i was raised in as a jw, and got batpz at 16. i started pioneer at 18 and got married when i was 21. i was made an ms at 22, and was soon giving many parts.. my brother who was also a pioneer, eventually stopped, even stopped going to meetings.
he placed a doubt in my mind about 607. he simply told me to look at the kingdom come book appendix.. i looked at the material and was ablt to rationalize it in my mind as secular vs. biblical chronology (which is a gross oversimplification).
as well, i knew some things being done within the orginization didn't sit very well with me.
Ackack,
Welcome! I hope that you will find this site helpful and a place to reflect and reach out. My brother has had three serious relationships all of which the women were the abusers, although not a JW he does struggle with asking WHY did I pick these women. Its good that you are searching for answers and seeking help from the right sources. I am sure that you are now on the right path.
Peace & Love,
Sheri
i have listed all the books i found at the library that mention 586/87 as the fall of jerusalem.
i was also able to link to all of them (except the first one listed) on amazon.com!
many are out of print or unavailable as new books but you can buy almost all of them used on amazon.com ... some are only $10-12 each!
ithinkisee- Thanks so much for the list.
Add to your list a simple history book with timeline on each page that I got on sale at Borders & Books: Investigate World History, This is a Dempsey Parrr Book published in 2000, authors ANita Ganeri, Hazel Mary Martell, Brian Williams.
I just happened to have bought this on sale and when it came to my attention last year on History Channel program on God that Jerusalem fell in 586/587 BCE, I went to this book expecting to see 607BCE and found out it read 586BCE. So started my quest for truth.
Peace
Sheri
just a little bit about myself before you answer:
i was raised a jehovah's witness by my mother, who got "the truth" by studying with inlaws who were already members.
my father had been disfellewshipped for joining the army a few years before i was born, and has nevered returned to the organization.
Getting Better with more communication! My husband was not a JW but before we got together but he had in the past attended some meetings and did study bible for awhile, so he had knowledge of the teachings. He has never tried to change my beliefs and accepted it when I began to study. He has over the years gone along with my beliefs (holidays, meetings, etc.) but even though I had slowed down on meetings he was still shocked when I told him of my concerns of the teachings. I really appreciate that he has not tried to sway me one way or the other, even when the various witnesses brothers we had hired over the last 10 years usually ended up being a mistake, either tried to take our business away or just did terrible work. He did finally say he will not hire another witness, which I agreed was best. I did not ever take up issues with elders over the work problems (a couple of the brothers we hired where elders!) I just figure we will all will be accountable eventually.
Today we talk more about God than ever before and even have disucussion on various issues of our individual beliefs and questions about religion. It was as if before he knew there would be no discussion just the JW way or the highway, now we are on a two way street. I am so thankful to have come to this point in my life, it is such a freedom. However, unlike many I do not a lot of family members in the organization. My mother in law is, but she is also questioning many things and said she would stand behind me regardless of what I choose to do in formally leaving the org, since we do not live in same area it is not a big problem. I am so thankful she is open to listening to me and sharing her own concerns but her age and has a small group of sisters that are dear to her and I know she chooses at this point in her life not to make waves. I do believe that there are many elderly ones that feel this way.
Peace & Love,
Sheri
dear lurkers/trolls or whatever you consider yourselves to be,.
how can you read all of the info on this forum regarding un scandal, alleged paedophilia, failed prophecies, u-turn on blood etc.
and not have your conscience affected before jehovah.
"A Witness doesn't stay a Witness because of lack of error and conflict in the group, they stay Witnessess in spite of seeing a lot of disconfirming evidence. They are conditioned to ignore it. What they can't ignore they rationalize. What they can't rationalize, they excuse."
Boy did you hit the nail on the head. Since I reached that point when I could not ignore that everyone in my family and my worldly friends that I loved would die, if Armageddon came today. According to the Watchtower Magazines and books that I researched to confirm that the speaker could say such a horrible and arrogant thing from the stage. I know I must have read some of these articles, yet amazingly I had just rationalized it away that Jehovah would read the hearts of all at that time. Yet it was so clearly stating the opposite in the articles. I guess then I just ignored it.
So I am on a journey of discovery and this site has been helpful in gathering information as I began to question other information (607BCE, 1914, etc), reading the variety of thoughts and just accepting everyone has the right to where they are right now. Coming out of the "conditioned" state of mind for over 25 years this is a real trip and I am ready for the journey!
Peace & Love,
Sheri
i am no longer a witness.
i've told all my worldly friends and my immediate family - my kids have told their friends.
i haven't been to a meeting in over a year (and have no desire to go to one) - but i'm not dad or dfd.
All of you have such great comments and for myself it is a process of exploration and just being. I too was asked "Where will you go?" to which I said "Who said I had to go anywhere". I have been reading some of Neale Donald Walsch books, especially "What Does God Want" and "New Revelations", which for me has been the acknowledgment of what questions I always had in the back of my mind but was afraid to ask. Organized religion is not for me but a working relationship with my inner spirit and being in peace and love if what I am striving to create in the world around me. We really are all ONE.
I am thankful to have found this sight and it has been great source of information and research in trying to get answers to the Org. teachings that I knew where not from God. I am still in the process of being accepted but not officially reject yet, to which I am going to let it just play out in due time.
Peace to you All,
Sheri
ok, since all the evidence and people/scholars etc, all agree that jerusalem was destroyed in 587/586 bce and not 607 bce.
how do the jw's get the extra 20 years, i understand the 2520 years and going back from 1914. but alot of the proof goes by adding up the kings reigns, and it gets you to the 587/586 date, do jw's simply add on a few years for each king, or is their a mystery king that ruled for 20 years that only they know about.. hhhhhhmmmmmmm.
hope my question makes sense.
Whoa, peace brother, such big font you have. Give him a break, just might have been typoooooo.
Peace
Sheri
ok, since all the evidence and people/scholars etc, all agree that jerusalem was destroyed in 587/586 bce and not 607 bce.
how do the jw's get the extra 20 years, i understand the 2520 years and going back from 1914. but alot of the proof goes by adding up the kings reigns, and it gets you to the 587/586 date, do jw's simply add on a few years for each king, or is their a mystery king that ruled for 20 years that only they know about.. hhhhhhmmmmmmm.
hope my question makes sense.
Run Dont Walk: according to my phone call to WTS "its only 20 yrs" this is not important to them, the 607BCE date is taking 537BCE the Cyrus decree that exiles could return to rebuild the walls PLUS 70 years of exile/desolation (a time period with many different thoughts of what consitutes the 70 years) add the 70 to 537and guess what you have 607 BCE.
Now when mentioning doing the math (thanks to KISS) from the mutally agreed pivitol date of 539 BCE taking the Babylonian Kings list from their publications and secular history and getting to 587BCE I was told that was because I was doing "traditional math", duh, hello!!!! No I must use the Bible only as to have the correct dates (bible does not give years) but that does not matter. But remember the Society has completely rewritten history backwards from their 607BCE date so all dates in the Watchtower, Awake, Books, Brochures, etc. are using dates that do not match anyone secular history but you will not find any disclaimers to this, thus the vast majority of JW's do not have a clue that these are not dates that the REST of the WORLD HISTORY accepts.
The Society will not give up 1914 because they loose 1919 as the appointed sole channel of God, therefore will continually uphold 607BCE.
Walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, but it's a DOG, per WTS.
As my mother would say "you lie down with dogs and you get fleas".
Peace
Sheri
.
i was just wondering where the wts gets the idea of the 'other sheep' who survive the 'great tribulation' becoming cleansed.. i know revelations speaks specifically of the 144,000 "washing themsleves in the blood of the lamb", thereby becomming cleansed, or perfect.. the wts teaches that the 'other sheep' become cleansed gradually over the 1,000 year reign, but wouldn't they themselves need to be washed clean (obviously symbolic) in jesus' blood somehow?.
kwin
CO at assembly made a "joke" about being in service and making his Dibs on the big fancy house.
Made me uncomfortable to hear that, but I just let it slide, figured it was his own spiritual problem. I was at that time not seeing the light as I do now.
Just got back from vacation where I got in touch with a couple sisters and found these long time JW's in the truth are also questioning the ever changing "sole channel" and just doing the fade.
Peace,
Sheri
http://starbulletin.com/2005/06/03/news/index4.htmlman pulls on exit.
handle in flightthe pilot says passengers.
were not in any dangerby leila fujimori.
That's a comforting thought! I am leaving on Hawaiian Air on Monday. Will keep my eye on the older passengers and that door.
Sheri
hey has anyone seen this website that has a recording of a jw researcher from watchtower headquarters that calls this baptist pastor?
the baptist pastor records the conversation.
it's really good.
This radio online was very interesting and disgusting at the same time; everyone has their opinion or just trying to figure what the bible is really saying. There will never be no total agreement between all people, I am beginning to believe all the more so in live and let live, its really between me and my God, in whatever form I find peace with him.
Just finished reading "What God Wants" by Neale Donald Walsch, which I found very thought provoking. Has anyone read this book or any of his other books? His website nealedonaldwalsch.com has some wonderful video under wisdomflashes.
Peace,
Sheri
