Posts by mdb

60

got my stopwatch.............

by BlackSwan of Memphis in

let's say you have 20 seconds (give or take) to make an impression on a jw.

to say something that will stick in their head and make them really think.

because you know, that once they realize you are an apostate, they will shut down anything else that you have to say.. what do you say?.

If you think that by your religious works and your upholding the laws set before you by an organization that claims to be from God, yet lies to those it controls, then you are condemned already. You need to quit doing religion and start living by faith. Abraham believed God and it was credited to him as righteousness so our righteousness is by faith and not by works. You say you believe God, but you do not believe God because you do not believe the testimony of His Son which is written in the Scriptures. You believe what the Watchtower tells you to believe and have been deceived into thinking you can somehow attain a salvation you cannot attain. Look to Christ, the one true God, and be saved. Even your own mistranslated bible will tell you Jesus is Lord and God, but you won't find it looking through the Watchtower's eyes. Read the Word without the WTS liturature and see what you find. You won't fall into darkness as you've been told, but will stumble into the light.

32

Which Church do I go to now?

by jwfacts in

i personally feel no particular need for institutionalised religion, but recognise it is a benefit to many people.

however i am constantly asked, "where do i go to now?

what is the best answer to give someone?

mdb

jwfacts,

I have been dieing to check out the Bahai, I personally think all religion points the same direction and Bahai is a pacifist religion that seems to recognise that. I also love the concepts of Buddha, however many exJWs are not ready to start on that journey.

Here's the Baha'i Faith in a nutshell. they are as much a "false" religion as the WTS. Why go from one to another? Not all religions lead or point to the same place. Unless you have Christ Jesus, you will die. Harsh? You might thinks so, but God's judgements are righteous and who are we to talk back to God? He is the only true God, the creator of all things, the Holy One who gives life and the only one who can destroy both body and soul. Men have such a lack of reverent fear for the Lord - always going their own way. The Baha'i Faith does not point to Christ Jesus for salvation, therefore it is a wrong path leading to destruction. Be careful of the path you choose, the concequences are eternal.

The Bahá'í Faith

In reality, there is only one religion, the religion of God. This one religion is continually evolving, and each particular religious system represents a stage in the evolution of the whole.
In the Bahá'í view, the purpose of this life on earth is for each individual to develop the spiritual and moral qualities that lie at the core of his or her nature.
Bahá'ís believe that there is only one God, the Creator of the universe. Throughout history, God has revealed Himself to humanity through a series of divine Messengers, each of Whom has founded a great religion. The Messengers have included Abraham,
Although we may have different concepts of God's nature, although we may pray to Him in different languages and call Him by different names--Allah or Yahweh, God or Brahma--nevertheless, we are speaking about the same unique Being.
Bahá'ís view life as a sort of workshop, where one can develop and perfect those qualities which will be needed in the next life.
The soul lives on after the body's death, embarking on a spiritual journey towards God through many "worlds" or planes of existence. Progress on this journey, in traditional terms, is likened to "heaven." If the soul fails to develop, one remains distant from God. This condition of remoteness from God can in some sense be understood as "hell." Thus, heaven and hell are regarded not as literal places but descriptions of one's spiritual progress toward the light of God.

The duties which God has given to us are only for our benefit: God Himself has no need of our worship or allegiance, for God is entirely self-sufficient and independent of all His creation.
The Bahá'í Faith does not teach that the physical desires of human beings are "evil" or "bad." Everything in God's creation is regarded as essentially and fundamentally good. In fact, the very purpose of the human body and its physical faculties is to serve as a proper vehicle for the development of the soul. As the energies of the body are gradually brought under the conscious control of the soul, they become instruments for the expression of spiritual qualities. It is only undisciplined physical passions that become causes of harm, and hinder spiritual progress.
Bahá'u'lláh sets before us the highest standard of morality and urges us to strive to attain it. To do so is the only path to true happiness and fulfillment.

20

Holidays: How do you refute the Exodus 32:4-10 argument

by Check_Your_Premises in

the reasoning book says that in exodus 32:4-10 that the israelites were punished for renaming an egyptian religious practice "the festival of jehovah".. they apply this to their list of arguments against christmas.

is this a very good argument?

are there any good arguments that refute it?.

mdb

AK - Jeff,

what Hebrew word was here translated "Jehovah" in the NWT? Is it elohim?

So when Aaron [aharown] saw it [ra-ah], he built [banah] an altar [mizebeha] before [lipnay] it. And Aaron [aharown] made a proclamation [qara] and said, [amar] “Tomorrow [mahar] is a feast [hag] to the Lord. [yhwh]”
Ex 32:5

The WTS is pulling at sraws here. There is nothing in the passage stating they took up any Egyptian festival. I agree with those who said they plainly turned from the Lord and corrupted themselves.

And the Lord said to Moses, “Go, get down! For your people whom you brought out of the land of Egypt have corrupted themselves. They have turned aside quickly out of the way which I commanded them. They have made themselves a molded calf, and worshiped it and sacrificed to it, and said, ‘This is your god [elohim], O Israel, that brought you out of the land of Egypt!’”
Ex 32:7,8

43

What do you believe now?

by NowImFree in

i have been out of the jws officially for over 3 years now, since disassociating.

after researching the history of the organization and reading the bible (without) the watchtower, i am now a christian.

i am just curious what happens to most ex-jws as far as their beliefs go, after they leave the organization.

mdb

JH,

I still believe that I have the possibility of having eternal life, if I obey God's laws.

If you try and earn your way into the kingdom, you're going to be very disappointed. Your salvation does not come through works... "after all that you can do" (WTS teachings). By this, many will be lost. I'm not saying you should not make your election sure (2 Pet 1:10,11), but your salvation is by grace (Rom 3:20; Gal 2:16; Eph 2:8,9; Titus 3:5).

For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast.
Eph 2:8,9

Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble; for so an entrance will be supplied to you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
2 Pet 1:10,11

43

What do you believe now?

by NowImFree in

i have been out of the jws officially for over 3 years now, since disassociating.

after researching the history of the organization and reading the bible (without) the watchtower, i am now a christian.

i am just curious what happens to most ex-jws as far as their beliefs go, after they leave the organization.

mdb

If there`s a God, punishment/reward, life after death I`ll take it as a bonus.

Hellrider,

You then go on to talk about the reward... if there is one (which there is for some), but neglect to comment on the possible punishment. Do you think that a form of punishment would be a "bonus" you'd like to find out about, regreting then that you had a chance during this life to avoid that punishment, receiving that reward you also say "might be there" as a bonus?

I seem to chase you around this board. I don't know why that is.

8

My question of the day...

by DavidChristopher in

if jehovah brings a new plan to light, a new idea...does that make him a different god, or the same god with a new plan?

if i start doing things different, does that make me a different person, or the same person with different ways of doing things.. i still have all my past experiences in my memory don't i?

so what i am saying is does becoming "wiser", or growing up, make you someone different?

mdb

Changing a plan is not at all the same as changing a doctrine or a truth, and receiving "new light", as the WTS uses the phrase to excuse their mistakes, false prophecies and other blunders, doesn't cut it.

The originally posted question sounds more like a defending statement in favour of the Watchtower. God is unchanging. He may change his mind on one thing or another, but His Word, the truth, never changes and the WTS distorts the truth and prophesies falsely.

Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits, whether they are of God; because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
1 Jn 4:1

when a prophet speaks in the name of the Lord, if the thing does not happen or come to pass, that is the thing which the Lord has not spoken; the prophet has spoken it presumptuously; you shall not be afraid of him.
Deut 18:22

The WTS is not of God.

43

What do you believe now?

by NowImFree in

i have been out of the jws officially for over 3 years now, since disassociating.

after researching the history of the organization and reading the bible (without) the watchtower, i am now a christian.

i am just curious what happens to most ex-jws as far as their beliefs go, after they leave the organization.

mdb

Good question. When Christ came to me this past summer (much to my astonishment) and embraced me, I embraced Him back, and I feel that makes me a Christian. Embraced=accepted. Sorry I'm not more articulate; I'm still trying to figure out what it means myself.

How did Jesus come to you, or reveal Himself to you this past summer? When you say that you embraced Him, what do you mean by it and how does it make you a Christian? I'm not implying you're not - I'm only asking how you see it is so. You said that you're still trying to figure out what it means to you. Do you profess Jesus as your Lord and Savior, who died for you and paid IN FULL the penalty you deserve for your sins? I bring this forward because I know that the Watchtower's doctrine is not correct regarding salvation, the person of Jesus Christ, and His resurrection (among other things). Though you have left that cult, if you still hold to those doctrines which downplay the saving grace of God and pervert the gospel message by the belittling of our Lord, then your trust is not in that Jesus of the Scriptures who saves and you are still in your sins. If Christ is not in you, neither are you His child. Have you received His Holy Spirit?

I hope that you will not take what I've said incorrectly. The Scriptures say to: search the Scriptures daily (Acts 17:11), examine yourself as to whether you are in the faith (2 Cor 13:5), test all things and hold to what is good (1 Thess 5:21), and test the spirits to whether they are of God (1 John 4:1).

5

I just joined an actual JW message board!

by jeeprube in

i did so with the intent of gathering and reposting jw comments.

comments made in a forum where they believe no apostates lurk.

here is my fist find; it's a little sad and maddening:been pretty sick, went last wed into icu and just got released today.

mdb

Yes. What is the site address? I would like to go have a chat with them.

21

Revelation 12:1

by Honesty in

who is this woman?.

rev 12:1-5 a great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and a crown of 12 stars on her head.

she was pregnant and cried out in labor and agony to give birth.

mdb

Is the woman Mary, the mother of Jesus (above: a Roman Catholic picture of Mary)?

Now a great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet, and on her head a garland of twelve stars. Then being with child, she cried out in labor and in pain to give birth. And another sign appeared in heaven: behold, a great, fiery red dragon having seven heads and ten horns, and seven diadems on his heads. His tail drew a third of the stars of heaven and threw them to the earth. And the dragon stood before the woman who was ready to give birth, to devour her Child as soon as it was born. She bore a male Child who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron [Ps 2:9; Rev 2:27; 19:15]. And her Child was caught up to God and His throne. Then the woman fled into the wilderness, where she has a place prepared by God, that they should feed her there one thousand two hundred and sixty days.
Rev 12:1-6

And the dragon was enraged with the woman, and he went to make war with the rest of her offspring, who keep the commandments of God and have the testimony of Jesus Christ [the saints].
Rev 12:17

64

The other sheep: Looking for an apologist to offer an explanation

by IP_SEC in

a verse constantly plucked from context by witnesses is john 10:16. they use it to prove that there are two classes of christian.. and i have other sheep i have other sheep, which are not of this fold: those also i must bring and they will listen to my voice, and they will become one flock, one shepherd.. the this fold say witnesses are anointed christians and the other sheep are christians with an earthly hope.. read the text carefully and in context, and i challenge anyone to be able to prove that.. in chapter 9 jesus heals a man born blind.

this infuriates the pharisees who then attack the healed man and threaten him with being expelled from the synagogue.

the man will not recant and is thrown out.. jesus finds him and asks him to be his follower.

mdb

Hellrider,

It makes sense that they are all jews, as Jesus did all his teaching in Palestine/Judah. So, the 144K (not a literal number btw) is the first ones, those that saw his works, and followed him.

Are you saying that that those who saw His works, living at the time Jesus was on earth, are the ones that make up the 144000? Those mentioned in Matt 27:55,56 would be a part of that group then, correct? They would have to be since they saw His works and ministered to Him. They followed Jesus and were saved through faith (born again).

And many women who followed Jesus from Galilee, ministering to Him, were there looking on from afar, among whom were Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James and Joses, and the mother of Zebedee’s sons.
Matt 27:55,56

What about Revelation (Rev 7:1-8)? The 144000 clearly come out of the end times. Look at the order of evens... the sixth seal opened.

Also note the following passage:

These are the ones who were not defiled with women, for they are virgins. These are the ones who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These were redeemed from among men, being firstfruits to God and to the Lamb. And in their mouth was found no deceit, for they are without fault before the throne of God.
Rev 14:4,5

As far as I can tell, all those in Matt 27:55,56 are women not men, and being that there are mothers mentioned here (two out of three), neither are they virgins. That's a big problem. Apparently the Watchtower believes that women are included in the 144000. This teaching is not Scriptural. The 144000 are Jewish virgin men redeemed from the earth at the time of the sixth seal being broken.