i remember having read somewhere, but i cannot find it anymore, that it is possible to debunk the 1914 calculus using only jw publications, like "insight on the scriptures" (chronologies) for example.. do you have any sources about that to suggest to me?.
thanks..
By constructing a scheme of Chronology based on the backward computation of the reigns of the N B Period you get 586/587 for the Fall of Jerusalem based on material in the Insight volumes. I get that!
The Insight volumes omit nothing and are correct in being faithful to the Bible.
Scholar can be quite wordy but if you skim over the barrage of condescending insults, dig through the layers of wishful thinking and look for the simple truths, they are in there somewhere.
i remember having read somewhere, but i cannot find it anymore, that it is possible to debunk the 1914 calculus using only jw publications, like "insight on the scriptures" (chronologies) for example.. do you have any sources about that to suggest to me?.
thanks..
Thanks Scholar for your reply to this little person.
Please educate me some more.
You said "Your methodology is flawed as it does not account for the biblical-historical period of the 70 years which is unaccounted for in the scheme of NB Period which you have taken from the Insight volumes."
So I pointed out that using the Insight chronology (not really my methodology to be fair) of one king after another, using the Insight volume reign lengths, Jerusalem fell in 587BCE.
Where do these extra 70 years that you insist on come in, in the Insight books?
I went back and reread them and no kings were missing and there was no mention of dropping in an extra 70 years somewhere or other.
Are the Insight books wrong or missing something, because the simple sums from there lead me to 587BCE?
i thought i’d shear this with you good people.
the cognitive dissonance is just breath taking.
i over heard this comment at a relatives family dinner the other night.
OP’s comment from a JW that “Jehovah’s organisation has never stopped anyone from growing a beard” is true.
The org in fact cannot stop you from growing a beard.
In true JW fashion they have deceitfully reframed the problem into something they can defend.
The more accurate truth is that Jehovahs organisation will penalise and punish you for growing a beard.
i remember having read somewhere, but i cannot find it anymore, that it is possible to debunk the 1914 calculus using only jw publications, like "insight on the scriptures" (chronologies) for example.. do you have any sources about that to suggest to me?.
thanks..
Apologies for the formatting (posting on a tablet), but here’s the Insight confirming 587BCE. The important bit is in bold.
We need to look at the timeline from the destruction of Jerusalem through to when Babylon was overthrown and the Jews allowed back home. Keep in mind that these dates are all BCE which means the higher the number, the further back in time it is. |
WT say this was from 607BCE until 539 BCE - approx 70 years. Scholars say this was from 587BCE until 539 BCE - approx 50 years. |
The one thing scholars and WT agree on is the date of 539 BCE which is when Babylon was overthrown and Cyrus gave his permission for the Jews to return to their homeland. This means we have to start at the agreed date and work backwards to find the starting point for when Jerusalem was destroyed. |
1. First you need to identify the list of kings from the decree of Cyrus (which gives us a fixed year in time - 539 BCE) back to the fall of Jerusalem. Insight Vol 1 p.425. |
2. Also establish that Cyrus gave his decree for the Jews to return at the same time, in 539 B.C.E. Insight Vol 2 p.332 |
3. Now work through that list backwards in time and let's add how long each king reigns: |
- 539 BCE - The end of Belshazzars rule. Insight Vol 1 p.283-284 |
- Minus Nabonidus rule (17 years) = 556 BCE - Insight Vol 2 p.457-458 |
- Minus Labashi-Marduk (9 months) = 557 BCE - W65 1/1 p.29 |
- Minus Neriglissar (4 years) = 561 BCE - Insight Vol 1 p.453 |
- Minus Evil-Merodach (2 years) = 563 BCE - Insight Vol 1 p.773 |
- Minus Nebuchadnezzar (43 years) = 606 BCE - Insight Vol 2 p.480 |
- This gives us 606 BCE as the start of Nebuchadnezzar's reign (from 606 BCE to 563 BCE), but it was in 19th year of Nebuchadnezzar's reign that Jerusalem fell, so one more sum: |
- ADD 19 years to 606 BCE = 587 BCE - Insight Vol 1 p. 447 |
Apart from Labashi-Marduk, all the kings details are in the Insight books, so it's pretty easy to work out. What does get confusing is that the Insight book also uses their own, fictitious dates all the way through, but going by this factual list of kings and dates you can prove the Insight books contradict themselves and the 587 BCE date is proven correct. |
Look, all JW's can go to any encyclopedia and prove that Jesus Christ was not born on December 25th. This is the line often used by Jehovah's Witnesses to point out that Christmas is NOT a Christian holiday. Yet, those same encyclopedia's are not trusted when it comes to the date of Jerusalem's desolation because they all disagree with the Watchtower's date of 607 B.C.E. |
WT repeatedly state that no scholars accept the 607 BCE date. The old AID book said on p.322-348 "These dates are some 20 years later than those presented in the chart accompanying this article ... This is because we accept the Biblical information, particularly as regards the seventy-year desolation of Judah (running from 607 to 537 B.C.E.), as accurate and as superior in reliability to the ancient secular records." |
Even in WT's two article defence of 607 BCE in Oct/Nov 2011 they add the footnote: "Note: None of the secular experts quoted in this article hold that Jerusalem was destroyed in 607 B.C.E." |
it just occurred to me that those born in 2014, 100 years after the epochal date of 1914, will be 9 years old this year and are starting to become candidates for baptism.. 1914 used to be relatable in that our parents or grand parents lived then, but not any more.. it’s dropped so far into history that any significance linked to it is just as convincing as the black death being a harbinger for armageddon.. never mind that we are also now crossing the 100 year threshold for the 7 trumpets of declarations that occurred during the 1920’s!
remind me, how important were these angelic messages?
if i was still a jw i would have to isolate my jw brain from all thinking and reasoning so i could continue to believe.. honestly, did it even make sense back in the day?.
It just occurred to me that those born in 2014, 100 years after the epochal date of 1914, will be 9 years old this year and are starting to become candidates for baptism.
1914 used to be relatable in that our parents or grand parents lived then, but not any more.
it’s dropped so far into history that any significance linked to it is just as convincing as the Black Death being a harbinger for Armageddon.
Never mind that we are also now crossing the 100 year threshold for the 7 trumpets of declarations that occurred during the 1920’s! Remind me, how important were these angelic messages? What were they again?
if I was still a JW I would have to isolate my JW brain from all thinking and reasoning so I could continue to believe.
Honestly, did it even make sense back in the day?
so, my spies tell me that the east pennines a$$emb£y hall is being sold and all proceeds going to jobo hq.
there's a surprise.....not!.
i understand there are other properties too.
This assembly hall has an overseer's home attached to it.
I wonder where the current incumbent will be turfed out to.
so in the latest leaked video, splane goes on this crazy delusional rant about how faithful witnesses should never research their faith.. he criticizes the worldly court system and says they are not fair toward witnesses and the organization.
he says the court system is rigged and witnesses who get convicted, (implied child sex abusers) are innocent.
he is literally trying to justify child molesters and elders who cover them, as good people in "god's eyes" even though "human authorities" may judge them and put them in jail.
Splane even goes so far as to suggest that JW’s get convicted in court because the judges get bribes or payoffs.
No proof, just deceitful suggestion to further the WT agenda that JW’s are always innocent.
He obviously never thought through the consequences of his baseless rant.
im not here to start a debate.. ive heard the above expression countless time over the past year and a half and genuinely want to know what it means.. if you feel this way, do you mean :.
a. there is no covid19 virus?.
b. covid19 is real but not a threat of any kind?.
Masks are more about protecting others than yourself. It stops you splashing people 20ft in front of you with a sneeze or cough, but unless it’s the high grade masks they don’t do a great deal to protect yourself.
So the purpose of masking up is to reduce transmission rather than prevent contracting it.
I guess the good thing about the vaccines is that in the UK we’re getting 50,000 new cases each day but just a tiny fraction going to hospital. Contrasting that to last winter when no one had the vaccine and with a similar infection rate 1,000’s were going into hospital each day.
https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/03858051.
they have registered their business at companies house under business code 41100 - development of building projects.. opening their latest full accounts filing it says on page 4 under principle funding sources:.
”the society currently has two funding sources, one of them being the construction of new facilities or places of worship, which is invoiced at cost to other charities with similar aims”.
https://find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/03858051
They have registered their business at Companies House under business code 41100 - Development of building projects.
Opening their latest Full Accounts filing it says on page 4 under Principle Funding Sources:
”The Society currently has two funding sources, one of them being the construction of new facilities or places of worship, which is invoiced at cost to other charities with similar aims”
We know that this invoicing never ends so it’s hardly at cost.
I wonder what the faithful would make of their beloved religion self classifying as a building company.
i have an idea for a jw tee shirt.
jehovah's witnesses redefining words since 1914.
A JW T-shirt doesn’t have any arms.
