Undercover apostates...

by Maze 93 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • ThomasCovenant

    Maze said, ''The only conclusion to be reached is "undercover apostate" stories are cooked up on the internet''

    Yes, logically that is the only conclusion to be reached. Well done. I'd never thought of that before. Thank you.

  • dozy

    With respect , if "undercover apostates" are cooked up stories on the internet , how do you explain why WTBTS publications such as the elders book appear online on "apostate sites" long before the average publisher gets them , often before they are officially released by Bethel? What about elders & CO letters - posted long before they are on general release? Information on the scrapping of the congregation book study was in the public domain long before the official announcement.

    I think it is a bit harsh to call people in this situation "undercover apostates". Many are in a kind of limbo situation , aware that the WTBTS isn't "the truth" but trying to work things out or fade (I myself was in this situation for a couple of years , while serving as an elder.)

    A relative of mine stepped down as an elder a year or so ago - he knows it isn't the truth but stays in for family reasons (elderly parents & aunts / uncles) where he has financial obligations (his & his wife's JW siblings don't bother). He goes out a couple of times a month on the ministry with his wife , making a few route calls on the old people that he has had on his route for years , so he is still (technically) an active publisher. He also is involved in the RBC , often going away on building projects in the UK & abroad. He feels that , on balance , it is manageable , at least in the short to medium term , although he is fully aware of the hypocrisy in his situation. He knows of a few serving elders , including a CO, who are of like mind.

  • jean-luc picard
    jean-luc picard


    I'm frankly amazed that you needed to ask this question!

  • Black Sheep
    Black Sheep

    On the rare occasions when you drag yourself to the KH to sit in the back row looking at your shoes, your church's DF/DA & shunning policy ensures that you can never know if the person on the platform is a closet apostate or a good Jdubya.

    It doesn't matter if they are 6 or 60, there is no guarantee that they aren't there solely because of the threat of emotional blackmail by their Jeckle & Hyde family.

  • slimboyfat

    I'm an undercover semi-apostate, if you please!

  • nugget

    The reason why some attend although they no longer believe is because the organisation holds families hostage. Leaving the religion means being dead to family and friends.

    When you join, the organisation encourages you to cut ties with any friends you have that are not JWs it makes you reduce contact with worldly relatives and soon all your social network is exclusively JW. This is a deliberate strategy meaning that leaving the organisation becomes problematic if you wish to keep in contact with these people that you love.

    It is a form of control. Many on the board are ex elders, ex ms, ex pioneers and ex bethelites. For many there was a period between discovery of the board and stepping down. It is not easy to step down without ringing alarm bells and it can take time.

    I have met many members of the board and heard their stories they have come across as genuine people dealing with a tricky situation. Just because it has not happened to you or you may do things differently it does not mean that people are making stories up.

    People who do not believe JW teachings do attend meetings and go on service, perhaps you should question an organisation that holds people hostage in the name of religion and forces people to do this merely so they can talk to their parent.

  • sizemik

    It's a shameful situation . . . and the blame lies squarely with those who created it

  • Room 215
    Room 215

    "Apostate" is the most heinous misapplication of the language when referring to people find it impossible to uncritically submit their minds and consciences to religious authority, or to raise any question whatsoever, however respectfully expressed. As Cervantes said "I can live with questions I can't answer, but not with those I can't ask (or, put another way, "answers I can't question").

  • ProdigalSon

    When you take an ancient book, written centuries after it is alleged to be written, with components cherry-picked by the Roman Church, redacted, interpolated, and outright changed, and 1600 years later, in the midst of the Information Age, still strain the ever-loving gnat out of it in a desperate attempt to find everlasting life on its pages (John 5:39), you will, in the process, destroy lives and families in Pharasaic needlessness. The problem starts right there. All the Watchtower does is capitali$e on the "Word of God" delusion, which has been proven on this site to be a fallacy in every which way imaginable. And even then, the Watchtower needs to twist it, change it, interpolate it, and redact it (yes, they REMOVED 10 percent of the "Received Text") due to their modern-day NO(O) LITE, thanks to having a direct line of communication with an angry deity who cannot make up his mind on much, in order to make their artfully contrived, pulled-out-of-their-asses doctrines and interpretations work, scripturally. That's right, before they had a New World [Order] Mistranslation, they used King James Bibles, and Rutherford told them to take magic markers and cross out ten percent of it. Yes, Rutherford, of the drunken, womanizing, hypnotizing, demon-channeling, Nazi-pandering, Beth-Sarim-dwelling Charlatan Class. So go ahead, keep quoting those scriptures to prove your points.... we might as well quote from the Catholic Encyclopedia and have it dictate our lives.

    JW's cannot think for themselves, so they rely on the Watchtower to think for them. Some people, after becoming disillusioned with the Watchtower, still unable to think for themselves, turn to the Bible to think for them. Either way, its a Golden Calf, an Idol, preventing you from EVER finding the True God, which can only be sought within. The Bible, with all its corruptions, faults and problems, STILL clearly says as much, and you don't even need to read between the lines. Just READ, and THINK for yourself.

  • CuriousButterfly

    Maze I am still in due to my family. If you have read threads and posts from members you would plainly see why MOST are still in.

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