Making 607 crumble

by ellderwho 125 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  ellderwho

  During my eight month long study with "elder Bob" (moms husband) we have batted around many subjects to say the least. But the one that really stands out is the dreaded date of 607 BC. Im sorry I just will not let up with this date, and him having to prove it can stand. Well, last night study made the eight months worth it. On the table was a book that he orderd from the "evil slave internet" class. Its called 'Texts from the Cuniform Tablets' by AK Grayson 1975 JJ Augustine Pub NY.

  While he was trying to make a point from this book about being called King while being vassel at that time, it wound up a mute point due to the damning evidence the book presents about WT chronology. (Years of rule)

  The fact that he went to outside measures to sure-up the 607 issue is a blesssing in itself. Or at least the begining of a blessing. Is their any information about AK Grayson that would be helpful in this situation.

  Alleymom Im looking in your direction
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  Black Sheep

  I'm trying to track down the book. Without success.

  Are you sure about the name? Any hints where I might find a copy?
• 

  Satanus

  ellder

  That sounds like seriously deep stuff. Amazon has a book, not sure if it's the same. It goes for 80 bucks. Likely the elder is going to bury himself - right out of the wt.

  http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1575060493/qid=1073374069/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/103-0499436-0483015?v=glance&s=books

  SS
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  scholar

  elderwho

  You must have rocks in your head when you speak about that dreaded date of 607. There is abundant secular and biblical evidence in support of 607 as a calcuable and credible date for the Fall of Jerusalem. Your only other alternative are the indecisive dates of 586 or 587. Perhaps you should toss a coin and see which comes up first. Rolf Furuli has sourced the work of Grayson but the tiitle differs to the one you posted and is shown as Assyriian and Babylonian Chronicles, A. K. Grayson, 1975, Augustin Publishers, New York in Persian Chronology And The Length Of The Babylonian Exile Of The Jews, Rolf Furuli, Volume One, 2003. I suggest that you read this book before making silly comments about the biblical eastablished date of 607 BCE.

  scholar

  BA BAHons MA Studies in Religion
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  City Fan

  Scholar

  How many times do you have to have your arse kicked in these kind of threads before you give it up?

  There is abundant secular and biblical evidence in support of 607 as a calcuable and credible date for the Fall of Jerusalem.

  Once again, for the record, name ONE piece of secular evidence to support 607. And the 586/587 argument you keep bringing up has been explained to you time and time again. A real scholar would never bring this up as an argument.

  CF.
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  jayhawk1

  Who cares, the fall of Jerusalem happened between 2611 and 2591 years ago. Even if the fall of Jerusalem was 607, the year 1914 turned out to be just another year that had a big war start in.
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  ellderwho

  Saint,

  thanks for the link, moms husband did state this book cost alot.

  Scholar, you'll have to excuse my silly behavior, I may not be a well advertised "scholar" a yourself, but my basic math skills such as addition are rock solid.

  Does Rolf Furuli when referencing AK Graysons work use the dates of Babylonian rule given by said book?

  Because the dates given in the book were glaring out at my study while he quoted the book to me.

  Jay,

  607 is as important as the Book of Mormon, take it away and these beliefs fall.
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  justhuman

  You will set the Elder in to trouble!!! 607 date it is wrong and when he finds that, then WT has no foundations to stand..everything it is related on that date according to their doctrine...

  Scholar

  You have NO foundation regarding 607. The only ones that support that date are JW's . Look at Encyclopedias like Britanica, or Archeological books and the date they point out for the destruction of Jerusalim is 587.

  Even it is against the Bible Chronology, and the WT in order to support their foundation they go against the Bible...

  Just only one example: Zechariah 1:12 an angel says: Oh Jehovah of armies, how long will you yourself not show mercy to Jerusalim and to the cities of Judah, whom you have denounced these seventy years?

  Also Zechariah 7:3 Shall I weep in the fifth month practicing an abstinence, the way I have done these 70 years...

  WT admits that that was the year 517 the second year of Darius the King.

  So if we add the 70 years of weeping of the Isralites we come to the year 587 that Jerusalim was destroyed.

  Also the 70 years are for Babylon not for Jerusalim...Daniel 5: 25-27 says:Mene mene thekel parsin...God has numbered your days of your kingdomn and they are over...The days of the Babylonian started at 607 when they win Assyria and ended at 587 when they were occupied by persian king Kyros...

  Also Jerusalim had 3 deportations with King Nabu...and after the destruction still people were living at the ruins of Jerusalim...

  Jeremiah 29:4-10 Says that the should stay at Babylon(Jeramiah send a letter to the Jews in exile in Babylon 10 years before the final destruction)and he told them to stay there have kids, build houses,...in accord with the fulfilling of 70 years at(for)Babylon I shall turn my attention to you people and bring you back to this place..

  So this words of God they would have a meaning if the 70 years start to be counted from the first deportation of Jews in Babylon, other wise there was no need to send this letter if the 70 years start 10 years after...

  So Scholar next time back your proves with real solid evidence...
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  scholar

  justhuman

  The matters you raise are well addressed in Furuli's book which decondtructs current secular chronology and shows that the seventy years are not for captivity to Babylon but are years of desolation for Judah. By the way have you read this book or are you too timid to seek an alternative viewpoint. Also, there in fact were only two deporattions, not three as you allege. 607 is based upon the fall of Babylon in 539 which leads to the release of the captives under Cyrus in 537 which brought their seventy years exile to a finish which inturn means that the captivity behan in 607. It does not get any easier than that as it follow the KISS principle.

  scholar
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  heathen

  Let's see here , what I've gathered from several threads on this topic is that the WTBTS claims the seven times in Daniel 4 are actually seven times 360 which gives them a time frame that leads them to believe that it is talking about 1914 as the end of the supposed appointed times of the nations . I actually took their word on this for quite some time but it seems ever so clear these days that Daniel 4 is not talking about the appointed times but only informing nebuchadnezzar that he will be removed from the throne for 7 years . It doesn't mention the term appointed times of the nations and as I remember the hebrews would add a month on their calander to account for the 360 day year every seven years . I don't have a problem with the belief that jesus was the chosen ruler of the world but he claimed rulership in 33 CE not in 1914.