Health Care: A Right or a Privilege?

by prophecor 401 Replies latest members politics

FlyingHighNow

Lisa, I do have children, two of them. I sent my daughter to tech school to learn visual communications. She is a mother of two, but she uses her skills to do freelance work. My son prefers to work with his hands. That makes him happy. He works hard, saves, has goals and is an avid reader/self educater. When he visited me in Michigan, he read over forty books during his few months stay. When he wasn't at the library, he was out walking, riding his bicycle, fishing, or shopping and cooking for us.
I taught my daughter a long time ago, this society pay$ people who work with their minds, not their hands.
Lisa
I'm glad you finally state, after all that you realize national healthcare is a better idea. Doesn't mean we'll get it anytime soon but we can hope for it someday. Countries who have national healthcare still have private doctors and hospitals. They still have private health insurance. There isn't any reason to do away with that completely here. I don't see why we can't have both someday.
You don't need to apologize for doing well. It's wonderful that you are doing well. And I hope you and your daughter will continue to do well.
The poor don't need to be excused, Lisa. I want to clarify that I am not speaking of jobs like plumming, etc. when I mention regular jobs. Plummers make very good money. You mentioned career companies as opposed to jobs like Wal-mart. The latter are the jobs I mean when I say regular jobs. Lisa, you have said some helpful things on this thread. You've also sounded rather irritated and impatient at times, perhaps a bit judgmental, something all of us, including me can be. I found the following cut and paste recently. It really gave me something to ponder. I have to admit I don't have all the symptoms. A rhetorical question for you, do you have all of these symptoms? The Symptoms of Inner Peace
1. A tendency to think and act spontaneously, rather than from fear based
on past experiences;
2. an unmistakable ability to enjoy each moment;
3. a loss of interest in judging others;
4. a loss of interest in judging self;
5. a loss of interest in conflict;
6. a loss of interest in interpreting the actions of others;
7. frequent overwhelming episodes of appreciation;
8. frequent attacks of smiling through the heart;
9. increasing susceptibility to love extended by others; as well as the
uncontrollable urge to extend it;
10. an increasing tendency to let things happen, rather than manipulate
them and make them happen. Author Unknown ~
Terry

The Symptoms of Inner Peace
1. A tendency to think and act spontaneously, rather than from fear based

on past experiences;
2. an unmistakable ability to enjoy each moment;
3. a loss of interest in judging others;
4. a loss of interest in judging self;
5. a loss of interest in conflict;
6. a loss of interest in interpreting the actions of others;
7. frequent overwhelming episodes of appreciation;
8. frequent attacks of smiling through the heart;
9. increasing susceptibility to love extended by others; as well as the

uncontrollable urge to extend it;
10. an increasing tendency to let things happen, rather than manipulate

them and make them happen.

1. Those are the ONLY TWO choices?? Sounds like a false dichotomy to me.
2. How would one go about making such a mistake?? ("I thought I enjoyed that...but, I guess I was wrong.")
3.Judging is always fairly based on performance. Justice is getting what you deserve. Givng people credit where they deserve it requires judgement.
4.I like how the word "judging" is suddenly a pejorative. I judge my actions by my standards. How does that violate my inner peace? T'would seem a failure to use fair judgement about myself would make me blissful as in "ignorance is bliss."
5. Avoiding unnecessary conflict is wise; but, life generally creates choices which demand decisions about conflicts. Avoiding such decisions makes you a procrastinator.
6. Yeah, we should never interpret the actions of others......um.....exactly why???
7.I'm frequently whelmed, but, not overly so.
8. Eeeeuuuwwww, a stinky conceptual metaphor! Not my cup o' chai.
9. Interesting word: susceptibility. DEFINE: SUSCEPTIBLE: Vulnerable or predisposed to a disease (I guess this is another stinky conceptual metaphor.)
10. Yes, let's all be an effect and not a cause. Go limp. I think of everyday life as a swim in the ocean. If you stop swimming and let things happen you'll drown or end up fish food. But, that's just me :)
I have an alternate 10 Symptoms of Inner Peace
1. Trusting your rational mind because you examine every thought that enters your head for bogus or spurious content.
2.Activating your goal setting ability by determining your own purposes in life and then persuing them every day in every way.
3. Measuring your daily progress against the standard of virtues that make up your values and adjusting your behavior for maximum success.
4.Knowing yourself well enough that you trust your own mind and avoid letting authority or "experts" think for you.
5.Rigorously demanding a high standard of yourself and others when it comes to exchanging ideas and refusing to lapse into group think or platitudes.
6.Setting aside enough time each day to engage in recreation, study or hilarity as your mood demands.
7.Recognizing that all emotion comes from values you've accepted and that whatever way you feel is the result of those values. Emotion is rational.
8.Realizing that your life belongs to you as an individual and you need never ask others to sacrifice themselves for you or allow yourself to be sacrificed to others.
9.Doing for others according to their absolute value and not because society has demanded it.
10. Seeing people for their talent, intelligence, capability and ambition rather than granting unwarranted and unearned value to them simply because they exist.
That's MY list.
Terry
LDH
This health care is consistent no matter where you go in the country. What is not included, are things like eye wear, dental work, cosmetic surgery and things like that, therefore, many employers will still offer you a benefit, or you can buy private insurance to cover those things if you wish but it's not necessary. Many people will simply pay out of pocket for their glasses or dental work if they think it's better for them to do so.

OK, so you would buy supplemental insurance to cover what we in the states call 'ancillary lines?" That's not usually a wise use of insurance dollars. It's usually trading pennies for pennies. A better use for these needs is pre-tax dollars in a FSA (Flex Savings Account), unless say you have 4 kids or so, in which case cash flow can be a problem.
Author Unknown ~
Call it a habit, but since I left the world of the JW I completely disregard any work by 'anonymous.'
I'm glad you finally state, after all that you realize national healthcare is a better idea. Doesn't mean we'll get it anytime soon but we can hope for it someday. Countries who have national healthcare still have private doctors and hospitals. They still have private health insurance. There isn't any reason to do away with that completely here. I don't see why we can't have both someday.
These are the conditions upon which I accept national health care is better than what we have now:
1. full coverage
2. no increased taxes
3. elimination of private premiums
4. balanced checkbooks based on realistic actuarial data, not 'pie in the sky utopia' data based on FEAR
Have you seen some plan that I have not seen? Because to date, I've not seen the financials on this and how it would play out.
My daughter also works with her hands. She is a percussionist. However, unlike the kid featured in the movie 'Drumline' --she is highly disciplined, writes music, designs show concepts and T-shirts etc. So to me, this is the best of both worlds. I don't disparage what others CAN'T do, I encourage her to do her best and work smart, not just hard.
Lisa
FlyingHighNow
These are the conditions upon which I accept national health care is better than what we have now:
full coverage
no increased taxes
elimination of private premiums
balanced checkbooks based on realistic actuarial data, not 'pie in the sky utopia' data based on FEAR
I agree, especially with 2. I feel like there is so much waste here in the US with federal taxes already. We pay for a lot of waste and frivolity. Let those studying things like the habitats of magpies get private funding rather than government grants. Also, cut the waste in military spending. $75 for a toilet seat? It's been proven that some military suppliers will charge $50 for a $1 bolt.
My son likes to do anything with his hands. He gardens. He builds things. He scuplts and paints. He prefers to break a sweat over sitting behind a desk. That's just a preference. He will read a book when he's finally tuckered out though.
The Symptoms of Inner Peace I found in a Care Notes TM booklet. I was also pleased to find it on the internet, for a copy and paste. No matter who wrote it, it's still thought worthy. And, Terry, I don't think The Symptoms of Inner Peace is speaking in absolutes, but rather tendencies.
LittleToe

The National Health Service has queues for some services (though they are minor in this area), and often (but not always) communal wards.
Some people want to jump those queues and also have nice private rooms. Further, there's elective surgery. Who can blame them? You can either pay on a one-off basis or pay into an insurance plan as in the USA. Basically we have the best of both worlds. The only downside is that it's more lucrative and so our National service is leaking staff.
Actually I paid to get my eyes laser-corrected. It's only available privately. It was a "luxury" that I felt it was worth investing in, and I have no regrets. Not everyone can afford it though.
sammielee24

Actually I paid to get my eyes laser-corrected. It's only available privately
Thats the same in Canada - I know of a lot of people who paid to have the surgery done on their own. Our Government doesn't pay for that but people who want to have it done will save up and get it. It's the same as braces for your teeth or crowns - that isn't generally covered by the healthcare but some people have those benefits through their employer or they just save up and get the work done if its that important to them. I know one woman who saved up enough to get laser surgery on her eyes and got a boob job for her birthday from her mom and dad - she was a whole new woman when she came back from vacation...lol..sw.
FlyingHighNow

In the USA, most private, even group health care insurance plans do NOT cover laser eye surgery. Here, you have to reach into your pockets to pay for it as well.
LDH

In the USA, most private, even group health care insurance plans do NOT cover laser eye surgery.

While this is true, if you have group vision coverage you have access to negotiated discounts. Also, you can set money aside in a FSA (if your employer has this) and pay for it with pre-tax dollars. Don't forget you can itemize this expense on your taxes if you meet the threshold I linked to earlier in the thread.
SixofNine

I haven't insulted anyone , and it's so pathetic to see you espousing that I call poor people 'horrible small people.'

Well, in all fairness to me (and that's what this thread is really about, all fairness to me ), I didn't espouse that you call poor people "horrible, small people", I espoused that indeed, people who begrudge other people all the benefits of their hard earned (or even not-so-hard earned) money, especially where medicine is concerned, could be considered "horrible, small people". I just don't think there are enough of those type of people running around that they are worth mentioning, and certainly no one in this thread seems to be taking that type of position.
The word "socialized" is a taboo.
Yes, and education is the key to undoing this vapid stupidity.
LDH

I understand now, Six, I just don't want you thinking those are my words.......or feelings.

Health Care: A Right or a Privilege?

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