Relationship Issues: Boundaries, Freedom of Choice and Codependency

by 00DAD 83 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  00DAD

  Relationship Issues: Boundaries, Freedom of Choice and Codependency

  I just read a very interesting thought in the book, "Boundaries" by Cloud & Townsend. It said:

  The basic problem in human relationship is that of freedom. We call people bad because they do not do what we want them to do. We judge them for being themselves, for fulfilling their wishes. We withdraw love from them when they do what they feel is best for them, but it is not what we want them to do.

  If you replace every occurrence of the word "we" with "JWs" notice how the exact same passage reads:

  The basic problem in human relationship is that of freedom. JWs call people bad because they do not do what JWs want them to do. JWs judge them for being themselves, for fulfilling their wishes. JWs withdraw love from them when they do what they feel is best for them, but it is not what JWs want them to do.

  The WTBTS and its leadership simply cannot stand any individuals having personal freedom. They attempt to control, to manipulate and coerce through guilt and fear.

  Guilt isn't always bad. And sometimes people that love us tell us things that make us feel guilty or ashamed. If it leads to our growth as a person then it is a good thing; but if it is only said to manipulate and control us then it is bad.

  JWs talk a lot about love, but it is ultimately in the context that there is always the threat of that loss of "love" should an individual choose to exercise their freedom in any way not proscribed by the WTBTS. The fear of the loss of love is a powerful manipulative tool in the toolbox of the WTBTS.

  And as I have often said in reference to that kind of "love": If it's conditional, it ain't love!
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  mrsjones5

  I just inserted my parents (wannabee controllers) and I (who they want to control). It's the story of my relationship with my parents and how they've labeled me.

  No problem seeing the big pic with the bOrg.
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  Cagefighter

  The JW concept of God breeds co-dependency.

  Obey the GB and Jehovah and God is nice to you.

  Disobey and the GB and Jehovah will destroy you (but only because they love you)

  This is how abusive relationships tend to work.

  There are a lot of religions Christian and others that claim God is love, pure and simple. Sometimes he allows us to suffer the consequences of our decisions or others, but that isn't really his fault now is it? That is what I believe.

  Relationships with others are still a constant struggle for me.
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  Lady Lee

  I think it is only by recognizing this kind of toxic love for what it is and then remembering that it can exist in any kind of relationship that we can ultimately learn how to have positive relationships with outhers and with ourselves.
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  nuthouse escapee

  thx 4 sharing that quote...fits Jw's perfectly...ah the joys of being emotionally blackmailed
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  nuthouse escapee

  So true Lady Lee. My JW ex used to use 'the silent treatment' on me. Worked for a long time, I would always cave. Then I woke up and realized this was a lack of unconditional love and disrespectful. It's been a valuable learning experience.
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  flipper

  00DAD- Great thread. Conditional love isn't love at all- it's manipulation and blackmail. The WT society has trained 7 million members to practice this kind of unethical, manipulative conditional " love ". It's one of the big reasons our JW relatives shun us and manipulate us - they are learning that behavior from WT leaders . JW members are manipulated by WT leaders, then in turn they manipulate each other, ex-JW relatives or EX-JW friends . It's a vicious cycle
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  apostatethunder

  I would say the biggest problem in human relationships are the people crossing the line of other people’s boundaries.
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  sizemik

  Conditional love isn't love at all. . . . flipper

  I'd never really thought this through before . . . but you're right. The term "conditional love" is as meaningful as "liquid ice" . . . and it's actually misleading to use the word love at all. It's interesting how it stacks up against the Bibles own definition of love . . .

  Long-suffering and kind . . . does not behave indecently, does not look for it's own interests, does not keep account of the injury, bears all things, hopes all things, endures all things . . . never fails.

  Conditional love accomplishes none of those things . . . not even one.
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  LongHairGal

  00DAD:

  This issue of no boundaries was a problem I fought against the whole time I was in the religion. While they feel they can overstep with people in general, if somebody is a single woman, they will try to get away with anything. I can personally attest to this.

  These idiots tried to ask me questions they would never DARE to ask somebody married. Somebody less assertive and more gullible might tell them things that are nobody's business. I didn't fall for the phony brotherhood crap. Once somebody answers inappropriate questions, this is the first step in being exploited or treated disrespectfully.

  A lot of questions fall into the category of "none of your god-damned business" and some of the fools there needed to be told just that. This is a very damaging religion and I stayed on the fringes until my "fade".