Most-Ignored Scriptures by JWs

by Mad Sweeney 508 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • Olin Moyles Ghost
    Olin Moyles Ghost

    MadJw: the things one learns from the Bble (not church) far surpasses the knowledge of men- except for science and technology.

    Ha! Good one. So your position is that the following nuggets of "Bible Truth" far surpass the knowledge of men? Please explain.

    • Exodus 21:7-11 - God permits and condones selling your daughter as a sex slave
    • Deuteronomy 22:28-29 - a man who rapes a virgin is required to marry her--according to God's "perfect" law that "far surpasses the knowledge of men"
    • Revelation 22:7 - Jesus tells John that he's "coming quickly"--it's almost 2,000 years since those words were recorded and he isn't here yet (oh yeah, that's right, you believe he's been "invisibly present"--whatever that means--since 1914...it's still not "quickly"...Ha!)
    • Of course there's the whole notion of a global flood just over 4,000 years ago--another laughably absurd proposition from the Bible...and the list goes on and on...
  • Chalam
    Chalam

    Here's another that is lost on JWs

    Psalm 23:4 (New International Version)

    4 Even though I walk
    through the valley of the shadow of death,
    I will fear no evil,
    for you are with me;
    your rod and your staff,
    they comfort me.

    Blessings,

    Stephen

  • upnorth
    upnorth

    I can't read 16 pages of posts Photobucket

  • Chalam
  • Olin Moyles Ghost
    Olin Moyles Ghost

    Bump for MadJw--care to explain how "the Bible far surpasses the knowledge of men"? For your convenience, I'll copy my earlier post below:

    ----------------------------------------

    MadJw: the things one learns from the Bble (not church) far surpasses the knowledge of men- except for science and technology.

    Ha! Good one. So your position is that the following nuggets of "Bible Truth" far surpass the knowledge of men? Please explain.

    • Exodus 21:7-11 - God permits and condones selling your daughter as a sex slave
    • Deuteronomy 22:28-29 - a man who rapes a virgin is required to marry her--according to God's "perfect" law that "far surpasses the knowledge of men"
    • Revelation 22:7 - Jesus tells John that he's "coming quickly"--it's almost 2,000 years since those words were recorded and he isn't here yet (oh yeah, that's right, you believe he's been "invisibly present"--whatever that means--since 1914...it's still not "quickly"...Ha!)
    • Of course there's the whole notion of a global flood just over 4,000 years ago--another laughably absurd proposition from the Bible...and the list goes on and on...
  • theMadJW
    theMadJW

    Ignored? Only according to CHURCHianity.

    (1) Ex 21: 7 “When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. 8 If she does not satisfy her owner, he must allow her to be bought back again. But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her. 9 But if the slave’s owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave but as a daughter.

    10 “If a man who has married a slave wife takes another wife for himself, he must not neglect the rights of the first wife to food, clothing, and sexual intimacy. 11 If he fails in any of these three obligations, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment.

    Mad: Human Societies of those ancient times is alien to us; all in those areas had "slaves" (similar to "employees", and "butlers"), but sex slave?Certainly there would be cases of the abused by the demented- but is not being referred to here.

    (2)Deut 22- If one reads the entiire chapter, instead of CnPing from idiot websites, one will see that their was guilt on the one being raped, as contrasted with the one raping normally executed.

    (3) Rev 22- "Jesus tells John that he's "coming quickly"----" Revelation opens saying it is a Symbolic ('signified' ) vision of the Lasdt Days. Jesus said he didn't know the time- ONLY his God, and in many illustrations revealed it would be a considerable period of time in the Future, yet encouraged all (as the other Bible writers did) to keep the day CLOSE IN MIND- even tho not KNOWING when it would come.

    (4) Those laughing at the Global Flood- confrimed by Christ- put their faith in Science. Your choice. Science has many laughable theories taught as fact, and knows FAR less than it THINKS it does!

    Any OTHER scriptures you think we ignore?

  • Olin Moyles Ghost
    Olin Moyles Ghost

    MadJw, thanks for responding. A few observations on your comments:

    1) Exodus 21:7-11. Are you seriously denying the plain words of your Holy Book and saying that this is not sex slavery? Read the words. Verse 7: a man sells his daughter as a slave. Verse 8: if she does not satisfy him, he can sell her back. Verse 9: he can give her to his son as a wife. This is simple. God's perfect law allows a man to sell his daughter to another man as a slave. The purchaser of said daughter can either choose to have sex with her or give her to his son for him to have sex with her. So, this poor girl is a slave who is sold to someone who has sex with her. That is a "sex slave." Stop denying the parts of the Bible that (hopefully) offend your sensibilities.

    2) Deuteronomy 22: Your remark doesn't make sense. I'll just point out that the scripture allows a man to take a virgin, violate her, and marry her. Note that if the same man had done the same thing to married woman, he would be executed. Just another example of how the Bible is just like many other primitive set of rules, and treats women as property.

    3) Rev. 22: so "coming quickly" doesn't really mean "coming quickly". You sound just like those idiot trinitarians and hell-fire folks you make fun of. Ha!

    4) Genesis flood. So you admit that there's no proof and your're just going by what some guys say that Jesus said. Wonderful. Definitely something to base your life on!

  • theMadJW
    theMadJW

    Casper, MANY women- and MEN- were "slaves". proving the services that a butler, a nanny, and a janitor, etc would today. "Satisfy" is NOT referring to sex- for God has always condemned sex outside of marriage. Deut 22 shows that if the woman never cried out for help when the man that had raped her, and kept it secret until discoverd, that they should be married. They were crude rules for a crude people: Christ showed how MANY of the laws allowed for their cruel hearts- possibly knowing certain tghings would need time to change.

    Revelation shows events leading UP to the "coming quickly"- it was a FUTURE time.

    The flood is recounted by nearly EVERY ancient culture- with their own versions. Yes, I believe what Christ and scripture says; the scoffing and lack of "proof" referred to by Science means little. (Mammoths flash frozen, and the many references to it by ancient cultures means nothing to them)

    I appreciate your kind questioning, instead of the regular arrogant assumptions of many!

  • Olin Moyles Ghost
    Olin Moyles Ghost

    MadJw, I'm aware that primitive ancient cultures (such as those described in the Bible and elsewhere) kept slaves. My simple point is that this passage from Exodus 21 permits a man to sell his daughter to another man as a slave, and that purchaser is permitted to have sex with her. My argument has nothing to do with sex outside marriage. As you likely know, primitive cultures such as those portrayed in the Bible permitted polygamy. So the girl's purchaser may very well have married her; or as verse 9 points out, he could give her to his son as a wife. Nonetheless, she is a slave with whom the purchaser (or his son) may have sex. Thus, a sex slave.

    I feel like I've explained this clearly enough, and I understand your desire to rationalize the nasty portions of the Old Testament. Once upon a time, I would have done the same. It seems that you realize the unpleasantness of the whole slavery arrangement and the treatment of women in the Mosaic law. That's good. And that's why I raised this scripture in response to your statement that "the Bible far surpasses the knowledge of men." I'm afraid I must disagree with this statement. The scriptures I identified (as well as others) show that the Bible is quite consistent with the knowledge of men in the ancient near east.

    And, regarding Revelation, I understand that you believe that large portions were fulfilled in the early 20th century. For example, you believe that the 7 trumpet blasts occurred in the 1920s at 7 district conventions and that Satan was cast out of heaven in 1914. But if you simply read chapter 22, it's painfully clear that Jesus was telling John that he was coming quickly. Read verses 8-13 in particular. Jesus is speaking to John IN THE PRESENT. Here it is:

    8 I, John, am the one who heard and saw these things. And when I had heard and seen them, I fell down to worship at the feet of the angel who had been showing them to me. 9 But he said to me, "Do not do it! I am a fellow servant with you and with your brothers the prophets and of all who keep the words of this book. Worship God!"

    10 Then he told me, "Do not seal up the words of the prophecy of this book, because the time is near. 11 Let him who does wrong continue to do wrong; let him who is vile continue to be vile; let him who does right continue to do right; and let him who is holy continue to be holy."

    12 "Behold, I am coming soon! My reward is with me, and I will give to everyone according to what he has done. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End.

    Now, you can twist things around all you like (I've found that religious people love to do that), but if you simply read the verses, it is clear that Jesus was not talking about "coming soon" in 2000 years! Read verses 8-9 to set the background, then read verses 10-12 to see what he said. Seems pretty simple to me.

    This post is already too long, so I won't spend much time on the flood myth. Of course there were localized floods in ancient times, just like today. In fact, floods affected ancient people more than modern people because they had to live close to bodies of water and they lived in primitive homes. Thus, it's not surprising at all that lots of cultures have flood stories. But what Genesis describes is a global flood covering all the world's tallest mountains (e.g., Mt. Everest!).

    To me, the Genesis flood myth is another example of how the Bible is simply another collection of ancient literature. It's not without merit, and there is some true history in it--just like other ancient works. But is it the infallible word of an almighty God (2 Tim 3:16)? Of course not.

  • theMadJW
    theMadJW

    OK, Casper- do you have any reference other than Opinion that sex was expected?

    And- NO; those Ridiculous Opinions of the WTBS have nombearing on the fact that Reveklation was about a far future time- as most were,

    Rev 1: 10- I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and I heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet...

    "The Lord's Day"- the Day of Fury- Armageddon was to take place at a time even JESUS didn't know- yet he said many things would take place BEFORE it came, then gave the signs that would SHOW it was NEAR. Worldwide conditions including "unless those days were cut SHORT, NO flesh would be saved", as confirmed in Revelation as he will ruin those ruining the Earth. No other time in history matches that- only modern times where man is ruining the entire Earth, and MANY things threaten his existance. John came to BE in that day "in the spirit"- in vision.

    A local flood would not generate the legends of a huge flood that wiped most of mankind out. A worldwide flood would have severly changed the landscape, as Genesis shows the waters were PULLED INTO the Earth- lowering the landscape, incresing the size of the mountains....IF it happened!

    The Bible is the ONLY book giving SENSIBLE accounts of how life started- especially when compared with all the ancient religions, and today's Evolution Theory. (NOT be be confused with the absurd church versions where man lives with dinosaurs, and they, too, were taken aboard the Ark!) It alone contains principles, that if all men followed, would end wars and ruin.

    Where theory isn't involved the Bible is CONFIRMED by Science in many cases- never contradicted.

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit