Saintbertholdt

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Posts by Saintbertholdt

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  34

  Hypothetical Question...

  by JW_Rogue in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i was just thinking that the org has said lots of outrageous things over it's history and most jws just continue onward without a second thought.

  so my question is what do you think would have to be said from the platform or wt to get people to get up and walk out immediately?

  is it even possible?

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  Saintbertholdt

  So my question is what do you think would have to be said from the platform or WT to get people to get up and walk out immediately?

  Recanting on the doctrine of the ransom.
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  28

  I'm a cynical, sarcastic and curmudgeonly old bastard most of the time.

  by nicolaou in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  but as i move into my early 50's i find i'm more and more comfortable in my thick, leathery hide.. please get it into your thick skull's that i don't insult or make snarky comments with the intent of hurting anyone's feelings.

  that being said, if your precious feelings are hurt it's probably your fault for being a prissy, over sensitive drama queen who can't defend his argument.. i do actually love you all, it's just that most of the time you spineless pussies really get on my nerves!.

  good god i feel better for that!

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  Saintbertholdt

  
  
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  44

  Why do people follow demonstrably False Prophets?

  by WireRider in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  why does everyone just turn a blind eye to the false teachings of the watchtower?

  the bible warns us many times and in many ways not to follow false prophets - including the lake of fire.

  fundamentally why do the followers of the watchtower just ignore the very bible they claim to live by?.

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  Saintbertholdt

  Well according to what I observe Harris is introducing spiritual ideas to secularists such as meditation. This is not new but what is new is the attempting of a 21st century rational scientific justification for it. Harris has a background in Buddhism so naturally he will extract the useful tenets of that doctrine.

  What Harris has missed which others have previously picked up on (such as Lavey and early socialist ideas such as "God-Building") is the human desire for ritual. Lavey recognized that at the core of religion sits ritual. It doesn't matter who you are, human beings love rituals. I suspect it gives surety, definiteness and a sense of order. From initiation/acceptance rituals such as a Jewish bris, to African marriage dancing feasts etc.

  Then there is also superstition which is where the human sub-conscience overrules the most rational human behaviour.

  Deep reverence is an idea which was popularized by Carl Sagan. which he argued was not only the purview of religion but also science.

  Then there's also religious prophesy which secularism is for the first time attempting: The technological singularity

  Sooner or later these ideas are going to be amalgamated into new secular religious philosophies.

  This is a logical next step.

  And yes, music did reach it's peak in 1979!

  What? Disco, Punk and/or Glam Rock?

  Oh come now, don't be a grandpa... Listen to some NIN, Depeche mode, Wolf mother, Radiohead or even Knife Party.
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  44

  Why do people follow demonstrably False Prophets?

  by WireRider in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  why does everyone just turn a blind eye to the false teachings of the watchtower?

  the bible warns us many times and in many ways not to follow false prophets - including the lake of fire.

  fundamentally why do the followers of the watchtower just ignore the very bible they claim to live by?.

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  Saintbertholdt

  Sam Harris is inventing a new religion?

  Well that didn't take long to misconstrue. I wrote: "You can already see this germinating..." I did not write invent...

  http://www.samharris.org/podcast/item/mindfulness-meditation

  Also see - Waking Up: A Guide to Spirituality Without Religion - Sam Harris

  Let me further rustle your jimmies nicolaou.

  In the 21st century you are of a generation of secularists that will rally and rail against any form of spiritual/religious idea. And just like every generation that thinks the new generations music and culture is crap, you will be stoic and curmudgeony about secular religion. But your grand children won't...
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  44

  Why do people follow demonstrably False Prophets?

  by WireRider in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  why does everyone just turn a blind eye to the false teachings of the watchtower?

  the bible warns us many times and in many ways not to follow false prophets - including the lake of fire.

  fundamentally why do the followers of the watchtower just ignore the very bible they claim to live by?.

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  Saintbertholdt

  ALL religion is a man made construct and therefore a crock of shit!

  which was followed up with

  Agreed cantleave, there's no such thing as false religion or true religion, just religion.

  That religion is a human invention is correct. That its all a crock of shit just because its a human invention I disagree with. For example: Laveyan satanism.

  In the 21st century humans will further invent new religions based upon secularist ideas.

  You can already see this germinating in the writings of Sam Harris for example.
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  44

  Why do people follow demonstrably False Prophets?

  by WireRider in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  why does everyone just turn a blind eye to the false teachings of the watchtower?

  the bible warns us many times and in many ways not to follow false prophets - including the lake of fire.

  fundamentally why do the followers of the watchtower just ignore the very bible they claim to live by?.

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  Saintbertholdt

  Hi kaik,

  Of course it does. It is a book of full hate, misogyny, homophobia, endorsing slavery, war, persecutions of others.

  Well that is very much the theme of the Old Testament. And don't forget genocide which also features from time to time. Then the story of Jesus comes along which says forget all that with the turning of the other cheek and the golden rule and so on. God either has multiple personality disorder or he has one wicked sense of humor.

  Wirerider,

  Why do people still believe anything the they say?

  In answer nicolaou wrote,

  Like I said, for the same reason people believe what the Bible says. If you put faith before reason you can believe anything and anyone.

  The Bible has such divergent narratives, conflicting principles and fantastic myths that anyone can basically construct any religion they want to. Be it conservative, prophetic, heretical. millennialist or any other school of thought. For example here's an interesting read: The Yoga of Jesus - Understanding the hidden teachings of the gospels. Or how about: www.jesuswasaspacealien.com

  One could dismiss these as mental fertilizer, but what makes one school of thought better than another?

  The believer already has to suspend their critical thinking to a large extent to accommodate the fantastic yarns found within the Bible's pages, so all that one ends up doing is arguing the matter of degree and personal taste.
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  10

  A time to recognize

  by BrokenBonz in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  it's my time to recognize the faults that i've made.

  in my case, i was inattentive, uncaring, selfish, and aloof.

  it has brought me to this time in my life the waking call of my errors.

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  Saintbertholdt

  One year ago I was glad to just be alive. Every day was a joy and blessing. And so on.

  Today I can say that over time I have lost that feeling and I've become the same narcissist that I was before.

  And so it goes.
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  31

  Never Bring a Knife to a Drone Fight

  by LoveUniHateExams in

  1. social
  2. current

  apparently, it's good news, everybody - mohammed emwazi (aka jihadi john) has been targeted by a us drone strike.

  the location was in raqqa, syria, a few yards from isis hq, near a clock tower where crucifixions are carried out.

  there are conflicting reports, some say he died instantly at 11:40pm yesterday, others say that he was badly injured and taken to a nearby hospital.. from what i've previously read about emwazi, he was apparently terrified of being targeted by drones - yesterday it seems his nightmare was made reality.

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  Saintbertholdt

  It's known as the "drone scuttle".

  You know that feeling when you've done something really stupid which might be deadly, like when you've accidentally run a red traffic light?

  Now I surmise that you get that exact same feeling of knots in your stomach and that suspicion that your bottom innards are falling out just about 100 ms before you start your salutary "drone scuttle" tap dance.
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  29

  Why do most Christians churches have masonic and/or pagan symbols?

  by kabwell in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  has anyone looked at the local churches in their area and seen pagan and freemason symbols both inside and outside.

  i am not a jw but at least they don't seem to follow this trend.

  why do "christians" wear a symbol of torture and death ?

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  Saintbertholdt

  Yeah I wrote a post on another ex-JW forum called: The fish god and the Watchtower phallus to illustrate the point that you can go and find pagan symbolism wherever you want to.

  For example: The Pope's mitre looks like a fish, so the 19th century theologian Alexander Hislop concluded it was of pagan origin. So therefore in Watchtower theology the Ichthys had to go as well, all because it was a fish.

  Well my argument is that the Watchtower symbol also has pagan origins. You could argue that according to the OT Nimrod started the first cities which would have reasonably had lookout posts or Watch towers. And Nimrod was supposedly in opposition to God and founded Babylon (according to the witnesses), so whatever he did was pretty evil. The Watchtower symbol is also pretty phallic so therefore you could proceed to throw the baby out with the bathwater and out of Babylon's watchtower.
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  29

  Why do most Christians churches have masonic and/or pagan symbols?

  by kabwell in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  has anyone looked at the local churches in their area and seen pagan and freemason symbols both inside and outside.

  i am not a jw but at least they don't seem to follow this trend.

  why do "christians" wear a symbol of torture and death ?

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  Saintbertholdt

  Hi Bugbear,

  If I remember correctly, the first christians in Rome used the drawings of a fishlike symbol. This symbol has been uset in the ancient rom catacombs.

  Historicians belived that It was a secret sign, to gather all those who secretly belived in Jesus. Remember the Bible story of the "fisherman"..!

  Yeah its called the ICHTHYS

  A Christian would draw one half of the fish symbol in the dirt and the onlooker would complete the symbol to indicate that they were both Christians.

  "Ίησοῦς Χριστός, Θεοῦ Υἱός, Σωτήρ", (Iēsous Christos, Theou Yios, Sōtēr), which translates into English as "Jesus Christ, Son of God, Saviour"

  However using the OP's logic one could argue that the fish was used for centuries before that in pagan worship, so one would have to conclude that it was also pagan. Yes pagan symbolism can be kicked out behind every rock but its sort of ridiculous because symbols mean whatever meaning we ascribe to them.

  Also paganism existed way before Christianity and so all symbols used since then can be construed as pagan.