Posts by tornapart

54

Controversial Opinion: Why the web site campaign is actually brilliant

by Apognophos in

there's a lot of talk right now about how stupid it is to have jws hand out leaflets with urls on them.

"why go to someone's door to tell them they can visit a web site that lets them ask for someone to come to their door?

" well, i'm sorry, but i have to weigh in with a contrary opinion here on how clever the society is.

tornapart

I think you could be right Apog, whenever I have anyone come to my door, either a charity or selling something I say I don't want to talk at the door but do they have a website. This gives me the option of looking at what they are all about without feeling hounded or under obligation. If I want to go further, ie make a donation to a charity or buy something I can do it without any pressure.

I think this will point people in their direction at first, whether it'll make them want to be called on is another matter but I still think it's quite an effective ploy.

10

Why do witnesses believe it was Jehovah said they would be persecuted in his name

by goingthruthemotions in

why do witnesses believe it was jehovah that said they would be persecuted in his name......it was jesus that said we would be persecuted in his name.

i often hear are the meeting the interchanging of names between jehovah and jesus.

it seems like the sheeple drones at the meeting have no real clue about the bible or how to believe.

tornapart

They believe that the organisation is Jehovah.

100

Can anyone disprove 607 BCE date using only the NWT and WT literature?

by Bart Belteshassur in

i haven't come across any arguement that does not involve secular history and external references.

in fact the wt can not get to 607 bce without using external sources as in knowing that they need to get back from 1914 ce to 607 bce, and botching an argument using an external date as reference to create their start point at 537 bce.. i realize that to get the final date we must provide a fixed figure from somewhere which can only be a historical source, but the objective would be to disprove the wt flim flam.

once that is achieve we can use which ever fixed historical point they wish to chose.

tornapart

There is more proof secularly for 587BCE than there is for 539BCE so why didn't they use 587BCE as their starting point?

If their calculations were right then 1914 would be right. The fact that 100 years have passed and the generation is long dead proves it all wrong. Conjuring up an 'overlapping generation', smacks of desperation.

23

Off to Edinburgh With JWFacts.com cards

by cofty in

we are going to edinburgh today to see what's going at the festival, go out for a meal and probably see a show.. i have made up some cards with the jwfacts.com logo to hand to jws on the trolleys.

there is nothing on the cards part from the logo.

ttatt is only a click away..

tornapart

Sounds like you had a great day Cofty! And congrats to you and Mrs. Cofty!

44

Freaking out a Jehovah's Witness

by jgnat in

as you know, my husband has physically left the witnesses.

he nevertheless clings to many of the beliefs like a protective cloak, and every once in a while i trigger a dissonant episode where my reality clashes with his.

recently he listened in on my work research, a video of a futurist describing the a potential "disruptive change" event in the next fifteen years, as our culture shifts to autonomic (driverless) vehicles.

tornapart

I quite often say how glad I am to be living now and not a few hundred years ago. Civil wars, religious intolerance, burning of heretics, diseases from filthy living, no electricity or gas, lots of kids because of no contracptives. Fleas, ticks and cockroaches. No health care or dentists. No schools. No holidays. The list goes on.... things are definitely better now!!

17

Jehovah's Witnesses - the Fourth Branch of Judaism

by truthseeker in

jw
friends

everything about the jws points exclusively to jehovah, the god of the old testament.. jesus hardly gets a mention.

they can't ignore him completely but isn't it interesting that the only publication they produced about jesus, doesn't even have his name on it.

it's simply called "the greatest man who ever lived".

tornapart

I'm with you on this one truthseeker. I started a thread a couple of year ago from the same angle but only got one reply (that it's a cult) LOL

Anyway, a c&p of what I wrote:-

The more I'm waking up to TTATT the more I'm realising how much it is living in the OT rather than the NT. Jesus is side-lined by the GB, they say we are in his 'presence' yet they are the ones telling us what to do (rather than the head of the congregation, Christ). They behave like Pharisees yet can't see it (the blind leading the blind). All the time they are going on about the Israelites, prophecies in the OT, 'faithful men of old', the old Laws.. yet Jesus hardly gets a mention.. It's as if they want us to go back to the 'old' ways just like the Jewish Christians in Paul's day wanted. Where is the love and compassion and mercy Jesus taught?

20

how is it that some fade out of the org and others seem to be pushed?

by sowhatnow in

jw
friends

i cant figure out how some persons like my husband and son, simply got too 'busy' and gradually stopped going to meetings, and were totally left alone, and yet some persons.

seem to indicate that people were constantly in persuit of them, for a way to disfellowship them.. the ones who fade never get 'disfellowshiped' unless they write a letter formally requesting thier name be of the membership.. just like the jw org tells people who get baptised to do to thier former church,.

i havent been to a meeting in a few months however it is also under a 'remodel' im sure im not missed.

tornapart

I think it probably depends a lot on the sort of elders there are. If they are laid back types and believe in personal freedom then you could get away with just fading. If they are the legalistic company men then they are more likely to come after you. Best bet is to just let them know you don't want to talk about anything to anyone (including them) and it's more likely you'll be left alone. I've been fading for three years and the elders know where I stand and they've not said anything at all to me. On the occasions I do go to the meeting all I get is a 'how lovely to see you' and a handshake. It can work.

16

For Bible believers-Inspired Bible?

by JWdaughter in

one issue i have with declaring the bible an entirely inspired work from god is the bit in the ot about killing girls who were "proven"to not be virgins on their wedding night-by stoning them.

the absence of blood on the sheet or cloak was considered entirely valid proof that they were immoral and so they were to be stoned.. that is scientifically invalid.

not all girls bleed when they lose their virginity-in fact, the more skilled the partner, the less likely that they will bleed at all.

tornapart

I think that a lot of the laws the Israelites had were actually man-made and not God-made. Maybe they crept in over time and blended in with the laws that actually did come from God. Jesus pointed his finger at the pharisees and condemned them for their traditions of men. The bible as we know it, wasn't put together until centuries after Jesus, so how much of it can be classified as 'inspired scripture' and how much is written by men?

13

Index of my Watchtower Doctrine Threads

by cofty in

i just wanted to put links to my watchtower threads all in the same place for my own benefit and future reference.. i wrote these 4 articles almost 20 years ago just after i left the watchtower and before i had encountered any ex-jw books or websites.

they were all based on original research of old wt publications and the nwt bible.. my explanation of why they got it wrong about blood using only the nwt.... i still think this line of reasoning is devastating to the blood doctrine.

i have yet to hear a rational response.. the gospel contrasted with the watchtower doctrine of the ransom.... i wrote this when i was an uber-evangelical.