Is the Holy Spirit God Himself or a force like in Star Wars?

by I_love_Jeff 224 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  truthseeker

  PS,

  I understand what you're saying.

  God creating Jesus is typified in the separation of Eve from Adam, except in reverse. Jesus came from the female. Eve came from the male. In this way God duplicated the process. Jesus is from the symbolic rib of Father. And like all humans who came forth from Adam and Eve who procreated, the same applies to God and Jesus. The first fruits of Jesus' ability to create. Yet Jesus did not make something out of thin air. He created in a bi-creative manner by using what his Father provided.

  Life-force did not occur from Jesus' efforts. Life-force occurred from the only One that can animate life. In that respect, Jesus typified Adam as the male source that had conception with Eve, because Jesus built the framework of all things in existence, but God infused that framework with the force of life. Moving through the existence of God is the spiral effect because all things move and all things that have life that are moving.
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  Qcmbr

  So Adam and Eve not only had sibling sex, they were both genetically male? Jesus was sexless since he only came from Eve? Super.
• 

  truthseeker

  I never said that! Adam and Eve are what I would call "split energies" - the male and female half.
• 

  Qcmbr

  Sorry I have to correct my obvious booboo Jesus came from Mary.

  I knew that.
• 

  PSacramento

  We need to diffrentiated between The Word of God (Logos/Son of God) and the incarnation of said word, Jesus.

  The Trinity doctrine tries to do that but we need to remeber that it does that with words and terms DIRECTED to 4th century Hellenized people.

  One of the best ( and worse) anologies is that of Cerebrus, the 3 headed Dog - One being, One nature, One substance, 3 "persons".

  God is a spiritual being and in Gods nature resides The "persons" of the Father, Son and HS and because they sahre the same nature and essence, they are equal in THAT but differ to each other in their purpose.

  Now, I am NOT a trinitarian and the reason is that, as we can see, that doctrine tends to confuse more than enlighten.

  But I agree that Father and Son share the same nature and essence ( hence both are "GOD") and that the HS is BOTH ( the HS as Christ and the HS as the spirit of God).

  IF we were to formulate a doctrine of God's nature in our day and time and directed to the people of today, it probably would be worded as the Trinity doctrine is.
• 

  Qcmbr

  Why can't they just be three separate people? How about redefining god to not be a monotheistic title but a title like father, exclusive to the child but shared by many? Seems the simplest way to interpret the scriptures is to read them as follows:

  The gods create the earth.

  The chief god , Elohim, ( has a body ) walks in the garden and talks with Adam and Eve. After fall Elohim can no longer directly interact with man.

  The spiritual son of chief god , Jehovah makes a covenant with Israel.

  Jehovah adds a body to his spirit while being born of Mary ( impregnated by sperm from chief god Elohim )

  Jehovah is confirmed by Elohim and god 3 ( Holy Spirit ) at baptism.

  Jehovah dies alone at cruxifiction returning to a spirit sans body.

  Jehovah returns but cannot be touched ( ?) spirit and body re- united. Leaves to be glorified like Elohim. Can no longer interact directly with man.

  Holy Spirit , god 3 , last remaining god who can interact with man until final return where everything evil is destroyed by presence of glorified Elohim and Jehovah.

  At all times all 3 can represent each other as they are united as one in purpose, aim and message.

  Holy Spirit will one day gain body and be glorified.

  Twist . Adam is Holy Spirit. So Holy Spirit is also father of all, Adam is yet to be resurrected and won't be till story is finished.

  Story tied up in nice eternal round, all difficult scriptures explained by reference to which of the three gods are speaking all trinity arguments explained. Voila.
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  PSacramento

  Yeah, that's much simplier, LOL !
• 

  Qcmbr

  Hey I did that in one post ! This thread has pages of more twisty logic by far. Why would Jesus getting a resurrected body be such a big deal if Elohim didn't already have one ?
• 

  PSacramento

  Hey I did that in one post ! This thread has pages of more twisty logic by far. Why would Jesus getting a resurrected body be such a big deal if Elohim didn't already have one ?

  Don't knock twisted logic, it makes for a good reason to drink !

  The problem is that IF one takes the OT proclamation of there is only ONE GOD, then how can there be more than one?
• 

  truthseeker

  PS

  The problem is that IF one takes the OT proclamation of there is only ONE GOD, then how can there be more than one?

  If there was more than one reality, then the possibility of there being more than one God could be realized :)