Could Christians please respond; Is there a penalty for rejecting Jesus? (page 6)

cofty

What dumb things did Jesus say?!

Go and read the gospels again without your christian glasses on. A lot of what Jesus is claimed to have said is just daft or wrong. Why do even atheists fall into the intellectually lazy trap of agreeing that Jesus was a great and wise man. No he wasn't, he was a bit more insightful than the average 1st Century person at best.

If you think that a watch or clock is evidence for a designer/creator (men), why do you think the complexity of humans, creation, universe is not a drop of evidence for an intelligent, supernatural Creator?!

Please not Paley's watch! This is not the thread for a debate on origins but you will have to do better than "evidence" from design. You clearly have not began to understand the first thing about evolution.

Most atheists do not deny the historicity of Christ. If you think Plato existed, you should not doubt that Jesus did.

I tend to agree there was a man who lived and on whose life the gospels are very loosley based. The case against the historicity of Jesus is not as easily dismissed as you may imagine.

The Bible is historical narrative, not fairy tale.

The bible is full of contradictions and inconsistencies.

Jesus claimed to be God. If He is not Lord, you must show that the evidence fits legend, liar, lunatic.

No I have no such obligation - it is a false trilemma. How about mistaken, myth, legend, exaggeration etc etc. You are the one making extraordinary claims about Jeus supernatural origins - you have the burden of proof.

You were lost as a JW, but are now even more lost as an atheist/agnostic.

As I told you above I was a christian - born again, trinitarian, washed-in-the-blood, re-baptised, praaaaaaise Jeeeeesus for 9 years. Life makes sense now.

Mary

Hell is pretty much out of vogue these days so if this rabid atheist decidedly turns his back on God and/or Christ what will become of me?

Absolutely nothing.....However, if you reject the Faithless and Incontinent Slobber Class----oh man, you're SOL both in this life and that which is to come....

PSacramento

So c'mon watersprout, PSac - be blunt.

What's my fate?

I don't know Bro, YOU tell me, what is YOUR fate?

Have you rejected Christ or do you not believe in Christ and why?

PSacramento

I am now convinced it is all nonsense. Worse than that it is divisive, elitist, dangerous nonsense

It pains me that you were exposed to such a horrific expression of Christ's Love, truly it does.

Pika_Chu

Holy crap. I leave for a day and all this fundie crap again?

@snowbird: They're coming, seriously? Well, just so you know, I'll leave the door open for God. I just won't expect him to come by.

@watersprout: in the case that god would reveal himself to me, I would question it. I would be skeptical as to whether such a thing really happened. If it turned out to be verified and undeniable, sure, I would embrace God. But personal revelation isn't very convincing.

@godrulz: the thing is, if we say the notion that God is not real is something made up by Satan, we have to prove Satan is a real person. Evidence first, then conclusions.

@cofty: I totally agree. The "watch" analogy is getting extremely old. The thing is, we see watches and conclude they must be made by men. We don't see watches reproducing, adapting to changing environments, growing on trees, forming due to plate tectonics, etc. No, those things are natural and have natural explanations. No supernatural explainations are necessary to explain NATURE!!!

I also agree that religion is the perfect behaviour control mechanism. Not just behaviour, but thoughts. If God will punish us for being atheists, when we value reason above blindness, like I said before, he would be a very cruel being, one who only loves his creation conditionally. Such a God is unworthy of worship, for he is no better than wicked humans.

godrulz

Trees growing, plates moving, etc. are part of creation, not the cause of it. Something does not come from nothing. God is the uncreated First Cause/Creator. Microevolution is adaptation, but there is no evidence for macroevolution.

DanaBug

Godrulz, please verify that what you're saying about evolution is correct, otherwise there's no point in arguing it.

Here are some sites I found helpful: http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evolibrary/article/evo_01

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn9953-instant-expert-evolution.html

TDaze

Has anyone called Poe on godrulz already? If not, I'd be willing to do it. He's spouting all the uninformed bullcrap in the book. Can't possibly be real.

PSacramento

in the case that god would reveal himself to me, I would question it. I would be skeptical as to whether such a thing really happened. If it turned out to be verified and undeniable, sure, I would embrace God. But personal revelation isn't very convincing.

And yet it is the one thing that will convince ANY non-believer and the one thing that everyone still "asks for" as "proof".

Pika_Chu

@godrulz: you are backing your case up with more assumptions. Prove to me plate tectonics is evidence of creation. Oh yeah, and if something can't come from nothing, then I guess God can't make anything either. What do YOU think he made the universe out of? Nothing? Were the materials already there? One more thing: please distinguish between macro and micro evolution. Please let me know YOUR definition of those two things, so I can be sure we are on the same page.

@Psac: yes, we ask for it as proof, because we do NOT believe god has revealed himself to humanity. Not through his "creation," not through writings, and certainly not through his silence. When all that fails, what else can one look forward to from god, if he exists?

Could Christians please respond; Is there a penalty for rejecting Jesus?

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