Pray for death of Apostates

by tsarina 64 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  fahrvegnugen

  I asked you whether such confidential information leaked out BEFORE or AFTER action was taken.

  AuldSoul--In what is most likely a useless attempt to help you see that you don't know everything there is to know, the answer is--on many occasions--BEFORE. Is that clear enough for you?

  I'm speaking of confidential matters in general--not sex abuse cases. In the half-dozen congregations that I was associated with during my lifetime, I only know of one incidence of alleged molestation. It was from a questionable source and the accused was not an elder. And to once again address your burning concern, I was aware of the situation BEFORE any action was taken. No I didn't know the bloody details of what was said in confidential meetings--I knew the jist of the accusations (as did most of the people in the congregation).

  While it's certainly possible that there may have been other such incidents that I was not made aware of, the likelihood that there were enough of them to constitute the sort of grand scale which would justify characterizing JW's en masse as "nasty, child-abusers" is nil, zero, zilch. Comprende?
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  fahrvegnugen
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  AuldSoul

  Gee, for not being an apologist you certainly seem to be adamant about their lack of organizational culpability. I say that because if an organization is culpable, the flock is too, according to their publications (see "Christendom," "False Religion," "Catholicism," "Babylon the Great" in the Watchtower Publications Index).

  If you aren't an apologist, I tremble to suppose what an apologist might say on the subject.

  It's simply a matter of sifting through the rhetoric and agendum to arrive at an accurate understanding of why you are the way you are and react the way you do, it has no moral implications whatsoever.

  AuldSoul
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  DocBob

  Secondly, I never served as an elder. I was a MS and pioneer. But that is irrelevant, since anyone who has actually been a JW for any length of time knows that word always gets around in the congregation regarding any serious improprieties. Spend one day driving around in a cargroup full of pioneer sisters and you will know everything there is to know and more.

  I have to disagree with this one. I served as a MS for 10 years before I was appointed as an elder. I also started as a regular pioneer the same month I was appointed an elder. As a MS, I THOUGH I knew what was going on in the congregation. After I started as an elder, I found out stuff that I never dreamed was going on. I regular pioneered for 5 years and as much as those pioneer sisters knew, they didn't know the half of it. Maybe our body of elders was particularly good at "keeping confidentiality" but I think it is more likely that there is a lot going on in JW congregations that a lot of the rank and file (including pioneer sisters) don't have a clue about.
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  tsarina

  Hi everyone

  Thank you for all your research and help. I really, really hope I misread that point. I contacted e-watchman as well for clarification and was told that no such had been printed by the WatchTower (don't know if they meant the magazine or the organisation)

  Thanks for your question Crumpet. My background is I am one of Jehovah's Witnesses, although they give me a very wide bearth. I have had a monstrously traumatic time with them which I don't feel able to mention, although I have spoken will Silent Lambs who have been a real support. To be honest, I just want them the religion to do the right thing, I don't want to bring them down. We all love God don't we, so we don't want Jehovah's Witnesses stumbled or scared to death or being led the wrong way, just want all real lovers of God to be able to do so safely.

  Incidentally, fall anyone out there who has been called something terrible for innocently questioning the society and it's sometimes shakey teaching, remember Jesus was executed for it, Jeremiah was thrown to drown in a sewerage pit for it. If we do it honestly and with a clean heart, then we're all in the best of company!
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  tsarina

  Hi Ballistic!

  Personally, I don't think over-the-top speculation or generalisation would do this board's credibility any good. I think it would be far better to stick to what we do know for fact.

  I really do agree with you, and I stress this was a serious question to a genuine sighting in the weeks gone by. Perhaps I should have put the subject in quotes to show it was doubted, and I apologise for that, but if we "stick to the facts" in the wasy you mean, then how can I even ask my genuine question? Sorry if I have offended you
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  blondie

  I guess enough JWD posters have commented on this that I am confident that nothing is in the publications about JWs being told officially by the WTS to pray for the death of apostates. GaryB has quite an extensive WT library as do I and several others on JWD. If it is in print, I think we or others would have found and posted it.

  Does that mean that individual JWs might not have said that it was a good thing to pray for the death of apostates, of course not. But that doesn't make it official, just their personal opinion, probably shared in stupidity with other JWs. Does it make it any more authoritarian or official if an individual CO, DO, or even GB member might have said it in private, not in my experience.

  So to date, nothing in writing in the WT publications encourages JWs to pray for the death of apostates.

  Blondie
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  AuldSoul

  As much as hate getting technical (yeah right! ), they do pray for the end of this system.

  What do they believe will be a consequence of the end of this system? The death of "apostates," as was shown clearly in the quotes I posted early on. So, technically, when they pray for the end of this system, they are praying for the death of everyone who is not one of Jehovah's Witnesses, including "apostates."

  Respectfully,
  AuldSoul
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  reaper

  They just want the DEATH of every one who is not one of them. I could never square that with a loving God, who gave his life for ALL.

  And they do not like Children at all. They claim to love them, but they are treated as appendages. They are little slaves of the WT. When I was a Child, I was forced to give 3-5 minute sermons and look into the housholders eyes. I was a shy kid in those days and felt very embarrassed, I would now class that as abuse. I also did it to my kids, but not so harshly. They were disiplined if the did not sit still for 2 B....Y hours.

  If we played up at meetings we were given the BELT when we got home. No wonder my Sister went Mentally Sick and died at only 49 years of age.

  They keep Jesus away from the rank & file, so deprive them of his Mediatorship.

  They are really evil people. Very similar to Nazi's ideology.
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  yesidid

  typical of the Jehovah's Witness people. They are extremely nasty, especially to children.

  So Gary and all who agree with the above, you can confirm that when you were a Jehovah's Witness you were extremely nasty, especially to children?
  
  I personally was not nasty, particularly to children and neither were most of the Witnesses I was related to, or were friends with.
  
  Those are the words of rabble rousers. Can't we be above that sort of thing on this board?
  
  
  
  yesidid.