What say you Christians ???

by wobble 277 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  FlyingHighNow

  "Judging others makes us blind, whereas love is illuminating. By judging others we blind ourselves to our own evil and to the grace which others are just as entitled to as we are." ~Dietrich Bonhoeffer

  If He is "Love" as John says in his letter, and if He is Just, as claimed in the Bible, I can only conclude that I have nothing to fear, He will judge me as being worthy of the "reward", because I lived according to my conscience.

  From my JWN profile:
  Please measure your god against this scripture:
  ''He that does not love has not come to know God because God is love.'' 1 John 4:8 ******
  While doing that keep in mind 1 Corinthians 13: 4-8 .*****

  All sin really is is inperfection. If Jesus came to save us from imperfection, then it's a good thing.
• 

  watersprout

  My question, and observation is this : I had nothing to do with whatever you say Adam and Eve did wrong, I have always, throughout my life, treated whoever I came into contact with compassion, respect and love.

  If only everyone did that, then we would live in a much nicer world!

  So, is your God going to judge me for the "sin" of some mythical forebears of mine ?

  You will be judged on how YOU lived YOUR life. What you did/didn't do and how you treated others.

  Is he going to say that , because I did not believe in him, I willl be judged adversely, even though I lived by the precepts He is supposed to support ?

  All Christ asked ones to do is show ''love'' towards others. I cannot speak for what/how God will judge the human race. I would much rather be judged by God than another human. Humans when they got their ''judging'' hat on are mean!

  All I can say is, if your God is like that, I REFUSE to worship or acknowledge Him.

  The God i serve isn't like that... Neither is His son.

  And I certainly do not want to get to know him. even if you call Him Jesus.

  That's sad. I know what you mean. Some of the evangelists on this site worship a mean God.

  Peace
• 

  PSacramento

  The big question eh?

  Will those that live by "christian values" be saved liek those thet live AND proclaim them?

  Luckly we have an advocate for Us ALL, Our Lord Jesus who, having been one of us, just like Us, thought US worthy sufering and die for, not just those that believed and proclaimed their belief, but for ALL of US.

  Now, the "golden rule" is a much mentioned rule but I do think that at times we forget that, for a Christian, it is a starting point, not an end point.

  We are to love each other and to do to others what we would liek done to us, TO START.

  Then we are to love those that hate and persecute Us, pray for them and for their salvation, just as Our Lord did.

  God's grace is for all, for he loved the world so much that His Only Begotten Son showed Our Value to HIM, by sacrificing himself for Our SIN, which sin?

  Pride,THE sin that goeth before the fall.

  Wobble, my dearest wobble :)

  You are loved beyond what you can possibly know, in a way that you can't possibly fathom and that love is given to you, freely, because God KNOWS you, even though you don't "know" God, YET.

  But you will my brother, you will and on that day you will be so filled with love and joy that, well...you'll see :)
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  Pika_Chu

  I agree, Wobble. A God who does not make his existence obvious and then judges worldlings who are not convinced of that existence can hardly be considered benevolent. And, even as an atheist, I live by the Golden Rule as well, I just think it's common sense and the result of a highly developed brain which brings us the ability to feel empathy. Treat others how you want to be treated, not because someone bigger than you says so and promises you a reward for it, but do it because you know it's the loving thing to do.
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  godrulz

  Prodigal/Pika; God has made Himself plain and you are without excuse (Rom. 1). As well, He created Lucifer, NOT Satan. Satan, demons, free will explain evil that brought grief to God and the universe. God will triumph over evil in the end. You impugn His character and ways because you distort His Word out of ignorance. He is loving, but He is also holy. Jesus is God with a face. What fault do you find with Him?
• 

  Chalam

  Here a few verses for godrulz

  Romans 5:12

  English Standard Version (ESV)

  Death in Adam, Life in Christ

  12 Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned—

  Romans 5:15

  English Standard Version (ESV)

  15 But the free gift is not like the trespass. For if many died through one man’s trespass, much more have the grace of God and the free gift by the grace of that one man Jesus Christ abounded for many.

  Romans 5:17-19

  English Standard Version (ESV)

  17 For if, because of one man’s trespass, death reigned through that one man, much more will those who receive the abundance of grace and the free gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man Jesus Christ.

  18 Therefore, as one trespass [ a ] led to condemnation for all men, so one act of righteousness [ b ] leads to justification and life for all men. 19 For as by the one man’s disobedience the many were made sinners, so by the one man’s obedience the many will be made righteous.

  Footnotes:

  1. Romans 5:18 Or the trespass of one
  2. Romans 5:18 Or the act of righteousness of one

  1 Corinthians 15:21-22

  English Standard Version (ESV)

  21 For as by a man came death, by a man has come also the resurrection of the dead. 22 For as in Adam all die, so also in Christ shall all be made alive.

  Tammy, didn't Satan sin before Adam?

  Genesis 3, Ezekiel 28

  Blessings in Christ,

  Stephen
• 

  Pika_Chu

  Prodigal/Pika; God has made Himself plain and you are without excuse (Rom. 1). As well, He created Lucifer, NOT Satan. Satan, demons, free will explain evil that brought grief to God and the universe. God will triumph over evil in the end. You impugn His character and ways because you distort His Word out of ignorance. He is loving, but He is also holy. Jesus is God with a face. What fault do you find with Him?

  Uh, sorry if I offended you with my atheism, but I was merely saying that what you and others may consider evidence, I do not find convincing. I'm sorry if I sounded harsh in saying that, but I feel my reasons for unbelief are legitimate. I didn'd "distort his word out of ignorance" (perhaps you were referring to Prodigal Son?), and I see no reason to believe that the Bible is God's word. We could discuss this in greater detail if you wish, but I would suggest starting another thread, because this isn't discussing God in general, just the evil/free will/morality part of things.
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  FlyingHighNow

  "Christ has no body now on earth but yours, no hands but yours, no feet but ours,
  Yours are the eyes through which to look out Christ's compassion to the world Yours are the feet with which he is to go about doing good; Yours are the hands with which he is to bless people now." ~Teresa of Avila

  Do you think he cares if someone is Christian, Muslim, Buddhist, angostic or atheistic? It's the goodness in people that he cares about. The compassion, the empathy, the kindness. I know some strict, staunch Christians who are not kind or compassionate.
• 

  mdb

  "Essentually you are born already in debt to the church.. I mean "god"." That's not biblical. Jesus said that we need to be like children.

  No, Jesus said we need to have the "faith" of a little child, not "be like children". The Scriptures also say we are to put childish ways behind us as we grow and mature. You're still born into sin. Read the Scriptures (and I don't mean the NWT).

  Thanks for all the comments, and you all seem to have a clear understanding of the biblical view of sin and judgement.

  But how well do you guys know your God ?

  In the O.P I pointed out that I do not believe in God. So my question was, if He did exist, on what basis would he judge me ?

  If He is "Love" as John says in his letter, and if He is Just, as claimed in the Bible, I can only conclude that I have nothing to fear, He will judge me as being worthy of the "reward", because I lived according to my conscience.

  Even though I did not believe in His existence.

  If He is going to judge me adversely when I see no evidence for His existence that he has provided, then as I said:

  "He does not come up to my standards"

  You live according to your consience? And if your conscience is seared? You don't believe in Him and have therefore denied God, your maker. You are without excuse and He has said that all creation proves His is. You think your life is generally good, but if you transgress in ONE commandment and God, being a just Judge, does not punish the guilty then He is no longer just. God is loving and that is why He gave of Himself and died in your place - to save you from that judgement. It's a free gift (except that it cost Jesus His life). How can you say He is not loving because He punishes the unjust? The righteous will live by faith in Jesus and those who deny Jesus have called God a liar.

  God will judge you by the same standard as those who do believe in Him. Your unbelief doesn't change that and you will still stand before Him and your unbelief will not deliver you from His righteous judgement. In fact, just believing in God means nothing. Even the devils believe and tremble. It's faith in Jesus and the saving work He did on the cross that saves you.
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  FlyingHighNow

  mdb, not all Christians think the Bible is meant to be taken as God's literal words to humankind.