by minimus 93 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
Acluetofindtheuser,
In the Reasoning book, the WTS points out that because they use Gods' personal name, they meet the qualification
as "TRUE PROPHETS "
Where in the Bible does it say a prophet get more than one chance to get a prediction right ?????
Witnesses say they are not " INSPIRED" prophets
How can the WTS qualify as true prophets without inspiration??????
Balls in your court Nomad. What ya got ?????
@Acluetofindtheuser.
"If Genesis 6:3 is meant to be a lifespan limit then the Organization has until 2034 to get the Armageddon date right, with respect to 1914."
Where do you deduce that a life space limit brings you to the year 2034? Implying that a life span is 120 years goes against the data you provided. Out of the 10 people you listed, 1 lived that long, the other 9 did not.
Whether you realize it or not, it sounds more like Watchtower babble [December 15, 2003 Watchtower, page 15], and their latest not so subtle implied parallel that Noah preached for 120 years until that end (flood); using similar math would bring 2034 as the end date if you start with 1914. They've just learned a little from their past mistakes to know blatantly not to state such nonsense.
You know what? After 2034 comes and goes, there will be another explanation or implication, just like when the end “is”:
1975 from 6,000 years of man's existence
1984 from a generation equals 70 years
1994 from a generation equals 80 years
And now:
2034 from a generation equals 120 years.
There's enough ambiguity in the Bible along with human creativity and imagination, you can find a number of dates and conclusions to come to many assumptions.
Extra bonus points for adding: "Then again it would have to be sooner because that year is based on ones born in 1914."
Again, realizing it or not, in a somewhat passive manner, you have sounded a Watchtower warning:
"The end will come by 2034 or sooner."
Sorry, the sky is NOT falling. Study history or the repeating of history enough to recognize B.S.
Evidently. But are their claims reasonable? What do the facts show?
That's how I should've started my conversation. Thank you brother.
What do the facts show? That Jerusalem was destroyed in 607 BC. 2,520 years later Jesus was placed in his throne by the almighty Jehovah in 1914, can I get an amen?!
Of course, we know the WTS speaks out of both sides of their mouth:
II. The Watchtower Bible & Tract Society made these claims & predictions.
Scans are on the original site.
A. They claim to be a Prophet.
- Wt, 1/15/1959, pg 40, 41 Whom has God actually used as his prophet?...Jehovah’s Witnesses are deeply grateful today that the plain facts show that God has been pleased to use them.
- Wt, 4/1/1972, pg 197 Who is this prophet?..Today they are known as Jehovah’s Witnesses.
- Wt, 10/1/1982, pg 27 ...“prophet” class yet on earth. The “war of the great day of God the Almighty” at Har-Magedon could not start before this composite “prophet” ends his work.
- Aw, 6/8/1986, pg 9, ...all of whom are prophets, or witnesses for God. In fact, they are known throughout the world as Jehovah’s Witnesses.
B. They claim to speak in Jehovah’s name.
- The Nations shall know 1971, pg 58-62, ....as a mouthpiece and active agent...... commission to speak as a prophet in the name of Jehovah...
- Wt,3/15/1972, pg 189 ...commission to speak as a “prophet” in His name....
- Wt,9/1/1979, pg 29, ...those of the Jeremiah class have been sent by Jehovah to speak in his name......back up their message by quoting the words, “This is what Jehovah has said.”
C. They claim to be the official mouthpiece and channel of Jehovah.
- Zion’s Wt, 9/15/1895, pg 1867, reprint, .....as God’s mouthpiece in.....
- Zion’s Wt, 7/15/1906, pg 3821, reprint .....the truths I present, as God’s mouthpiece.....
- Wt, 7/1/1943, pg 203 He merely uses his "servant" class to publish the interpretation after the Supreme Court by Christ Jesus reveals it.
- Wt, 7/1/1943, pg 205 Jehovah speaks to us through his Son....He has appointed his "faithful and wise servant", who is his visible mouthpiece...These directions from the Lord come to us as individuals...
- Informant(KM), 1/1956, pg 1, ...And how does he speak? Through his appointed channel of communication- his collective congregation of anointed ones...the Watchtower...to dispense Jehovah's communications.
- Wt, 6/15/1957, pg 370 identify Jehovah’s channel of communication for our day......respond to the directions of the “slave” as we would to the voice of God, because it is his provision.
- Wt, 1/15/1959, pg 40, 41 ...Jehovah thrust out his hand of power and touched their lips and put his word in their mouths.
- Wt, 7/15/1960, pg 439, ...collectively served as the channel of communication from heaven to earth.....
- Wt, 9/1/1991, pg 19, ...faithful and discreet slave has also been called God’s channel of communication,...
- Wt, 2/1/1957, pg 79, 80, God interprets and teaches, through Christ the Chief Servant, who in turn uses the discreet slave as the visible channel, the viable theocratic organization...
D. They claim to have a chosen and secret organization with special knowledge and angelic transmission.
- Vindication 1, 1931, pg 76 God’s organization is his chosen nation.
- Preparation, 1933 ,pg 36, 37, 64 ...transmission of information to God’s anointed people...the angels transmit this information, we know that they do it; the scriptures and the facts show that it is done...convey the thoughts to their minds...To all on the outside of the organization of Jehovah his is a secret organization.
- Holy Spirit 1976, pg 175, 176 He put his word in the mouth of his chosen people ....He has put his word, his message of the hour, into the mouth of the spiritual remnant.
- Wt, 10/15/1980, pg 17 God gives his humble servants special knowledge that others do not have... having advance knowledge from Jehovah, his servants are equipped .....
E. They claim Jehovah instructed or used them on certain events.
- Creation 1927, pg 121 Because it was the Lord’s due time to restore these truths he used Charles T. Russell to write and publish books known as Studies in the Scriptures by which the great fundamental truths of the divine plan are clarified.
F. They claim they are the beloved wife of Jehovah and are our Mother.
- Wt, 2/1/1952, pg 79, 80, ...forsake the enlightening guidance of the organization that mothered us? “Forsake not the law of thy mother.”(Prov.6:20-23)....
- Wt, 5/1/1957, pg 283, 284, 285 ...show respect for Jehovah’s organization, for she is our mother and the beloved wife of our heavenly Father, Jehovah God.
- Wt, 7/1/1976, pg 400, ....taught through his wifelike organization, their “mother”.....
G. They predicted the following dates as the battle of Armageddon.
- Zion’s Wt, 1/15/1892, pg 1355, reprint ...“battle” is definitely marked in Scripture as October, 1914.
- The Time is at Hand, 1908, pg 101 .the “battle of the great day of God Almighty” (Rev.16:14) which will end in A.D. 1914, with the complete overthrow of earth’s present rulership, is already commenced.
- The Finished Mystery, 1917, pg 398, 399, 485 the people who are the strength of Christendom shall be cut off in the brief but terribly eventful period beginning in 1918 A.D. A third part are “burned with fire in the mist of the city.” .....After 1918 the people supporting churchianity will cease to be its, supporters, be destroyed as adherents,...Also in the year 1918, when God destroys the churches wholesale and the church members by the millions....
- Millions now Living Will Never Die, 1920, pg. 89, 90 Therefore we may confidently expect that 1925 will mark the return of Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and the faithful prophets of old...."
- Vindication 1, 1931, pg 146, 338, 339 ...years 1914,1918 and 1925 ..... they also learned to quit fixing dates for the future and predicting what would come to pass on certain dates....
- Informant, May 1940 The year 1940 is certain to be the most important year yet because Armageddon is very near.
- Wt, 9/15/1941, pg 288 ...in the remaining months before Armageddon.
- Wt, 5/1/1968, pg 273 Chart of dates 1975 end of 6th 1000-year day...2975 end of 7th 1000-year day....
- Aw, 1/22/1969, pg 16 Other Bible prophecies clearly foretell God’s purpose to bring this wicked system to an end in a few years.
- Aw, 5/22/1969, pg 15 If you are a young person, you also need to face the fact that you will never grow old in this present system of things. .....all evidence in fulfillment of Bible prophecy indicates that this corrupt system is due to end in a few years. ....as a young person you will never fulfill any career that this system offers. If you are in high school and thinking about a college education, it means at least four, perhaps even six or eight more years to graduate into a specialized career. But where will this system of things be by that time? It will be well on the way toward its finish, if not actually gone!
- Wt, 10/15/1969, pg 622, 623 ...seventh millennium from man’s creation by Jehovah God would begin in less than ten years.
- The Nations Shall Know That I Am Jehovah, 1971, pg 216 Shortly, within our twentieth century, the "battle in the day if Jehovah" will begin against modern antitype of Jerusalem, Christendom.
- Wt, 1/1/1989, pg 12 The apostle Paul was spearheading the Christian missionary activity. He was also laying a foundation for a work that would be completed in our 20th century. (This quote was later changed in the WT bound volume to: He was also laying a foundation for a work that would be completed in our day.)
- In 2010 the generation of 1914 that would not pass away has changed to overlapping generations. See Item I K
H. They blamed other religions for setting dates and called them false prophets.
- Light 1930, pg 47, They have been prophesying particularly since 1918, and everyone knows that their prophecies to date have not come to pass; and that alone is strong evidence that they are false prophets.
- Wt, 10/15/1958, pg 613, “Sometime between April 15 and 23, 1957, Armageddon will sweep the World!...” So prophesied a certain California pastor Mihran Ask, in January 1957.....Such false prophets tend to......
- Aw, 10/8/1968, pg23 ...those in times past who predicted an “end of the world”, even announcing a specific date...they were guilty of false prophesying.
- Paradise Restored 1972, pg 353,354, Jehovah, the God of the true prophets, will put all false prophets to shame either by not fulfilling the false prediction of such self-assuming prophets or by having his own prophecies fulfilled in a way opposite to that predicted by the false prophets. False prophets will try to hide who they really are.
- Wt, 6/15/1974, pg 381 Similarly the “false prophet” is not a person, but is a system or an organization. A “prophet” claims to have inspired information for the direction of others.
- Aw, 12/8/1981, pg 14, Since the Bible speaks about only “one faith,” All of today’s religious groups outside the one true faith must, according to this standard, be counterfeits, composite, “false prophets.
I. They predicted other events.
- The Truth Shall Make You Free, 1943 ,pg 285, ....Man on earth can no more get rid of these demonic “heavens” than man can by airplane or rockets or other means get up above the air envelope...
- Wt,7/15/1960, pg 444 In 1942 the “faithful and discreet slave” guided by Jehovah’s unerring spirit made known that the democracies would win World War II .... “faithful and discreet slave” has been tipped off ahead of time.....
J. They say they are not a False Prophet.
- Aw, 3/22/1993, pg 3, 4, They do not claim that their predictions are direct revelations from Jehovah and that in this sense they are prophesying in Jehovah’s name. ......when their words do not come true, they should not be viewed as false prophets....
K.The generation of 1914 that would not pass away has changed to overlapping generations. (Another failed prediction)
- All the literature before 1995spoke of the generation that was 10-15 years old or born during 1914 would not pass away before Armageddon.
- Wt, 11/1/1995, pg 14, ... Jesus was not departing from his established use of the term “this generation” which he consistently applied to the contemporary masses.....
- Wt, 11/1/1995, pg 17 Rather than provide a rule for measuring time, the term “generation” as used by Jesus refers to a contemporary people of a certain historical period.....
- Wt, 11/1/1995, pg 19, Therefore, in the fulfillment of Jesus’ prophecy today, “this generation” apparently refers to the peoples of the earth who see the sign of Christ’s presence but fail to mend their ways.
- Wt, 4/15/2010 pg 10, He evidently meant that the lives of the anointed who were on hand when the sign began to become evident in 1914 would overlap with the lives of other anointed ones who would see the start of the great tribulation.
Can you get an Amen ?????
Nope, not even wit a HA-LE- LU-YA thrown in
BLONDIE two thumbs up and a snap
Matthew 24:14
@NomadSoul
"Well, there is new light that has shined upon the meaning of generation."
The Watchtower Society focuses on the scripture in Proverbs 4:18 as support of their changing or developing doctrines. That verse states:
"But the path of the righteous ones is like the bright light that is getting lighter and lighter until the day is firmly established."
Far from being justification for an organization's change in doctrine, the verse when read in its context (In other words, read the entire chapter) concerns advice from a father to his children. It is not to be taken in part as an excuse or a crutch to be used by an organization for modification of their teachings.
However, for the sake of argument, let's say their interpretation is correct. Does it apply to the factual history of the organization's teaching?
Generation (Mathew 24:34)...
-1927 = The Anointed
[Watchtower February 15, 1927 page 62]
-1942 = Anyone alive to see 1914
[Watchtower July 1, 1942 page 204]
-1995 = Wicked People alive today
[Watchtower November 1, 1995 page 19]
-2008 = The Anointed
[Watchtower February 15, 2008 page 24]
-2010 = Overlap Generations of the Anointed since 1914
[Watchtower April 15, 2010 page 10]
In summary, the Watchtower Society’s teaching concerning the meaning of 'generation' as recorded in Matthew was first 'correctly' understood to be 'The Anointed' in 1927. But brighter light caused it to become an incorrect teaching of a couple of different things over the course of 81 years, only to return back to the original ‘correct’ 1927 teaching of 'The Anointed'. However, a few years after it has proved to be not completely accurate and needed more 'tweaking' to overlap generations of the Anointed since 1914.
Just looking at their flip-flopping on the generation teaching alone it is evident that while the Watchtower Society loves to focus attention to Proverbs 4:18, perhaps they should be paying more attention to the verse that follows it. In Proverbs 4:19 it states:
"The way of the wicked ones is like the gloom; they have not known at what they keep stumbling."
@NomadSoul
"Matthew 24:14"
Listing that scripture the implication is the message Jesus and his followers preached according to the Bible, and the message Jehovah's Witnesses preach is the same.
This is not true.
Also, just popping one scripture up out of context proves not a thing. But since that's your thing here's one for you straight from The New World Translation:
Luke 10:7...
"So stay in that house, eating and drinking the things they provide, for the worker is worthy of his wages. Do not be transferring from house to house."
Evidently. But are their claims reasonable? What do the facts show?
That's how I should've started my conversation. Thank you brother.
What do the facts show? That Jerusalem was destroyed in 607 BC. 2,520 years later Jesus was placed in his throne by the almighty Jehovah in 1914, can I get an amen?!
In our day, seemingly learned men, educated in the wisdom of this world, may say otherwise. Their goal is to convince you of their view, and they may even do so with religious fervor. They seek to further their own careers in pursuit of fame by sifting the facts. In stark contrast, Jehovah's people are humble, unlettered and ordinary. They allow Jehovah, who knows the beginning from the end, to guide them into all truth. Yes brother, in the name of our now-reigning king, Jesus, whom the facts show was evidently placed on his throne by Jehovah in 1914, Amen.
