Who's To Blame For The Child Abuse Problem?

by Englishman 68 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse

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  Guest 77

  Your question, who's to blame hasn't been answered. How does one identify a pedophile? If you can't identify a pedophile, unless you have a known history case of such an individual, you can't.

  Let me illustrate. Englishman, you come off as being surprised and naive to learn about pedophiles and how they operate. Well, your innocence and being naive are good examples. In other words they operate with great subtley. YOU could be one! That my friend is how scary it is. Pedophiles are right underneath our noses! I repeat, this is only an example.

  Who's to blame? Sick and demented minds. It's been studied that these people are beyond help.

  Guest 77
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  obiwan

  It's the individuals who commit these crimes, that are to blame. The wt is to be blamed for not standing up and protecting the "flock". The wt should be punished for a world wide coverup. I see this as no different than a co-dependent enabling a alcoholic, the wt allows the individual to keep up his hideous acts and enables it by keeping thier mouth shut.
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  Big Tex

  But I don't think it's been proven that sex abuse automatically begets sex abuse.

  If it has been proven, then I'm in big trouble.

  If I were an alcoholic, I would be far more inclined to "join" a bar where the liquor is free and/or there is easy access to as much as I want than a bar where the alcohol was monitored (e.g., 2 drink limit).

  Personally I believe that offenders do not join Jehovah's Witnesses simply to attack children. However, research does show that there have been markedly more pedophiles (who later were caught) who work around children, such as Little League baseball coach, day care worker, Boy Scout volunteer, etc. Which only makes sense, in that if you are attracted to the idea of sex with children then it follows you will seek out avenues where you have access to children with little or no monitoring.

  Jehovah's Witnesses, as currently structured, certainly fit that bill. In my wife's old congregation, an offender was caught, convicted and sent to prison for molesting a little 4 year old girl in the congregation. When he was released a year later, a "special needs" talk on forgiveness was given and all in the congregation were encouraged to welcome this thing back as if nothing had happened. A few weeks later, someone got together a roller skating party for the kids in the hall. This convicted child molestor was there with all the children. MY children were at this event. Why was he there? He had no children of his own, and yet everyone seemed quite comfortable with this monster playing and skating with their children.

  This thread is almost a chicken or the egg question, as I don't know what starts it off. Is the offender there first, or does the open door policy create the atmosphere? Maybe it's a little of both. But I don't think there is any question that Jehovah's Witnesses, by their actions, actually create conditions where pedophilia is more likely to grow. It is passive encouragement.

  "What you do speaks so loud, I can't hear what you're saying -- Ralph Waldo Emerson
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  Amazing

  Hi Odrade,

  I just went back and read Englishmans' post regarding JW pedophiles and the things he questions. The account you related is exactly on target. This is why I believe that those who lean toward radical comments are given to danger themselves, because they fail to see the problem as it really is.

  Thanks again for stating so eloquently what I have been trying to say for a long time ... its not the legal two-witness rule, or the beliefs of the pedophile ... but rather the way the religion covers over and does not take proper public action.

  Thanks again for making the piount so well. - Jim W.
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  waiting

  And remember this, friends, virtually EVERY ABUSER WAS ABUSED AS A CHILD THEMSELVES. It's where they learned it was normal behavior. They're just passing it on. -francois

  Please note, Francois stated that "EVERY abuser was abused...." - and I asked him for proof.

  Francois never stated that "All abused children became abusers."

  Big difference.

  waiting
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  Amazing

  Waiting: You highlight a very important distinction. Going one step further, just as not every abused child becomes and abuser, not every abuser was abused as a child ... science has coorelated a connection, but it is not fool proof.

  There are also different types of pedophiles. Most are preferrential, and are of the type that Core and Odrade speak of. Some are violent predators. My own father was a mean, untrustworthy son-of-a-bitch. Some pedophiles are the more rare type - situaltional, and may only molest one child, usually an older child.

  Odrade and Core described the average JW pedophile in the most accurate terms ... and I agree with Core that the ratios are liklely about the same as in other religions ... the problem among JWs is that the pedophile is allowed to continue by virue of the organization covering over the crime in a false sense of kindness as well as an overt concern for its reputation as a religion. - Jim W.
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  waiting

  Dear Amazing,

  When I agree with you - I tend to fully agree. Thank you.

  There are also different types of pedophiles. Most are preferrential, and are of the type that Core and Odrade speak of. Some are violent predators. My own father was a mean, untrustworthy son-of-a-bitch. Some pedophiles are the more rare type - situaltional, and may only molest one child, usually an older child. - amazing

  This is what got me going yesterday.......the seeming lack of qualifying statements. I understand Core & Odrade's type of molester -preferrential - they're as common as flys, sad to say.

  Violent predators, thankfully, are rare. Seems your father and my father had similarities. My father was also violent with beatings & knives, particularily with animals.

  Situational molesters - well, they're common too, and I still would think that's the type that social workers tend to try and work with to keep the family united if possible.

  Thanks again, Amazing.

  waiting
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  core

  who's to blame for the CHild Abuse Problem?

  Addressing the specific question of blame requires us to ascertain which problem or element of the problem

  The existence of child abusers ? Not one that even I can lay at the WT doors.

  The fact that everything being equal JWS must have some child abuser members ? Again not in itself a WT FAULT

  Or the way in which the WT supports/fails to support the victim ? Now on this one I can lay some blame at the WT doors - not because of the 2 witness rule but the general desire to cover over failings as they may reflect on "God's Organisation" as if hiding the error removes it. Affording secrecy to offenders cannot but add to the problem - also, forcing young children to 'confront' abusers - will that help the problem ?

  Looking at this personally I think that all elders are responsible (as was I when actually an elder) for not reporting all abuse, within the family or wherever - to the proper authorities (social services) to have children protected regardless of the "negative" publicity. Actually if the WT did this they would have less "negative" publicity as child protectioin laws would prevent any publicity initially and the blizzard of current bad publicity would not be happening (in many cases) if the childrens protection had had first place in everyones mind years ago. (Most of the current publicity relates to cases in which abused people have now attained adulthood and chosen to forgo confidentiality to pursue claims etc)

  Additionally I regularly read on this site distressing stories of how youngsters received no help or little in the way of encouragement when they bravely made known abuse. Such neglect of little ones is itself a real problem for which the WT stands condemend - but not only as an "organisation" - it takes people to make an organisation and generally those people have turned away from the little one, either from embarrasment or other reasons. As one sister said to me years ago about a reported (in the press - not gossip in the cong) case of child abuse by a "brother" ..."Oh no it must not be true...not in the organisation" ..such blind incredulity creates the perfect environment for a paedophile.
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  amac

  I haven't had time to read all these responses but it seems that prettygrudger hit the nail according to my personal opinion.

  I think the claim that pedos might join the JWs so they can practice pedophilia is a step far. I could see it happening due to the fact that there are children in the religion, but that would be the same with any religion. The idea that they would be attracted to it because it is a "pedophile paradise", as the infamous Bill Bowen calls it, is a stretch as most people don't fully understand the judicial process and it's ins and outs until well after baptism. I see nothing to suppport that idea.
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  Simon

  Well, my own (arbeit limited experience) is:

  We have been in 2 congregations. Both have at least one occurence of child abuse and very likely more than one (can't give details yet).

  Would the people involved have abused kids if they were not JWs? Who knows ... possible, probably.

  In both it has been covered up though and for this the WTS is guilty - for creating an atmosphere where "appearance" comes before the well-being of the innocents who have been entrusted with their care.