaviour that feeds of each other. And eventually it does become manipulative..on both sides. One side is more aggressive...the other passive. It becomes a battle ground. Unconditional love cannot exist in this type of environment. Even if it starts out unconditional in some way, it soon turns into hurt and resentment the dysfunction has drawn you to each other...let the battle and paranoia begin.

    It requires a huge amount of 'I have had enough' and normally a total breakdown of the relationship before it can remotely begin to be healed.

    True unconditional love is not needy...it does not resent, it does not manipulate, it does not try to fix people. It accepts people for who and what they are. It doesn not try to change people to be what you want them to be.

    • I would agree 100% that the list you have for co dependency is correct...but unconditional love cannot exist in that environment.
    • It wasnt until I stopped feeling responsible for anothers happiness that I could claim unconditional love
    • It wasn't until I stopped rescuing people that I realised I needed to rescue myself and was not qulified to rescue others. It was not my job.
    • Forgiveness has nothing to do with allowing others to continue to harm you. You can forgive and love AND say NO...that is real love. That is love that is willing to risk losing everything because you love yourself first and foremost and will not be a doormat for anyone.

    Once you have stopped doing all these things...if you still love the person. It IS unconditional because you ask for NOTHING in return.

  • LV101
    LV101

    Women who give birth do not automatically LOVE their babies (of course, many do and it's natural for some) and it's troubling not to know the facts. Science (psychology) has known this for years. It's not a natural instinct or a given. Some may learn love --- some have it automatically but this is not the NORM. Get the facts.

  • LV101
    LV101

    Zid --- I think it's a parental love. I'm talking about healthy, true-loving mothers/fathers not the masses of nut jobs out there that many of us have experienced. I'm not talking about step children although I've known one or two cases where the step-children were loved but usually it's 'conditional' love.

    Mothers have given birth to murderers and they can't shut that love off (if they were a loving, benevolent, mother) but they can hate the child's actions. Two different things here. Like one of your puppies if he ate/destroyed your favorite possession in the whole world you would want to strangle him out of anger at first but your love would overrule.

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