Posts by undercover

4

Should all the JW`s who ever took part in a quick build/renovations take out a class action against the WTB&TS for compensation ?

by smiddy in

let`s face it , the people who took part in quick builds / renovations of kingdom halls , etc, never expected the wtb&ts to sell off the buildings they were so sure was for furthering kingdom interests in this system of things .. they gave their time, effort, money, labour ,free of charge , and then some years later the society sells it off for a profit ?

to the wt ?.

kingdom halls , assembly halls , etc.

undercover

Nope. Waste of time and effort. You volunteered your time to an organization. They fact that they sold that properly later is just business. Lesson learned... make sure of the organization and how their set up before volunteering time and/or money.

What a lot of JWs didn't know, and I didn't either when I first started working on quick build projects, is that some 'brothers' are hired as contractors to provide services. I volunteered to help build items that were installed in KHs, and helped install them. I found out (thru an elder who knew the real scoop) that the brother in charge of this area was contracted and being paid to provide and install the items. This guy had over half the KH helping him construct the items in his shop, and installing at KH projects. He was getting free labor, and pocketing quite the profit. Once I learned this, I stopped volunteering. In fact, I stopped helping in any of the building projects, and this was when I was still active and mostly believing. If I could volunteer my time to help, why couldn't these so-called skilled 'brothers'.

It was a racket. The biggest racket was the WTS getting free building labor from thousands of people, but on the local level some 'brothers' found an angle on how to make a profit themselves and fleeced congregations. I knew one brother who was kicked out of the building committee because he found cheaper quotes from 'worldly' sources for renovating a KH, but the committee said it had to be done by approved contractors (read: fellow JWs). The JW contractors were quoting up to 50% more than non-JWs. The brother complained and was subsequently booted. But in time, the committee brothers were found out by the WTS and the committee was disbanded and some of them DFd. I guess they didn't like small timers weaseling in on their turf. It's like a bad Mafia movie...

71

2016 Regional Convention - Sunday Morning synopsis

by Jehalapeno in

jw
friends

via reddit.

here are the morning program highlights.

will update for the afternoon once it's all over.

undercover

If I had the time, I'd like to make one of those, 'Hitler hates....' videos, named 'Hitler Hates the JW Bunker Scene'

So many jokes to be made...

24

Why it's a waste of time talking to JW's

by Phizzy in

i believe it to be a waste of time talking to, reasoning with, jw's if you expect any kind of quick result.. many of us when we first wake up think that 'coz ttatt is blindingly obvious to us, it will soon get through to our jw loved ones.. this simply isn't so for a couple of important reasons.

the first is that, if someone believes something is true, or the truth, to them it really is, without doubt, true.

so whatever you say must be wrong somehow.. the second problem is that jw's simply do not have to use, or pay any attention to facts and logic.

undercover

Substitute JW with Mormon, Catholic, Baptist. It's all the same when it comes to faith and belief. One believes what one wants to believe, despite the facts and the logic. Until a person gives voice to the doubts or questions his faith, then you're not going to convince them they're wrong. Just like us at one time. Until we admitted to ourselves that something was wrong, we ignored all the criticisms, evidence against our beliefs. We thought we had the 'truth'.

Now, that's not to say it's a complete waste of time trying to enlighten a JW. You have to know and accept that you're not going to convince them in a relatively short time period. You have to plant the seed, and maybe water it from time to time. And it may never take root, but maybe one day, something triggers deep in their mind, and that doubt creeps to the surface, and they give it voice. And they research on their own. They're on their way then...

26

Now finally Caleb & Sofia Anti-Gay Video going viral in Germany too

by Daniel1555 in

today spiegel online & bento have an article about the anti-gay video.. spiegel is one of the biggest and most serious news media in germany.. they also report and show that youtubers cut the video and changed it in a funny way.

sofia tells her mother that the teacher said it's fine if they live each other.

then sofia's mother says: "thats wonderful.".

undercover

I agree that the video isn't really shocking. It presents the JW belief, based on the Bible, that being gay is a sin, and not acceptable behavior in order to reach paradise. Most fundamentalists accept the same teaching, substituting heaven for paradise. It's standard MO for religions like this.

But this comment lets slip your prejudice:

The cat has been out of the bag a long time ago regarding the biblical stance on this deviant behavior.

Deviant? This is where people take offense at the WT video, or other anti-gay propaganda. That it's presented as a learned, perverted, deviant lifestyle. Which is not the case. It's something one is born with. One is born gay the same way one is born with whatever skin color they have.

So while I don't take offence at the WTS using a video to further their doctrine, I do understand that it is propaganda pure and simple...but to be expected from a religion like this.

5

Finally watched the anti-gay WT video

by undercover in

jw
friends

i avoided watching the wt video where the daughter/mother discuss 'leaving' gaydom behind in order to reach paradise for as long as i could, but finally gave in and watched it; just so i know exactly what it says and how it's presented, should it come up in conversation with jw family.. it wasn't as shocking as i expected, having read some of the angst filled posts here and on facebook (thanks to george takei).

they're presenting their beliefs as supported by scripture from the bible.

and if you're a true believer in that book, then you would find yourself having to at least give some thought to what is said.

undercover

I avoided watching the WT video where the daughter/mother discuss 'leaving' gaydom behind in order to reach paradise for as long as I could, but finally gave in and watched it; just so I know exactly what it says and how it's presented, should it come up in conversation with JW family.

It wasn't as shocking as I expected, having read some of the angst filled posts here and on Facebook (thanks to George Takei). They're presenting their beliefs as supported by scripture from the Bible. And if you're a true believer in that book, then you would find yourself having to at least give some thought to what is said.

However - if you're beyond accepting early bronze age allegories, legends, and myths, as the actual Word and Law of God then you just shake your head at the ignorance and backwards thinking presented in the video. It's easy to pick apart, starting with the belief of Adam being the first created man, to the silly illustration of dropping that 'gay' bag in order to take the plane to paradise (that's the most propaganda part. You can't just drop what you were born with or as. It's still presented as that it's a choice, and a perverted one, therefore you're not allowed to share in the paradise God has reserved for heteros only). But try changing a true believer who accepts the Bible as final authority, and you're pretty much wasting your time.

In the overall scheme of things, it doesn't really matter if it's a WT video, a Mormon one, or even from a local Baptist church. It's a fundamentalist belief, based on the Bible, and as long as there are conservative fundies who accept the Bible as the final say in how they think and believe, this thinking is going to trump any progressive, modern (no matter how factual they may be) ideals anyone else may have.

But I am glad it was the WTS that got lambasted and lampooned over it. Hopefully it helps any fence sitters, or doubters, question a little harder.

38

Anti-Gay Cartoon Still Making Rounds: George Takei weighs in

by freemindfade in

i also heard the video was being discussed on howard stern today.

.

undercover

Unless you live in Arkansas, Louisiana, Alabama, Mississippi or Tennessee.

and don't forget good ole 'we hate transgenders' North Carolina

(disclaimer: not everyone in NC is agreement with HB2, but the politicians are playing to the conservative fundamentalists that vote them in, even to the point of fighting the federal government. What was once the most progressive state of the old Confederacy, now, thanks to the politicians in Raleigh, acts like they want to be seen as an independent state, free of federal influence or oversight. It's 1860 all over again, this time over LGBT rights instead of slavery)

This WTS video seems like it will play well with older conservatives and fundies, but to younger, more progressive folks, it's a shameful video. That's why George Takai linked to it, expressing concern.

38

Anti-Gay Cartoon Still Making Rounds: George Takei weighs in

by freemindfade in

i also heard the video was being discussed on howard stern today.

.

undercover

Unless you live in Arkansas, Louisiana, Alabama, Mississippi or Tennessee.

and don't forget good ole 'we hate transgenders' North Carolina

(disclaimer: not everyone in NC is agreement with HB2, but the politicians are playing to the conservative fundamentalists that vote them in, even to the point of fighting the federal government. What was once the most progressive state of the old Confederacy, now, thanks to the politicians in Raleigh, acts like they want to be seen as an independent state, free of federal influence or oversight. It's 1860 all over again, this time over LGBT rights instead of slavery)

This WTS video seems like it will play well with older conservatives and fundies, but to younger, more progressive folks, it's a shameful video. That's why George Takai linked to it, expressing concern.

150

I'm getting baptized

by BlackWolf in

jw
friends

i know i've started similar topics before but this time i'm serious.

my parents have been constantly pressuring me and after yesterday's watchtower study they asked me if i was going to be baptized this summer... and i said yes.

i probably should have thought about it more before making a final decision, but they're pretty much forcing me to do it anyway.

undercover

Don't know much about you, especially your age. But I would advise against it if at all possible.

If you're not baptized then you can never be DFd later. May not seem like a big deal to someone who knows TATT, and vows to leave later anyway, but to your parents it might be the difference between them accepting you as a someone who drifted away, always hoping for a return, as opposed to someone who rebelled and was DFd. You can keep some semblance of family interaction, even if it's overshadowed by JWism.

Again, you might not care now, seeing your parents as the enemy, but believe me, when you're older, even if you're not in agreement about core beliefs, you may very well regret shutting that door.

Maybe you can tell them you need more time to really be sure you're fit to serve at your best, and right now you feel too immature. I mean, Jesus was 30, right?

38

Anti-Gay Cartoon Still Making Rounds: George Takei weighs in

by freemindfade in

i also heard the video was being discussed on howard stern today.

.

undercover

I'm for anything that embarrasses JWs in front of the general population.

I sense that many JWs are not homophobic, or as anti-gay as the WTS leaders would have them be. They're more of a 'live and let live' type of people - when left to their own devices and not repeating the WT mantra of 'oh woe is the world'. Especially the younger generation. If the WTS comes off like Westboro Lite, it might help some who are starting to get inklings that not all is right with JW beliefs dig a little deeper.

171

RC 2016 Leaks & Releases

by wifibandit in

in an effort to reduce the number of posts, this year i will try to add links to this post.

now, on with the leaks & releases!

first up.... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0nzvwhflss4.

undercover

This is literally The Walking Dead. They're walking and talking, but might as well as be dead. They have no life whatsoever. Sell your stuff, live in a hovel, read the Bible, go to WT school. Hell, the walkers on the TV show have more life in them than that.

At least Rick, Daryl, Carol and those guys have some personality, and make their show interesting to watch to a degree. And they have weapons. These video dubs are worse than the Hill Top community, growing veggies for Negan, but no weapons. These guys hide in a basement and reminisce about when they didn't have stuff. And now they're worried? What's to worry? When you got nothing, you got nothing to lose (with apologies to Mr. Dylan)