A paradise on earth where every guy wears khakis and polo shirts is no paradise at all. I'd rather burn. :)
Not having a paradise earth in the future makes me sad - What about you?
by BonaFide 85 Replies latest jw friends
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SnakesInTheTower
minimus:
I'd rather deal in reality than fantasy.
I agree. And my current reality is much better than any paradise fantasy.
To BF's point, and a bit more seriously, I had to grieve properly once I learned that paradise and all that went with it was bull$hit. My dad died in 1994. I didn't grieve then because of the "Resurrection Hope™" and "Paradise®". A few years later I did cry more. But I still did not grieve. It was not until last year that I properly grieved my dad. I have come to grips with the fact that I will never see him again. And when (not if) my mom dies, I will be able to grieve properly then. I hope my JW mom has a good, healthy, long life. I love her dearly.
Snakes ()
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hamsterbait
There is far more good in the world than bad.
Most old ladies are not murdred on their way home. Most children lead healthy happy lives.
The future will be wonderful, but we have to envision and empower it.
Remember - newspapers spend millions on wages for people to find BAD news. The one paper that reported only good news as an experiment foldeed in weeks.
Paradise in the Bible is only used with reference to heaven. make your own paradise.
I know it is sad to play pass the parcel, only to discover there is no present, but you can love and live and dance and sing. What god would NOT want that for you?
HB
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hamsterbait
Virginia Woolf :
"Leonard to love life, see life as it is, to love it as it is."
Then put it away.
HB
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Dagney
Yes, it made me really sad for a long time. Even though I was so happy every day all day, top to toe with my xJW life, I still felt lost without a "thing" to look forward in the future. The paradise, new order, new system was so much a part of my daily life, there was a big hole there.
When explaining to a long time friend I had left JW, (someone I had preached to ad nauseum), and discussing this particular feeling, he responded calling me lovingly an "arrogant supremecist." He went further to tell me about how wonderful life was, and to live fully, with hope you made the world and those around you a little better by being here.
The switch finally flipped after that conversation, and I was able to finally let go of the fairy tale. Besides, even though the dream of a paradise was sort of like thinking about a fairy tale, I never could figure out how it was going to really work.
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scrapmama777
I have read through the previous posts and this is what I think. Granted, I am still a practicing Witness and may be a little bias......BUT
What is wrong with having the hope of a resurrection and living forever in paradise? I have a stillborn baby boy that I hope to be able to raise under perfect conditions. What is wrong with that HOPE? It gives me something to look forward to in this life.
I also look forward to spending more time with my grandparents and uncles (witnesses and NON witnesses) who have passed. Whether or not it is here on earth or in heaven does not matter much to me, really. What matters to ME is that I have something to look forward to NOW. When I die, I won't know if any of this is true or not. I will be dead. So, I would much rather die thinking that i will be resurrected with my loved ones and living forever on a paradise earth than just dying and not having anything to look forward to after.
If God made us to be born, live and die with nothing after, then why did he not create us with a way to cope with death? Surely he would have thought of THAT since every other part of us was meticulously thought out.
I have to ask though, most people have the hope of going to heaven with their loved ones who have passed. Is their hope a fantasy too since some of you think that paradise is a fantasy?
I say don't stop believing it, if it makes you feel better and not so sad. We all need something to believe in, in my humble opinion.
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Tuesday
Scrapmama rock on! Commenting on other threads :)
If I may give my two cents ... sorry bad joke :)
What is wrong with having the hope of a resurrection and living forever in paradise? I have a stillborn baby boy that I hope to be able to raise under perfect conditions. What is wrong with that HOPE? It gives me something to look forward to in this life.
I suppose there's nothing wrong with it, but if it doesn't pan out then you have wasted your one GUARANTEED life waiting for a reward that never happens. That is just a complete waste.
I also look forward to spending more time with my grandparents and uncles (witnesses and NON witnesses) who have passed. Whether or not it is here on earth or in heaven does not matter much to me, really. What matters to ME is that I have something to look forward to NOW. When I die, I won't know if any of this is true or not. I will be dead. So, I would much rather die thinking that i will be resurrected with my loved ones and living forever on a paradise earth than just dying and not having anything to look forward to after.
This is what actually lead me to leave the organization. I couldn't separate serving God with serving God for the reward. When I boiled down why I was serving God it wasn't out of love but out of what I could get from the worship. If you take the paradise away, would you still worship God? If you take away the happiness he gives you from serving him, do you still serve him? Not to mention someone who is serving God solely for the reward probably won't get the reward because God sees through the ruse... whether it's a sense of accomplishment in saying "I'm serving God how he wants to be served, unlike you folks", feeling like you're in some exclusive club because only the truth was revealed to you by God, prestige in the congregation, it's all based on an internal motivation to feel good. In which case I feel that when you're serving God you're getting your reward in full in life.
I have to ask though, most people have the hope of going to heaven with their loved ones who have passed. Is their hope a fantasy too since some of you think that paradise is a fantasy?
Yes it is. Same thing, wasting the one life that you're GUARANTEED to have for something better that more than likely won't happen. Sad really when you think about it.
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Dagney
Welcome scrapmama...it was courageous of you to come on this board and defend your faith and share your thoughts. I hope you stick around and get to know us, we are a pretty great bunch, and we WILL grow on you.
IMHO, having a heavenly hope is less of a fantasy than a paradise earth. Unless we are all going to be nekked and literally sitting under our own vine and eating from literally our own fig tree, the paradise as depicted in the pictures of the publications is impossible. I have always wondered, even as a kid, who is going to make the clothes they are wearing, grow the cotton pick it, process it, weave it then distribute it. Who is going to forge the tools to cut the lumber to make the swiss chalets in the picture? Who is going to plant and harvest the food on the table, and don't get me started on the dishes (and Corning Ware in one picture...lol) and utemsils. These questions bothered me FOREVER!!! Even though the thought of having time to explore hobbies and spend time with wild animals was a deep desire, the practicality of the everyday life just niggled me for years.
It is a great leap of faith to believe in it. In the end, it is all about what you can have faith in.
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minimus
Bottom line: be real. Don't just hope. Just "hope (wait) on Jehovah". Puhleese.....
Or: accept what you "hope" is true and delude yourself. It can't hurt, right?
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scrapmama777
UUMM Yeah, you guys have suckered me in by your kindness........I see your 2 cents and raise you 2....lol
Yes, I do see your point. I guess my point was that when I am dead, what is it going to matter if I spent my life looking forward to something that may or may not happen? I will be dead and not know any different. For me, at least I have hope.
If I do wake up from death and find myself living in a paradise earth, then I will know that all is right in the world!
I would not way that I serve God just for the reward, but it sure is a great benefit to look forward to!
If I was not a Witness, I would not believe in anything else. That is sad to me.....