by thirdwitness 1380 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
You people should really wake up.
So what would you want us to do? What is your purpose here? Why did we just spend 50 pages discussing this? What do you hope to gain by talking with people who disagree completely with the Gentile Times doctrine? Did I ask enough questions to get my message across?
"no one comes to me unless the Father draws him" That is not to conclude anything about the wts, however at Jesus' baptism, Johns' conclusions on Jesus being the Messiah was not because of John's reasonings but because God had communicated with John and God told him that Jesus was the Messiah, according to what the NT says. Was John so special? Was he not only a sinful man as all of us are? Can we trust our own thinking? I think that God tries to communicate with every individual. I do not think that everyones' spiritual eyes and ears are open. This is only an opinion.
Fisherman,
I have followed my suggestions to you. Whether you choose to act on my suggestions is, of course, you own affair. I do not feel compelled to prove my point beyond the wealth of separate Scriptural references I have provided in this thread, already. I will repost the argument in one shot, maybe the mish-mash way I have been arguing with thirdwitness has muddled the clarity of the picture, somewhat.
Revelation 1:4, 5 precedes the verse thirdwitness keeps referencing (i.e. Rev. 1:10) and is clearly contextually separate from the visions given to John of the Lord's day.
Revelation 1:4-6
John to the seven congregations that are in the [district of] Asia: May YOU have undeserved kindness and peace from “The One who is and who was and who is coming,” and from the seven spirits that are before his throne, and from Jesus Christ, “the Faithful Witness,” “The firstborn from the dead,” and “The Ruler of the kings of the earth.” To him that loves us and that loosed us from our sins by means of his own blood—and he made us to be a kingdom, priests to his God and Father—yes, to him be the glory and the might forever. Amen.
Jesus is identified in three distinct ways. Jesus was the Faithful Witness prior to and after his death, he was the firstborn from the dead after his resurrection, and he was The Ruler of the kings of the earth after his ascension. Nothing in the context indicates that any of the three designations did not identify Jesus to the seven First Century congregations in Asia, and everything about the context indicates that all three designations did identify Jesus to the seven First Century congregations in Asia.
Matthew 28:18 is a direct statement by Jesus. His public ascension had not yet occurred. Either he lied or he didnt.
Matthew 28:16-20
However, the eleven disciples went into Gal'i·lee to the mountain where Jesus had arranged for them, and when they saw him they did obeisance, but some doubted. And Jesus approached and spoke to them, saying: “All authority has been given me in heaven and on the earth. Go therefore and make disciples of people of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit, teaching them to observe all the things I have commanded YOU. And, look! I am with YOU all the days until the conclusion of the system of things.”
I think he told the truth. What do you think? I also think the disciples honored Jesus by an act of worship that Jesus refused to give Satan. (Matthew 4:8-11) Jesus didn't discourage it.
According to Jehovah's Witnesses, Joel 2:30-32 is not yet fulfilled.
Joel 2:28-32 “And after that it must occur that I shall pour out my spirit on every sort of flesh, and YOUR sons and YOUR daughters will certainly prophesy. As for YOUR old men, dreams they will dream. As for YOUR young men, visions they will see. And even on the menservants and on the maidservants in those days I shall pour out my spirit. “And I will give portents in the heavens and on the earth, blood and fire and columns of smoke. The sun itself will be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the coming of the great and fear-inspiring day of Jehovah. And it must occur that everyone who calls on the name of Jehovah will get away safe; for in Mount Zion and in Jerusalem there will prove to be the escaped ones, just as Jehovah has said, and in among the survivors, whom Jehovah is calling.”
But Peter and the 11 directly disagree with Jehovah's Witnesses:
Acts 2:15-21
These [people] are, in fact, not drunk, as YOU suppose, for it is the third hour of the day. On the contrary, this is what was said through the prophet Joel, ‘“And in the last days,” God says, “I shall pour out some of my spirit upon every sort of flesh, and YOUR sons and YOUR daughters will prophesy and YOUR young men will see visions and YOUR old men will dream dreams; and even upon my men slaves and upon my women slaves I will pour out some of my spirit in those days, and they will prophesy. And I will give portents in heaven above and signs on earth below, blood and fire and smoke mist; the sun will be turned into darkness and the moon into blood before the great and illustrious day of Jehovah arrives. And everyone who calls on the name of Jehovah will be saved.”’
Can I prove there are not two sets of "Last Days" in the Bible? No. But the only way someone can come up with two sets of "Last Days" is by inventing a second interpretation that has no support whatsoever in the Bible itself. The fact is, Peter directly stated that the Israelites in the upper room were experiencing the fulfillment of Joel 2:28-32. And there was pretty clear proof, in the tongues of fire and speaking in tongues, the gifts of the spirit such as prophesying, etc.
In our day, the WTS says that no one will prophesy or dream dreams, or see visions. But these times are supposed to be the greater fulfillment of Joel 2:28-32? In what way exactly is the fulfillment greater now? It isn't. And even if there were prophecies and visions, it wouldn't automatically mean that we are in a second set of Last Days. But since there aren't such proofs among JWs, the last days were in the First Century, as I said.
In the same chapter of Acts, Peter explains the fulfillment of Psalm 110:1 (the verse thirdwitness was harping on until I spanked him with it).
Acts 2:29-36
“Men, brothers, it is allowable to speak with freeness of speech to YOU concerning the family head David, that he both deceased and was buried and his tomb is among us to this day. Therefore, because he was a prophet and knew that God had sworn to him with an oath that he would seat one from the fruitage of his loins upon his throne, 31 he saw beforehand and spoke concerning the resurrection of the Christ, that neither was he forsaken in Hades nor did his flesh see corruption. This Jesus God resurrected, of which fact we are all witnesses. Therefore because he was exalted to the right hand of God and received the promised holy spirit from the Father, he has poured out this which YOU see and hear. Actually David did not ascend to the heavens, but he himself says, ‘Jehovah said to my Lord: “Sit at my right hand, until I place your enemies as a stool for your feet.”’ Therefore let all the house of Israel know for a certainty that God made him both Lord and Christ, this Jesus whom YOU impaled.”
Peter is here showing that the gift of the spirit is proof of the fulfillment of Psalm 110:1. Jesus has been made Lord, by this point. He is glorified. The word Lord means one having authority, a master.
Acts 17:5-9 shows that the disciples were punished for preaching that Jesus was king:
Acts 17:5-9
But the Jews, getting jealous, took into their company certain wicked men of the marketplace idlers and formed a mob and proceeded to throw the city into an uproar. And they assaulted the house of Ja'son and went seeking to have them brought forth to the rabble. When they did not find them they dragged Ja'son and certain brothers to the city rulers, crying out: “These men that have overturned the inhabited earth are present here also, and Ja'son has received them with hospitality. And all these [men] act in opposition to the decrees of Caesar, saying there is another king, Jesus.” They indeed agitated the crowd and the city rulers when they heard these things; and first after taking sufficient security from Ja'son and the others they let them go.
And that is what the disciples were preaching. It is also what Jesus himself said:
Young's Literal Translation John 18:37 Pilate, therefore, said to him, 'Art thou then a king?' Jesus answered, 'Thou dost say {it}; because a king I am, I for this have been born, and for this I have come to the world, that I may testify to the truth; every one who is of the truth, doth hear my voice.'
Can I be your ambassador if you are not a ruler with sovereignty? Was the First Century the "day of salvation" even for Gentile nations?
2 Corinthians 5:20-6:2
We are therefore ambassadors substituting for Christ, as though God were making entreaty through us. As substitutes for Christ we beg: “Become reconciled to God.” The one who did not know sin he made to be sin for us, that we might become God’s righteousness by means of him. Working together with him, we also entreat YOU not to accept the undeserved kindness of God and miss its purpose. For he says: “In an acceptable time I heard you, and in a day of salvation I helped you.” Look! Now is the especially acceptable time. Look! Now is the day of salvation.
The Bible says that in the First Century there were ambassadors for Christ. A letter to a Gentile congregation claims that in the First Century was the day of salvation.
Does the Bible encourage the idea that there would be different Good News being proclaimed in our day, something beyond or greater than what the Apostles were teaching?
Galatians 1:6-9
I marvel that YOU are being so quickly removed from the One who called YOU with Christ’s undeserved kindness over to another sort of good news. But it is not another; only there are certain ones who are causing YOU trouble and wanting to pervert the good news about the Christ. However, even if we or an angel out of heaven were to declare to YOU as good news something beyond what we declared to YOU as good news, let him be accursed. As we have said above, I also now say again, Whoever it is that is declaring to YOU as good news something beyond what YOU accepted, let him be accursed.
What did Paul teach, as current truth, in the First Century?
Ephesians 1:15-23
That is why I also, since I have heard of the faith YOU have in the Lord Jesus and toward all the holy ones, do not cease giving thanks for YOU. I continue mentioning YOU in my prayers, that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give YOU a spirit of wisdom and of revelation in the accurate knowledge of him; the eyes of YOUR heart having been enlightened, that YOU may know what is the hope to which he called YOU, what the glorious riches are which he holds as an inheritance for the holy ones, and what the surpassing greatness of his power is toward us believers. It is according to the operation of the mightiness of his strength, with which he has operated in the case of the Christ when he raised him up from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly places, far above every government and authority and power and lordship and every name named, not only in this system of things, but also in that to come. He also subjected all things under his feet, and made him head over all things to the congregation, which is his body, the fullness of him who fills up all things in all.
According to the verse in Galatians, what is Paul's recommendation for any who want to teach something different? Does the letter to the First Century Ephesians say that Jesus has already been lifted far above every government and authority and power and lordship, and that all things had already been subjected under his feet? Did Paul lie to the Ephesians, or did the Watchtower Society lie to the world?
Keep in mind, this does not contradict Hebrews 10 any more than Hebrews 5-7 contradicts Hebrews 10. Thirdwitness' interpretation of Hebrews 10 is wrong, and creates a contradiction that is not really there. Sort of like how thirdwitness' interpretation about 607 BC is wrong and creates a 20 gap that is not really there. This does directly contradict thirdwitness' interpretation of Hebrews 10, which is why thirdwitness refuses to comment on these verses in Ephesians.
Melchizedek was King of Salem (the later site of Jerusalem) and a priest. Paul said Jesus had already fulfilled Psalm 110:4. This verse in Psalms is contextually important, since Peter also indicated that Jesus had already fulfilled Psalm 110:1 (see discussion above of Acts 2).
Hebrews 5:4-10
Also, a man takes this honor, not of his own accord, but only when he is called by God, just as Aaron also [was]. So too the Christ did not glorify himself by becoming a high priest, but [was glorified by him] who spoke with reference to him: “You are my son; I, today, I have become your father.” Just as he says also in another place: “You are a priest forever according to the manner of Melchizedek.” In the days of his flesh [Christ] offered up supplications and also petitions to the One who was able to save him out of death, with strong outcries and tears, and he was favorably heard for his godly fear. Although he was a Son, he learned obedience from the things he suffered; and after he had been made perfect he became responsible for everlasting salvation to all those obeying him, because he has been specifically called by God a high priest according to the manner of Melchizedek.
Psalm 110:4
Jehovah has sworn (and he will feel no regret): “You are a priest to time indefinite According to the manner of Mel·chiz'e·dek!”
Hebrews 6:13-7:3 For when God made his promise to Abraham, since he could not swear by anyone greater, he swore by himself, saying: “Assuredly in blessing I will bless you, and in multiplying I will multiply you.” And thus after [Abraham] had shown patience, he obtained [this] promise. For men swear by the one greater, and their oath is the end of every dispute, as it is a legal guarantee to them. In this manner God, when he purposed to demonstrate more abundantly to the heirs of the promise the unchangeableness of his counsel, stepped in with an oath, in order that, through two unchangeable things in which it is impossible for God to lie, we who have fled to the refuge may have strong encouragement to lay hold on the hope set before us. This [hope] we have as an anchor for the soul, both sure and firm, and it enters in within the curtain, where a forerunner has entered in our behalf, Jesus, who has become a high priest according to the manner of Melchizedek forever. For this Melchizedek, king of Salem, priest of the Most High God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings and blessed him and to whom Abraham apportioned a tenth from all things, is first of all, by translation, “King of Righteousness,” and is then also king of Salem, that is, “King of Peace.” In being fatherless, motherless, without genealogy, having neither a beginning of days nor an end of life, but having been made like the Son of God, he remains a priest perpetually.
Hebrews refers to Jesus in the First Century as the one "who has become a high priest according to the manner of Melchizedek." That is, a king and a priest. He was a king in the First Century.
Now, I have cited a large quantity of Scriptures all of which point to only one conclusion and none of which are ambiguous in statement (i.e. it cannot be misinterpreted). In rebuttal, thirdwitness offers one verse out of context (Revelation 1:10) and one verse that he interprets in a manner directly contradictory to previous verses in the same book (Hebrews 10).
What do you say? Do the Scriptures state that Jesus had become a king/priest like Melchizedek in the First Century, or not?
Either way, if this is insufficient for you and you really want to know what the Bible says, my only advice is dig into what the Bible says. So far, you haven't demonstrated to me that you have done that. I have done just that. I am nothing but another man. The Spirit is the source of wisdom.
1 Corinthians 2:6-10
Now we speak wisdom among those who are mature, but not the wisdom of this system of things nor that of the rulers of this system of things, who are to come to nothing. But we speak God’s wisdom in a sacred secret, the hidden wisdom, which God foreordained before the systems of things for our glory. This [wisdom] not one of the rulers of this system of things came to know, for if they had known [it] they would not have impaled the glorious Lord. But just as it is written: “Eye has not seen and ear has not heard, neither have there been conceived in the heart of man the things that God has prepared for those who love him.” For it is to us God has revealed them through his spirit, for the spirit searches into all things, even the deep things of God.
It is not my place to reveal what Jesus has left for the spirit to reveal. Dig in, if you want to know. There is no shortcut that will leave you without doubt.
Your suggestions do not prove or support your argument or position on what the Bible says about the kingdom. All that you are saying is, "You are wrong."
I have already offered these proofs and supports on what the Bible says about the kingdom. And I am also saying, "You are wrong." My suggestion was not intended to prove or support, it was intended to spark you to investigate on your own. I still believe you would greatly benefit from following my suggestion but, as I said earlier, whether or not you do so is your own lookout. You want someone to spoonfeed a theory to you, I want you to develop your own. I doubt it will differ greatly from the one I have developed, but even if it does I have no doubt you will benefit from the exercise.
Respectfully,
AuldSoul
ThirdWitness,
You know what I keep hearing at this site. Where is this promised presence of his. Why, all things are continuing as they were. Jesus said nothing about frequencies of earthquakes. He simply said they would be in one place after another and they are and more people are dying from them than ever before.If a tree falls in the woods does it make a sound? Who cares? But if it falls on somebody it becomes important. And if it falls on 1000 people it is more important. What does it matter that more people live in the woods now than there used to be. It doesn't. If more people die from earthquakes then it is more newsworthy. Per capita makes no difference. Just because the reason is because there are more people on the earth now doesn't make what Jesus said incorrect. He probably knew that there would be more people as time went on.
And certainly if you can't see the changes made as respects war than you are as blind as a bat. The red horse rides like never before. And it all started in 1914 with the GREAT war. Up until that time wars were mostly civil wars or little skirmishes between a few countries over borders and colonies etc. Never had there been a war like the GREAT war. Did you ever think that thats why it was called the GREAT war. And then when world war II came along they had to change the name. I guess they didn't want to call them the GREAT war and the GREATER war.
Remember Jesus said that people would still be carrying on their everyday life and he said people would be saying where is this promised presence. So the presence of Christ would not be total chaos. But it would be accompanied by the sign of Matt 24. The sign includes all the things mentioned including the preaching of the good news now being carried out by JWs.
You people should really wake up.
Preaching, not debate. Try again. HS
I will tell you why I am here and what you should do. Not long ago I was just like many of you. I was thinking 607 was wrong. 1914 was a crock. The NGO, Child Abuse, etc etc. I heard it all just like you and was having doubts. So I decided that I would not take Robert King's or Carl Jonnson's or Rolf Furulli's or Ray Franz's or Alan Feurbach's or anyone' word for it. I decided that I would do in depth honest research into each subject.
What did I find?
I found that I was being lied to and misled by apostates. I found that untruths were being told and exaggerations were being made.
As respects the NGO I found out that the WTS had not done anything wrong and had not lied. Here is the result of my research:
http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/watchtower-un-ngo/
As respects the child abuse policy of JWs, I found out that JWs had the absolute best child abuse policy of all religions. Here is the result of my research:
http://thetruthaboutthetruthaboutthetruth.blogspot.com/
And as respects 607/1914 I found that 607 was definitely the time that Jerusalem was destroyed and the Gentile Times began. Here is the result of the research on that subject:
http://www.jehovahsjudgment.co.uk/607/default.html
Along with 607 I found out what we have been discussing here about Christ's parousia and his awaiting until his enemies were placed as a stool for his feet.
AlanF will of course never admit that he is wrong about parousia in Matthew 24 but we all know that he has been shown to be totally and absolutely without a doubt wrong and I believe that he knows it. How could he not? He aint' that stupid. The days of the Son of man = the presence of the Son of man = the days of Noah. Matthew 24 and Luke 17 have shown us that without a doubt and no one has even attempted to argue with that. Because they simply can't unless it would be some ridiculous silly argument.
So why is a JW here on this site with many apostates. Because I myself am somewhat of a recovering apostate. And since the information helped me to recover my spirituality, before it went in the toilet and I became like some here who don't even believe the Bible is inspired, I wanted to share it with you. I thought that perhaps I could help some to see the truth and recover and not continue to be led astray by apostate lies about NGO, child abuse policy, and 607. And that is what they are: Apostate Lies.
You see apostates don't really care who you are or what you do. They just want to lead you away from JWs and the truth. They don't give a flip about you, only that you don't stay with JWs. They weep and gnash their teeth and want you to weep and gnash your teeth with them. They have no humility and serve no man, only God of course while they ignore the scriptures that say be obedient to those taking the lead. How can they do that when they are smarter than anyone else? How can they humbly submit to inferior ones?
It is one big lie that you are listening to when you listen to apostates. They are not impartial and they will not fairly present the facts. They will hide what needs to be hid and tell you just enough to give you doubts.
So for those who want to know the truth, read the links provided in detail and you will see the truth. For those who don't care then just keep on listening to apostate lies and stay like you are. For those who think they wasted years being one of JWs it is really the other way around. The only years you didn't waste is when you were a JW.
HS,
Preaching, not debate.
Try again.
You are inviting a man born blind to accurately paint a sunset; asking an illiterate to write a pure sonnet in Elizabethan English. You ask the impossible of our thirdwitness. I call foul.
Respectfully,
AuldSoul
thirdwitness,
Once again, you are posting links to your Web site in a brazen attempt to garner more clicks and higher Web rankings. Were I a moderator, I would strip those links from your post and restrict your posting limit AGAIN. You were fairly warned before. You had your limit reduced and were advised WHY. Some argued on your behalf, for a second chance. You have just abused the kindness.
PLEASE DO NOT CLICK THROUGH TO thirdwitness Web sites. He is ONLY here to help drive traffic to his sites, as his continual rejection of the forum posting guidelines plainly shows.
AuldSoul
Auldsoul: PLEASE DO NOT CLICK THROUGH TO thirdwitness Web sites. He is ONLY here to help drive traffic to his sites, as his continual rejection of the forum posting guidelines plainly shows.
Are you worried that someone might see through your apostate lies and trappings? By all means, lets allow links to all kinds of apostate sites but if anyone puts a link to sites that disprove the apostate lies, then remove them. Hide the truth so you can continue to spread your poison to unwary ones.
As respects the NGO I found out that the WTS had not done anything wrong and had not lied.
thirdwitness,
Answer me directly, this time, please.
(1) Did the non-governmental organization known legally as Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of New York, Inc. join the United Nations Department of Public Information (UN/DPI) as an Associate?
Note, it is a yes or no question. No elaboration is required.
(2.1) If not, why did they request to disassociate in 2001 from an organization to which they were not associated?
(2.2) If so, is the United Nations Department of Public Information an organization under judgment by Jehovah God?
(3) Are the other members of the UN/DPI approved or disapproved by God? (see provided examples)
AMERICAN BAPTIST CHURCHES-USA NATIONAL MINISTRIES
CHURCH MEDICAL CENTER OF RUSSIA
CHURCH OF THE BRETHREN
CHURCH WOMEN UNITED
CHURCH WORLD SERVICE (CWS)
COMMISSION OF THE CHURCHES ON INTERNATIONAL AFFAIRS (CCIA/WCC)
CONFERENCE OF EUROPEAN CHURCHES
DIOCESE OF THE ARMENIAN CHURCH OF AMERICA
EPISCOPAL CHURCH USA
EVANGELICAL COVENANT CHURCH, THE
INTERNATIONAL MISSIOn MINISTRY OF CHURCHES OF CHRIST
NATIONAL COUNCIL OF THE CHURCHES OF CHRIST IN THE USA
PRESBYTERIAN CHURCH (USA)
SYRIAN ORTHODOX CHURCH IN AMERICA
UNITED CHURCH OF CHRIST JUSTICE AND WITNESS MINISTRIES (FORMERLY UNITED CHURCH OF CHRIST COMMISSION FOR RACIAL JUSTICE)
UNITED CHURCH OF CHRIST WIDER CHURCH MINISTRIES (FORMERLY UNITED CHURCH BOARD FOR WORLD MINISTRIES)
UNITED METHODIST CHURCH, GENERAL BOARD OF CHURCH AND SOCIETY
UNITED METHODIST CHURCH, GENERAL BOARD OF GLOBAL MINISTRIES
WOMEN'S MISSIONARY SOCIETY OF THE AFRICIAN METHODIST EPISCOPAL CHURCH
WORLD COUNCIL OF INDEPENDENT CHRISTIAN CHURCHES
WORLD FEDERATION OF METHODIST AND UNITING CHURCH WOMEN
ZIMBABWE COUNCIL OF CHURCHES
CHRISTIAN CARE ORGANIZATION (CCO)
CHRISTIAN CHILDREN'S FUND
CHRISTIAN DEMOCRAT INTERNATIONAL (IDC)
CHRISTIAN EMBASSY OF CAMPUS CRUSADE FOR CHRIST
CHRISTIAN MISSION FOR THE UNITED NATIONS COMMUNITY
CHRISTIANS ASSOCIATED FOR RELATIONSHIPS WITH EASTERN EUROPE (CAREE)
CHRISTOPHERS, THE
CONGREGATION OF THE PASSION OF JESUS CHRIST - PASSIONIST INTERNATIONAL
FEDERATION OF NATIONAL COMMITTEE IN INTERNATIONAL CHRISTIAN YOUTH EXCHANGE
INTERNATIONAL CONFEDERATION OF CHRISTIAN FAMILY MOVEMENTS
INTERNATIONAL FEDERATION OF ACTION BY CHRISTIANS FOR THE ABOLITION OF TORTURE
INTERNATIONAL UNION OF YOUNG CHRISTIAN DEMOCRATS
LEGION OF CHRIST
PAX CHRISTI INTERNATIONAL
TANZANIA YOUNG MEN'S CHRISTIAN ASSOCIATION
UNION OF SPIRITUAL COMMUNITIES OF CHRIST, THE
WORLD WOMAN'S CHRISTIAN TEMPERANCE UNION
WORLD ALLIANCE OF YOUNG MEN'S CHRISTIAN ASSOCIATIONS
WORLD CHRISTIAN LIFE COMMUNITY
WORLD STUDENT CHRISTIAN FEDERATION (WSCF)
WORLD YOUNG WOMEN'S CHRISTIAN ASSOCIATION (WORLD YWCA)
YOUNG WOMEN'S CHRISTIAN ASSOCIATION OF NIGERIA
YOUNG WOMEN'S CHRISTIAN ASSOCIATION OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, NATIONAL BOARD
You go ahead and answer those three questions for me, sport. I think most everyone who reads this thread will see the truth that you are trying to hide.
Organized to Accomplish Our Ministry (1983) p. 151, par. 1
Concerning those who renounced their Christian faith in his day, the apostle John wrote: “They went out from us, but they were not of our sort; for if they had been of our sort, they would have remained with us.” (1 John 2:19) Also, a person might renounce his place in the Christian congregation by his actions, such as by becoming part of a secular organization the objective of which is contrary to the Bible and, hence, is under judgment by Jehovah God. (Compare Revelation 19:17-21; Isaiah 2:4) So if a person who is a Christian chooses to join those who are disapproved by God, it would be fitting for the congregation to acknowledge by a brief announcement that he has disassociated himself and is no longer one of Jehovah’s Witnesses. Such a person would be viewed in the same way as a disfellowshipped person.
Didn't do anything wrong? Yeah, okay.
AuldSoul
Along with 607 I found out what we have been discussing here about Christ's parousia and his awaiting until his enemies were placed as a stool for his feet.AlanF will of course never admit that he is wrong about parousia in Matthew 24 but we all know that he has been shown to be totally and absolutely without a doubt wrong and I believe that he knows it. How could he not? He aint' that stupid. The days of the Son of man = the presence of the Son of man = the days of Noah. Matthew 24 and Luke 17 have shown us that without a doubt and no one has even attempted to argue with that. Because they simply can't unless it would be some ridiculous silly argument.
So why is a JW here on this site with many apostates. Because I myself am somewhat of a recovering apostate. And since the information helped me to recover my spirituality, before it went in the toilet and I became like some here who don't even believe the Bible is inspired, I wanted to share it with you. I thought that perhaps I could help some to see the truth and recover and not continue to be led astray by apostate lies about NGO, child abuse policy, and 607. And that is what they are: Apostate Lies.
You see apostates don't really care who you are or what you do. They just want to lead you away from JWs and the truth. They don't give a flip about you, only that you don't stay with JWs. They weep and gnash their teeth and want you to weep and gnash your teeth with them. They have no humility and serve no man, only God of course while they ignore the scriptures that say be obedient to those taking the lead. How can they do that when they are smarter than anyone else? How can they humbly submit to inferior ones?
It is one big lie that you are listening to when you listen to apostates. They are not impartial and they will not fairly present the facts. They will hide what needs to be hid and tell you just enough to give you doubts.
So for those who want to know the truth, read the links provided in detail and you will see the truth. For those who don't care then just keep on listening to apostate lies and stay like you are. For those who think they wasted years being one of JWs it is really the other way around. The only years you didn't waste is when you were a JW.
No doubt about it - this guy has lost it! I had the feeling that he was about to unravel. It also goes to prove that there is nothing quite so dense as an 'apostate' reconverted to the ways of the WTS, apart of course from a dog returning to its vomit.
HS
