Congrats. There is nothing cowardly about what you have done.
These unscriptural dogpile sessions are not worth missing a TV show for.
I was an elder for 6 years - I've been on both sides of the table - the only reason to go is if you want to stay in or you want to make a dramatic exit (for your your own benefit).
Peace to finally.....
may you all have peace!.
i would like to know something, if you will indulge me, please - thank you!
to what extent did you, as a jw... read/know the contents of the bible?
I feel I was an honest eager student of the bible UNTIL I was appointed as a servant. Then I was too busy, I could barely keep up with studying the WT stuff, preparing talks, etc.. Then I became an elder - 5 years I never even finished studying the Flock book well.
It is understood that the Bible can only be understood thru the "Governing Body". If you have to choose between the WT and the Bible you NEED the WT. They will even state that congregations that are seperated from the "light" of the WTBS will revert to Christendoms teachings.
I still feel embarrassed of what I taught others - tho I do feel good about the emotional support I gave to many. I was known for being kind and not dogmatic, but I never was very good at obeying the "Rules".
I've studied the bible more in the last 2 years since I stepped down than I ever did before.
it's midnight.
i'm posting here.
drinking cheap bourbon and diet coke and eating an activia peach parfait......... gotta be something wrong..
It's midnight. I'm posting here. Drinking cheap Bourbon and diet coke and Eating an Activia peach parfait........
Gotta be something wrong.
a persistent meme that floats around on jw related internet forums holds that christ's second coming was moved forward 40 years (i.e.
from 1874 to 1914) in the year 1943.
(this appears to be based primarily on a statment in the book god's kingdom of a thousand years has approached on page 209 and to a lesser degree, a footnote at the bottom of page 133 of the publication jehovah's witnesses - proclaimers of god's kingdom.).
DJEEGGNOG - Are you suggesting that Russell and Rutherford did not teach that the last days and Jesus prophecies about the end of the Gentile times Pointed so clearly to 1799 AD that it was absolutely correct? That Jesus came to power in 1874?
The issue that you are NOT answering is simple - In 1914 - 1920 YOU teach that Jesus was judging and correcting Bible Students (JWs) and CHOSE them to represent him. But they TAUGHT the 1799 - 1874 for DECADES. Russell himself believed and taught that the Christianity or JWs we have today IS apostate. He rejected Christendom primarily because of their "Armageddon" He did not believe God would destroy BIllions of people. the systems of this world would go, but the People would be allowed to make real decisions with real knowledge.
tonight i'm officially no longer an unbaptized publisher after two months of no reports.
the zealous elder i have mentioned before got an earful of my thoughts and jumped on me with the guilting and about 2 hrs of studying 607 + blood.
i admitted researching and he had told me how you guys are no more than 100 resentful, lifeless, disfellowshipped people just hating on them.
JWs will always attack where your info came from and never address the info itself. It is sad to see Elders you respect, friends, peers, whom you know are too smart for this nonsense. They look at you and say with their eyes "please don't push it, don't make us DF you". I was convicted of being an apostate, but privately reproved.... the stupidist thing ever. I was looking forward to an appeal committee, but you can't appeal "private reproof".
Keep posting.
Thanks
to the household of god, israel, and those who go with... may you all have peace.
some of you may have recently observed some discussions regarding what... or rather, who... the word of god is, truly.
in those and other threads, some participants weren't able to grasp the difference between discussion vs. contention... and defending their own faith... and love of god and christ... vs. ramming their [mis]assumptions as to the "vengeance of god"... down others' throats.
Aguest - Thanks for your exhaustive responses. It is obvious you put a lot of thought and feeling into your coments.
First - I do not think the law is the revealed God. Just an idea in science. The difference between a creator who started things and let us be and a god who "reveals" himself. Just that the law would be the "revelation" of God to Israel. Just the difference between "intelligent design" and God.
Second - "Adoption" of Christ is one of the early rejected "heresies". Basically Jesus was born a normal man but adopted to be the son of god. Either in utero or not. It suggests He did not have a pre-human existance. The first Gospel written - Mark - has no mention of a pre-homen existance. It seems to be a later development in scripture. Jesus as a human was "adopted" at his baptism to be the Christ or appointed one. There are scriptures that suggest otherwise, but I don't know what to think of scriptures since they conflict and have been changed.
Thanks
you could also hold back from scrutinizing.
your beliefs out of fear that doing so would.
display a lack of faith.
Thanks truman - good reminder - I'll use that scripture again.
I was always proud of being a witness. I actually knew the bible much better than people at school or people I met in the ministry. I thought I was being taught to study the bible, however when I ACTUALLY started studying for myself I was told I was an apostate.... Now it makes me sick to think of how stupid I was.....
i have a question, primarily for trinitarians, but anyone's more than welcome to comment.
what scriptural basis is there for believing in the trinity?
i can understand some having the view that jesus/jehovah both can be worshipped, and the view that jesus should be, but where in the bible is the holy spirit worshipped?
Quiet - OK. I agree with that quote. No one has seen God. Jesus (a different and seperate personality - like any son) came to earth to provide this manifestatioon of god. His Love, Compassion, Power, will, and concern for our future.
Sounds like you understood just fine what I meant. Nothing "mysterious" no my son is not the same personality. I believe Jesus "the Son" and Yaweh "the Father = God" are equal in power and abilities. They are seperate persons with different positions. You can be the same Nature without being the same "Person". Obviously God resurrected Jesus, God exalted Jesus to his position, but his position was one to be prayed to and worshipped. I think people miss the role of the "Father" in the relationship. As a father I want my son to learn and grow and have accomplishments of his own. I think The Father feels the same way.
has anyone read this article?
i am not familiar enough with the topic to debunk it.
they basically accuse the historical record of being unreliable.. i'm surprised it was even discussed.
Debunking their reasoning is super simple. 2 lines of thought.
They accept 539 BC as the Babylonian destruction because of the secular evidence, They reject the EXACT SAME evidence in denying 587BCE.
Also do a search of 70 years in the bible. There are several different scriptures that mention the 70 years prophecy. They all say something different about the 70 years. There are 2 that indicate some "destruction" of Jerusalem the others all refer to Babylon "ruling" over these kings (609 - 539) or the destruction and rebuilding of the temple (587 - 516). It is not hard to show the bible does not insist on their "607 BCE" theories.
hey... a good friend of mine was visited by 2 elders this evening..and after being treated like something you wouldn't want on your shoe...told her that her parents can no longer have anything to do with her 9 year old boy.
he is not baptized.. her dad is an elder and mum a long standing publisher...can they really insist that the grandparents ignore the child??
they babysit for him when she's at work...she would have to leave her job, and she lives in their house too..although they live elsewhere...her dad is researching this as he is obviously curious as to whether this is scriptural.
jean-luc - did she get what she wants from you? I don't want to be redundant....
If your parents are still "in". They could write to the CO. I've seen CO's come in and tell elders "get in line". They don't want lawsuits or other problems from rogue elders.
