Jesus was a liar.

by nicolaou 123 Replies latest watchtower bible

• 

  JamesThomas

  Tetrapod:
  

  you should take the stuff you write on this board, and compile it into a book.

  LOL. Not at you friend, but at the thought of me writing a book. I am by no means a qualified teacher. At best I am a thorn in some peoples side that may help in some way pique their desire to find deeper significance, meaning and peace within themselves, enough that they may seek a real teacher.

  Thank you though for your kind comments, and if there is a sense of some wisdom or harmony within you at anything said then look deeper at that sense within you. Look closer at that place where there may be a ringing true. You, are the key, the door, and the treasure.

  j
• 

  Carmel

  Nic, at first I was put off by the title of your thread but read on and was pleased by how you set up your argument. You have cut to the quick. Either Jesus was who He claimed to be or He was indeed one of histories greatest interlopers or as you rightly state in left field ! I came to the same conclusion years ago and held any final decision in abeyance for many years.

  My only point to add would be that you may have set up a false dichotomy when you feel you have to choose between rationality and faith. They are not, IMHO, mutually exclusive.

  carmel
• 

  Rabbit

  “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

  "I and the Father are one.”

  "I say to YOU, Before Abraham came into existence, I have been.”

  "I am the resurrection and the life."

  He sure sounds confident...doesn't he ? Or just a tiny bit conceited, maybe ? Or telling the truth ?

  I dunno.

  My logic does tell me a few things however: Jesus, from what we see written, seems like a likable fellow. Or he had real good intentions. But, how could the Son be so damned different than his Father ? Or how, as some interpret the Bible, could He be so UN-like himself ?

  The God of the Bible "is a jealous God"...and if you don't just "Love Him" because, He is so good...then, He'll drop a flaming ball of sulfur on your head -- or a whole village, or city, or nation, even if you are the innocent one. Can you imagine a court of human judges...bringing down judgment upon the children of criminals ?? Hell, He's willing to destroy forever (or torture forever) anyone who exercises that "Free Will" He gave them -- despite the fact that He handicapped ALL of Adams descendants by 'making us imperfect,' just because we are relatives !

  According to the Bible, only 3 people were ever 'perfect' on this earth, 2/3 of them could not follow simple instructions (watch out for that...TREEEEEEEE !) What chance do we have...? If the Bible is true, we are compelled to worship a god that, if he were human, would have been locked away long ago for the slaughter of untold, er, written deaths of billions of people through disease, war and outright homicide. Not to mention his 'future' plans. We are "compelled", because we want to live.

  So, something just doesn't add up right, to me anyway.

  For me, I simply don't need to debate 'ancient historians' accounts to see the hypocrisy in the Bible -- or other religions. It's just too obvious.

  It took me a long time to 'call a spade, a spade' (since 1971), but, here I am. I still believe in a 'creator' somehow. I don't know exactly 'what' 'it' is or what 'it' wants, if anything. Maybe 'it' put us here to fend for ourselves...never to live forever...just simply to live and then die.

  Not exactly a 'comfort' thought, not very warm, either. But, ya' know what ? I can accept that now. If I die tomorrow, I will have had some pretty crappy things happen to me and my loved ones...BUT, I still will have loved ! I helped make babies, I've seen beauty, smelled wonderful scents, touched millions of different textures, tasted untold numbers of flavors and I've heard beautiful sounds. So, I've had a lot of happiness, too.

  I don't have to believe in the Bible God -- or any other god, for that matter, in order to sleep at night or be happy.

  Is there a God or creator ? I dunno. Who really does ?

  I think faith = want. What do you want ?

  Just a hare-bwain Wabbit's... ramblings.

  Never say never...
• 

  mdb

  there is no god, the bible is not true and JW's are wrong

  The JW's are wrong, the NWT bible in not true to the ancient Greek texts (the infallible word of God is true), there is one true God.
• 

  nicolaou

  bumped in response to gaiagirls topic . . .
• 

  tec

  It is funny how people can see the same evidence, and reach entirely different conclusions, isn't it? Like seeing how different elements of creation stories, or flood stories, etc, in various cultures and times... and concluding that they are fictional; without even considering that this lends credence to the truth behind them; truth being carried or discerned/heard... between all cultures. Just with bits added in or taken away from as time and distance allows.

  In this post that you have written, I see those outrageous statments and know they are true... from looking at the teachings of Christ and hearing the truth in them regarding love, forgiveness, mercy, the law, etc...(seeing that truth in my own life, including according to the teachings he still gives as the Spirit)... and understand that lies do not come from the truth; so then I must therefore believe ALL that He said about Himself and about His Father.

  I have since received more evidence for faith from having been given the faith to hear and beleive these things, to strengthen that faith.

  In any case, your op does not show that Christ is a liar... it only lays out the three things Christ could be: a liar, a crazy man (he was accused of both), and the Messiah. (though technically a fourth option is that people lied about him, and he never claimed such things in the first place)

  (What is also interesting is the extreme care you took, Nic, in not wanting to offend anyone or break any rules... and this post is respectful... whereas the posts today, the insults for believing (and some for not believing), go way beyond today what you were worried about 7 years ago.)

  Peace,

  tammy (who didn't arbitrarily bump this thread, it was linked to in a more recent thread, lol)
• 

  Finkelstein

  The story of Jesus was just but one of the many stories contained within ancient mythological beliefs.

  Yes, certainly emotional engaging but unfortunately fictional in content but thats the true adherent nature of mythology.
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  Seraphim23

  Except that the majority of scholars do except the existence and crucifixion of Jesus as historical. People argue about the details but the consensus of historians is positive.
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  cofty

  Was Jesus mad or bad? I'm not sure. He was a false prophet so we can rule out son of god.

  Look forward to reading this old thread later.
• 

  tec

  False prophet is entirely based on your own opinion and interpretation. He did not predict anything false, and so cannot be a false prophet.

  He predicted many things that did come to pass; and some are still to come.

  Peace,

  tammy