darkspilver

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Posts by darkspilver

• 
  51

  Announcement from SPAIN: On Monday, the 26th online in the a.m. in the online edition of www.elperiodico.es...

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  announcement from spain:.

  on monday 26th septriembre, www.elperiodico.es published in its online edition the first publicly reported case of child abuse and harassment in spain watchtower, digital edition monday, tuesday print edition.

  please maximum dissemination of the link, it will be online early in the morning of monday 26, in the online edition.

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  darkspilver

  Hi Hecce
  

  The press will present facts on the manner that they think will sell more papers, they are not going to publish a transcript word by word of their conversations with Mr. Garcia.

  Yeah I know - that's why I was trying to work out what it was all about in some kind of timeline order.
  

  I also don't expect a transcript from the newspaper - what I meant was that I would have liked an English translated transcript of the VIDEO interview that Miguel Garcia gave that appears on the newspaper website - this might helpfully fill in some of the missing details etc.
  
• 
  51

  Announcement from SPAIN: On Monday, the 26th online in the a.m. in the online edition of www.elperiodico.es...

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  announcement from spain:.

  on monday 26th septriembre, www.elperiodico.es published in its online edition the first publicly reported case of child abuse and harassment in spain watchtower, digital edition monday, tuesday print edition.

  please maximum dissemination of the link, it will be online early in the morning of monday 26, in the online edition.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  darkspilver

  So, yes, there is a story, but there is a confusing timeline and a mix of incidents in the newspaper articles.

  • In 1990, while attending a Spanish-speaking congregation in Brussels, Belgium, Miguel Garcia - then aged 16 - alleges that he was sexually abused/attacked by a man 'A' (a brother in good standing in the congregation) ie it was NOT consensual and Miguel Garcia was an 'unwilling participant'.

  • Three years later in 1993, and now in Spain, Miguel Garcia - then aged 19 - approached the elders in his congregation regarding his allegation of sexual abuse/attack that took place in Belgium three years earlier and it seems that a Judicial Committee (three elders) was set up for the man 'A' (???) for which Miguel Garcia cooperated and gave details - apparently others had made similar allegations regarding the same man 'A'.

  • What was the outcome of that judicial hearing? If summary details where placed in a sealed envelope does that mean the man 'A' was reproved / disfellowshipped?

  • Miguel Garcia complains now (in the Sept 2016 article) that he was 'asked not to file charges in order to not disgrace the congregation.'

  • Following the 1990 to 1993 events, Miguel Garcia remained a JW in good standing.

  • After some years, and still as a JW, Miguel Garcia married his wife (a sister in the JW congregation) who continues to be a JW down to this day.

  • Around five years ago? They separated (not divorced, and not scriptural) and Miguel Garcia stopped attending meetings (faded - not DF or DA)

  • Around this time Miguel Garcia suffered from panic attack/s requiring attendance at hospital (when was this? how soon after he stopping associating with JWs?)

  • Miguel Garcia complains that because his JW friends where concerned for his safety/health they visited him in hospital which he did not want (confusing – it is likely that some people would complain if NO one at least turned up - natural human empathy etc)

  • In time, and over a number of years, due to inactivity in the JW congregation, Miguel Garcia was effectively no longer viewed as a JW.

  • Four years later Miguel Garcia and his wife legally divorced (when?? 2014? 2015?)

  • IMPORTANT - although not needed for the legal divorce, Miguel Garcia was happy (at the same time, when?) to effectively confess to adultery in order for his wife to have a scriptural divorce and to allow her to remarry (as per her continuing JW beliefs).

  • In April 2014 Miguel Garcia wrote to the congregation he was last associated with and requested the removal of all his records and data etc from JW files (wouldn't this effectively be a technical 'disassociation' - and shouldn't/couldn’t the congregation have pursued this as a DA at the time? – tricky thing is I don't think the elders can ask if you want to DA.

  • The JWs told him he was still viewed as a 'baptised member', and not ALL records could therefore be destroyed.

  • IMPORTANT - it seems that Miguel Garcia was asking for the destruction (scrubbing out of the record?) of the very basic summary details of his allegations of earlier sexual abuse/attack? Yet there was huge outcry here when it was (mistakeningly) thought that the JWs were destroying these summary records anyway? Do you support the destruction of these (summary) sexual abuse/attack records?

  • Miguel Garcia is complaining now (in the Sept 2016 article) that some information on him was apparently not destroyed – again, it seems he wanted to remove (withdraw?) from the record his allegations of sexual abuse/attack.

  • Although no longer associating, or viewed by the congregation or the public in general, as being a JW, for around five years now - the congregation elders now wish to pursue a judicial committee.

  • QUESTION: Wouldn't Miguel Garcia's earlier 'confession' have been enough to trigger the Judicial? - no need for a preliminary meeting to confirm need for Judicial? Also, could that confession - which would have needed to be signed or at least verbally stated in front of two witnesses - have been enough anyway to DF Miguel Garcia even ‘in absentia’ – that is IF the JW elders had really wanted too at that time? Indeed, could Miguel Garcia's evident (non) action regarding JW scriptural things be sufficient to indicate a lack of repentance from a JW view point?

  • Miguel Garcia is complaining (in the Sept 2016 article) that the JW congregation are only now pursing the Judicial Committee due to them believing he has committed (homosexual) adultery rather than (heterosexual) adultery - ie: he is complaining that if the JW elders believed he had committed (heterosexual) adultery, they would NOT being pursing the Judicial Committee with him.

  • Sidenote - I believe the letter inviting him to the Judicial is in order (if they had not been able to contact Miguel Garcia in person or verbally), but it is a 'last resort' method, though it should NOT have listed the reason why, that should have been given to him verbally. Miguel Garcia isn't denying the allegation of adultery (as per above comments - allowing wife a scriptural divorce), and it's likely that members in his wife's congregation know too if she continued in good standing throughout and is now free to date/remarry, and Miguel Garcia has himself chosen to go public with the letter.

  • Sidenote 2 - Must say, I'm kinda disappointed that, after the build-up of this article in this English language forum, we seem to have only been provided with an automated 'google translation' of the articles and not a 'human' one - also disappointed that there seems to be no translated transcripts of the two videos either yet - c'est la vie

  Does anybody have any corrections and/or clarifications on the above? Please?
  
• 
  51

  Announcement from SPAIN: On Monday, the 26th online in the a.m. in the online edition of www.elperiodico.es...

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  announcement from spain:.

  on monday 26th septriembre, www.elperiodico.es published in its online edition the first publicly reported case of child abuse and harassment in spain watchtower, digital edition monday, tuesday print edition.

  please maximum dissemination of the link, it will be online early in the morning of monday 26, in the online edition.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  darkspilver

  On Monday 26th septriembre, www.elperiodico.es published in its online edition the first publicly reported case of child abuse and harassment in Spain Watchtower, digital edition Monday, Tuesday print edition.

  I'm afraid that, as nobody else has said it yet, I'm gonnna have to say it:

  After anticipation was built up for this story over the weekend with the above message, which was further heightened on the day by the 12 hour delay of it's online publication (as we searched the promised website throughout the day)...

  And although we all have the deepest respect and empathy for the participants in this deeply personal newspaper article...

  I think, if you are honest, the elephant in the room is that it's kinda not the article we were expecting.

  That's not to say, there isn't a story here, and it's good that it's being discussed here, just that it's a rather 'interesting' example of 'news management'.

  And, besides, maybe more is being released today??
• 
  51

  Announcement from SPAIN: On Monday, the 26th online in the a.m. in the online edition of www.elperiodico.es...

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  announcement from spain:.

  on monday 26th septriembre, www.elperiodico.es published in its online edition the first publicly reported case of child abuse and harassment in spain watchtower, digital edition monday, tuesday print edition.

  please maximum dissemination of the link, it will be online early in the morning of monday 26, in the online edition.

  1. 
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  darkspilver

  From today's (27 September 2016) print edition of the Spanish language El Periódico - both the front page and the double page spread on pages 28 and 29
  

  This Spanish newspaper prints two editions - in Spanish and Catalan - seemingly with the exact same articles and layouts etc - according to Wikipedia it has a combined print circulation of both languages of around 125,000 making it the fifth biggest print circulation in Spain which has a population of around 46 million.

  (actually, that print circulation figure seems rather low for the 5th largest circulation?)

  The print edition includes a copy of the letter which you can read here:

  https://www.dropbox.com/s/hmmgnkd2xy6ny18/Escrito%20BN.pdf?dl=0

  
  
• 
  51

  Announcement from SPAIN: On Monday, the 26th online in the a.m. in the online edition of www.elperiodico.es...

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  announcement from spain:.

  on monday 26th septriembre, www.elperiodico.es published in its online edition the first publicly reported case of child abuse and harassment in spain watchtower, digital edition monday, tuesday print edition.

  please maximum dissemination of the link, it will be online early in the morning of monday 26, in the online edition.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  darkspilver

  http://www.elperiodico.com/es/noticias/sociedad/abusos-sexuales-encubiertos-los-testigos-jehova-5417032

  Abusos sexuales encubiertos

  El denunciante relata ante los Mossos que los Testigos de Jehová le conminaron a silenciar las agresiones que sufrió cuando era menor

  
  
• 
  46

  Call for Judicial Hearing by signed letter

  by sp74bb in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i'm quite surprised about the new approach of some local congregation brothers respect about my fade.... funny, ilegal and very dangerous in view of the different laws regarding personal data and minorities in spain and in the eu.... i already organized a press meeting with main newspapers in spain.

  many has shown interest in this situation.

  the fact of that a parallel judicial system do exist is amazing them.

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  darkspilver

  FYI the thread / post below appears to be related to this letter....
  

  https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/5088277520449536/announcement-from-spain-on-monday-26th-online-m-online-edition-elperiodico-es?page=1#/5728181745090560
• 
  51

  Announcement from SPAIN: On Monday, the 26th online in the a.m. in the online edition of www.elperiodico.es...

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  announcement from spain:.

  on monday 26th septriembre, www.elperiodico.es published in its online edition the first publicly reported case of child abuse and harassment in spain watchtower, digital edition monday, tuesday print edition.

  please maximum dissemination of the link, it will be online early in the morning of monday 26, in the online edition.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  darkspilver

  This has just been upload this evening (9.07pm Spanish time) - but this doesn't look like the article that Andresoninfo was saying it would be?? Confused
  

  It does seem to related to this thread though....
  

  https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/5186279211794432/call-judicial-hearing-signed-letter

  "Los Testigos de Jehová me quieren juzgar por adulterio"

  Un exmiembro denuncia a la organización religiosa por acoso y por citarle a un juicio interno

  Miguel García sospecha que la confesión le persigue en el fondo porque tiene una relación homosexual

  http://www.elperiodico.com/es/noticias/sociedad/los-testigos-jehova-quieren-juzgar-por-adulterio-5416455
  

  
  
• 
  51

  Announcement from SPAIN: On Monday, the 26th online in the a.m. in the online edition of www.elperiodico.es...

  by AndersonsInfo in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  announcement from spain:.

  on monday 26th septriembre, www.elperiodico.es published in its online edition the first publicly reported case of child abuse and harassment in spain watchtower, digital edition monday, tuesday print edition.

  please maximum dissemination of the link, it will be online early in the morning of monday 26, in the online edition.

  1. 
  2. 
  3. 
• 

  darkspilver

  Hi AndersonsInfo

  it will be online early in the morning of Monday 26, in the online edition.
  

  ?

  anyone found it on their website yet?

  it's now 2.30pm in the afternoon in Spain....
  

  where did this 'announcement' about the article come from?

  the elections would have been known about, so would have been slotted into the news cycle?

  or may be they are burying the article under the elections??
  
• 
  18

  Tell me if I'm right or wrong

  by Chook in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  jws say they can go anywhere in the world and they " know" that they would be shown hospitality from their fellow brothers.

  of all my years as a jw i found this wasn't the case.

  i honestly believe that if i turned up at any of my fellow apostates on here house and said hi i'm chook can we have a coffee, the response would be how many sugars..

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  darkspilver

  Ask dubstepped

  https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/5203164875718656/how-successful-others-getting-ex-dubs-together

  jus'sayin'
  
• 
  17

  Puerto Rico Special Convention 2016 Video

  by darkspilver in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  never a jw.

  https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/6289070416199680/dressed-up-five-days-ahead-special-assembly-puerto-rico.

  an hour ago i went to bid good bye my two brothers in law and their wives (all elders/elderettes).

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  darkspilver

  never a jw

  https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/6289070416199680/dressed-up-five-days-ahead-special-assembly-puerto-rico

  An hour ago I went to bid good bye my two brothers in law and their wives (all elders/elderettes). They were invited to the special assembly in Puerto Rico this coming weekend.

  Here's a video - don't believe it's been posted here yet - it's 80 minutes long and focuses on the entertainment and hospitality

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hh_qNphhhIY