Universal sovereignty on trial

by Factfulness 169 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Factfulness

    I just had a thought of clarity regarding the JW explanation for this doctrine. They explain that Satan challenged God regarding his right to rule. God has been allowing mankind to rule themselves for some time to prove that his rulership is needed and that Satan is wrong.

    However, the OT and the Israelite nation are a record of failed divine rulership. They were guided by God, constantly erred, and he eventually abandoned them. God failed to prove his right to rule. Some may argue that they were an imperfect people and thus they failed God. From that perspective, mankind (and Satan) have not had opportunity to prove their ability to rule themselves in perfection. It isn’t a fair test.

    This is still a burgeoning thought that just occurred moments ago, so please help me to clarify and test this argument. How might a JW or theist respond? Do you see any flaws or needed refinements? Can it be expanded?

  • Brokeback Watchtower
    Brokeback Watchtower

    The whole universal sovereignty thing is a fairy tale made up by the WT corporation there never was any challenge. Eating a forbidden fruit is the story in genesis with no hint of God's sovereignty on trial.

  • Crazyguy

    I don’t think it was just made up by WT. This is what many other Christian religions have had to teach otherwise god looks like a big dick just doing nothing all the while people suffer.

  • Dagney

    If you search "universal sovereignty" here on JWN, you will find excellent discussions on the subject.

    As BW said, there is no scriptural issue. It is only yet another tool the WT came up with to keep their worshippers thinking that their individual loyalty to the WT Corporation is somehow linked to some gameboard in the sky. If the JW has faith in that concept, there is no arguing with faith, since it is built on nothing but a belief.

    What I have said to former friends in the past is I didn't understand why God had to prove anything to anybody, especially to a fallen angel or to a lowly human, and left it at that hoping that it will strike a cord with an inquiring mind.

  • zeb

    During a long past convention an elder having his moment in the sun bellowed on about 'universal sovereignty' as the greatest issue of the age. ...hmm at that time home loan interest rates and that includes existing loans went up to 18%. Sitting as a young parent, the wt's rant was the last thing i was worried about.

    Many people lost their homes in that time. (and the banks made a killing btw)

  • waton

    imperfect men? failed to succed even on he perfect ones.

    fair contest? ?why then intervene by killing them, confusing their language? It is not supposed to be about who is the strongest, but it turns out to be about who is the biggest cheat, hobbling the other contestants. Bad screen writers that's all.

  • Brokeback Watchtower
    Brokeback Watchtower

    The Watchtower Corporation's CEOs/Governing Body are benefiting from a purely imaginary Sovereignty Trial, loyalty to the universal sovereignty is all tied up in mind control over members.

  • Perry

    Universal Sovereignty

    Vindication of God's Holy Name

    Who has the Right to Rule

    The Bible is a book of Government

    Blah, blah bla

    The above notions sound religious, even biblically religious. The only problem is that they are not historical Christian themes.

    Christianity is about getting rid of your sin debt through the blood of Christ. God hasn't been allowing men to rule themselves because he is trying to run for office. Man is alienated from a just and holy God because they sin, a lot. They are his enemies. And, while we were God's enemies, and before we did ANYTHING for God.. Christ (God Himself) died for us (personally) not Adam.

    Romans 5 - But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.

    9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

    10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

    11 And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

    This is the Great Watchtower deception. They keep people all knotted up chasing imaginary global rulership issues and ignoring (even rejecting) the offer of a total free ride into eternal bliss and personal adoption by the Almighty.

    Once a person is adopted, legal heirs have title right to everything the Father has, for free.... the very thing JW's insist on working for.

    Jesus said, "Come to me (not Jehovah), and I will give you rest".

    The irony is overwhelming at times.

  • Wasanelder Once
    Wasanelder Once

    A lawyer became president of the WT and blammo! Universal sovereignty was born. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to see the connection, duh.

  • nicolaou

    Scenario 1. A child is about to pull a pan of scalding hot oil over itself. Mum reacts instantly, pulling the child to safety and takes steps to prevent future catastrophe.

    Scenario 2. A child is about to pull a pan of scalding hot oil over itself. Dad allows the horrific scene to play out so that the child will come to understand how much she needs her father's protection.

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