Posts by Saintbertholdt

44

Why do people follow demonstrably False Prophets?

by WireRider in

why does everyone just turn a blind eye to the false teachings of the watchtower?

the bible warns us many times and in many ways not to follow false prophets - including the lake of fire.

fundamentally why do the followers of the watchtower just ignore the very bible they claim to live by?.

Saintbertholdt

Hi kaik,

Of course it does. It is a book of full hate, misogyny, homophobia, endorsing slavery, war, persecutions of others.

Well that is very much the theme of the Old Testament. And don't forget genocide which also features from time to time. Then the story of Jesus comes along which says forget all that with the turning of the other cheek and the golden rule and so on. God either has multiple personality disorder or he has one wicked sense of humor.

Wirerider,

Why do people still believe anything the they say?

In answer nicolaou wrote,

Like I said, for the same reason people believe what the Bible says. If you put faith before reason you can believe anything and anyone.

The Bible has such divergent narratives, conflicting principles and fantastic myths that anyone can basically construct any religion they want to. Be it conservative, prophetic, heretical. millennialist or any other school of thought. For example here's an interesting read: The Yoga of Jesus - Understanding the hidden teachings of the gospels. Or how about: www.jesuswasaspacealien.com

One could dismiss these as mental fertilizer, but what makes one school of thought better than another?

The believer already has to suspend their critical thinking to a large extent to accommodate the fantastic yarns found within the Bible's pages, so all that one ends up doing is arguing the matter of degree and personal taste.

10

A time to recognize

by BrokenBonz in

it's my time to recognize the faults that i've made.

in my case, i was inattentive, uncaring, selfish, and aloof.

it has brought me to this time in my life the waking call of my errors.

Saintbertholdt

One year ago I was glad to just be alive. Every day was a joy and blessing. And so on.

Today I can say that over time I have lost that feeling and I've become the same narcissist that I was before.

And so it goes.

31

Never Bring a Knife to a Drone Fight

by LoveUniHateExams in

apparently, it's good news, everybody - mohammed emwazi (aka jihadi john) has been targeted by a us drone strike.

the location was in raqqa, syria, a few yards from isis hq, near a clock tower where crucifixions are carried out.

there are conflicting reports, some say he died instantly at 11:40pm yesterday, others say that he was badly injured and taken to a nearby hospital.. from what i've previously read about emwazi, he was apparently terrified of being targeted by drones - yesterday it seems his nightmare was made reality.

Saintbertholdt

It's known as the "drone scuttle".

You know that feeling when you've done something really stupid which might be deadly, like when you've accidentally run a red traffic light?

Now I surmise that you get that exact same feeling of knots in your stomach and that suspicion that your bottom innards are falling out just about 100 ms before you start your salutary "drone scuttle" tap dance.

29

Why do most Christians churches have masonic and/or pagan symbols?

by kabwell in

has anyone looked at the local churches in their area and seen pagan and freemason symbols both inside and outside.

i am not a jw but at least they don't seem to follow this trend.

why do "christians" wear a symbol of torture and death ?

Saintbertholdt

Yeah I wrote a post on another ex-JW forum called: The fish god and the Watchtower phallus to illustrate the point that you can go and find pagan symbolism wherever you want to.

For example: The Pope's mitre looks like a fish, so the 19th century theologian Alexander Hislop concluded it was of pagan origin. So therefore in Watchtower theology the Ichthys had to go as well, all because it was a fish.

Well my argument is that the Watchtower symbol also has pagan origins. You could argue that according to the OT Nimrod started the first cities which would have reasonably had lookout posts or Watch towers. And Nimrod was supposedly in opposition to God and founded Babylon (according to the witnesses), so whatever he did was pretty evil. The Watchtower symbol is also pretty phallic so therefore you could proceed to throw the baby out with the bathwater and out of Babylon's watchtower.

29

Why do most Christians churches have masonic and/or pagan symbols?

by kabwell in

has anyone looked at the local churches in their area and seen pagan and freemason symbols both inside and outside.

i am not a jw but at least they don't seem to follow this trend.

why do "christians" wear a symbol of torture and death ?

Saintbertholdt

Hi Bugbear,

If I remember correctly, the first christians in Rome used the drawings of a fishlike symbol. This symbol has been uset in the ancient rom catacombs.

Historicians belived that It was a secret sign, to gather all those who secretly belived in Jesus. Remember the Bible story of the "fisherman"..!

Yeah its called the ICHTHYS

A Christian would draw one half of the fish symbol in the dirt and the onlooker would complete the symbol to indicate that they were both Christians.

"Ίησοῦς Χριστός, Θεοῦ Υἱός, Σωτήρ", (Iēsous Christos, Theou Yios, Sōtēr), which translates into English as "Jesus Christ, Son of God, Saviour"

However using the OP's logic one could argue that the fish was used for centuries before that in pagan worship, so one would have to conclude that it was also pagan. Yes pagan symbolism can be kicked out behind every rock but its sort of ridiculous because symbols mean whatever meaning we ascribe to them.

Also paganism existed way before Christianity and so all symbols used since then can be construed as pagan.

29

Why do most Christians churches have masonic and/or pagan symbols?

by kabwell in

has anyone looked at the local churches in their area and seen pagan and freemason symbols both inside and outside.

i am not a jw but at least they don't seem to follow this trend.

why do "christians" wear a symbol of torture and death ?

Saintbertholdt

Hi there kabwell,
"Has anyone looked at the local churches in their area and seen pagan and freemason symbols both inside and outside."

Freemasonry has actually adopted many Christian symbols over the centuries. For example:

The Cross and Crown (Used in the early days of the Bible students)

Eye of Providence (Comes from the time of the renaissance representing the trinity)

That is also why there is a Bible on the altar of most masonic lodges.

Why do "Christians" wear a symbol of torture and death?

The symbol of the naked cross indicates the triumph of Jesus over death. That is why it is depicted as being empty. It therefore primarily serves as a symbol of victory and not of torture.

Most world religions have a Mary and child type god so this is just another pagan part of mainstream Christianity.

The veneration of a female deity is as you pointed out very old. One has to remember that the Bible is also full of this type of imagery. In Revelations the Bride of Christ and the woman giving birth in the desert features strongly and has given the impetus to Christianity for its usage.

Would any Christian give away everything to someone in need as Jesus did?

Some have I guess.

63

Raining before the Flood?

by GrownMidget in

i remember at my teen years when i was studying with a brother that he said to me that there was no rain before the flood.

instead there was this mist that you have.

never before or after this have i heard something like this.

Saintbertholdt

(Genesis 2:5, 6) 5 Now there was as yet no bush of the field found in the earth and no vegetation of the field was as yet sprouting, because Jehovah God had not made it rain upon the earth and there was no man to cultivate the ground. 6 But a mist would go up from the earth and it watered the entire surface of the ground.

183

JWs have more good points than bad

by lsw1961 in

1) many who were on the destructive path have been transformed by their teachings (this includes me who was once vicious, and presumptuous and atheistic).

2) equal monthly pay to all members of the bethel community regardless of whether they are bc members or sweepers.

this is something that still remains as an unattainable dream for the world.

Saintbertholdt

Hi lsw1961,
Cultic aspects fall into details.

The details they say, is where the devil resides. You have acknowledged two important points:

1. That shunning is wrong

2. Information control is in effect which you regard as a detail.

These two points are what most people on this site protest about. Why? Because it has negative lasting practical impacts upon their daily lives which the Watchtower organization perpetuates on purpose. If the two points mentioned above disappeared from the Watchtowers dogma most ex-Jehovah's Witnesses would not care about what the organization did or did not do or even believed.

After that, looking back at the organization through your hurt eyes will not give you correct vision. Transcend your personal hurt, you will be amazed at the results—you will not see your hurt, but will see the grand, beautiful, core cause the JW system stands for. Its all have to do with our view.

What you would have to remember is that this 'grand, beautiful, core cause' which you are promoting on this site is a promotion that you are not allowed to undertake under the Watchtowers own set of rules.

So what you are left with if you discard all the rules which you disagree with is basically worldwide promotion of the Bible. And here is where things get very interesting because:

When it comes to the core distribution of the Bible, the Watchtower organization is by far not the leading organization in this regard. Gideon International is by far the pinnacle organization.

Since its inception Gideon International has distributed: 1, 300, 000, 000 bibles

The Watchtower has distributed: 300, 000, 000 bibles

Regarding the Watchtowers other publications, none of these have lasting value because the dogma undergoes significant changes over time which makes the older publications valueless.

Every Bible that Gideon International has placed is usable from its first day to its very last.

183

JWs have more good points than bad

by lsw1961 in

1) many who were on the destructive path have been transformed by their teachings (this includes me who was once vicious, and presumptuous and atheistic).

2) equal monthly pay to all members of the bethel community regardless of whether they are bc members or sweepers.

this is something that still remains as an unattainable dream for the world.

Saintbertholdt

Hi Isw1961,
Communism could not withstand the overwhelming and hostile environment around it.

In other words the system could not compete and is inefficient. If you want to drive a car that constantly breaks down, has a 900cc engine, is grey in color, comes in a single model and is rarely available to the general populace because its frightfully expensive, then communism is certainly for you.

When I asked him what he liked the most in Bethel, he said “the equal pay.”

You wrote "...they were materially very rich". So they could leave Bethel with impunity. Then carry with their luxurious lives and refer to their time at Bethel as a wonderful and liberating experience which everyone should adopt. Have you ever wondered why most worldwide missionaries and relief agency's hail from rich capitalist countries? Because philanthropy comes from surplus and not from want.

You have not addressed the matter of the control of and denying access to information by the Watchtower organization. That is the outstanding quality of any cult organization (see my previous posts).

BTW is the PM you're referring to Tulsi Giri?

17

Told a JW about ARC in August, finally got a reply - Return to Jehovah booklet!!

by Xanthippe in

so i've mentioned this friend of my husband's who started writing to me out of the blue about three years ago, decades after we d'aed.

last august i wrote to her about the arc and jackson's summons.

i gave her the website details so she could see for herself.

Saintbertholdt

... folks we're not even close to at the KH are asking my wife "how I am"

Well Kurt you're fine cause you're working on your next book: The return of the Kilgore Trout