Racial Insensitivity

by Coded Logic 127 Replies latest social current

Coded Logic

Keep repeating your incorrect stats as though they are true and ignore the study that takes all the factors into account that you claim to, but don't.
- Simon
You sound like Donald Trump. You just keep repeating the same nonsense over and over and over hoping it will stick. I've provided the statistics to you showing that unarmed black people are six times more likely to be shot. I provided the names of the individuals and the date they were shot. You then accused me saying I had "no evidence". I then provided you with the comprehensive database of news reports and public records that's been compiled.
Simply saying "the stats are incorrect" is not an argument. It's a Trumpism

Furthermore, I addressed your " study that takes all the factors into account". And it's very clear you didn't bother to read the paper. Because, once again, the only thing it says about unarmed persons is, "black civilians are 21.1 percent more likely to have force used against them compared to white civilians with the same reported compliance behavior."
Which supports MY POSITION. Not yours.
You don't have a basic understanding of the facts at hand nor any of the statistics and yet you continue to run around saying saying "it's not true it's not true - la la la la". You haven't addressed the statistics in EITHER of the studies nor have you addressed the points I've made about implicit bias.
You haven't done your homework Simon and I'm calling you out on your BS. You want to continue to say I'm misrepresenting the stats? Fine, - prove it. Go into the research that's been done and show the figures I'm citing are wrong.

But in the meantime - do us all a favor and stop claiming to know things you don't know.
LoveUniHateExams

Saying, it's okay that more unarmed black people are shot than unarmed white people because "they could have been going for the officers gun" is NOT a meaningful rebuttal - I didn't say it was ok that unarmed black people (or unarmed white people) were shot. I was simply adding some context to your earlier statement.
You sound like Donald Trump - ridiculous statement. Simon's about as far away from Trump as it is possible to be.
I should know - I've clashed with him several times re Trump's character.
Simply saying "the stats are incorrect" is not an argument - Simon's not saying this. He's trying to put matters in proper context and draw solid conclusions.
do us all a favor and stop claiming to know things you don't know - no.
Simon, please continue to question statistics and ask questions about their context and what conclusions should be drawn. Statistics was my weak point in my 1st and 2nd years of university and I appreciate sensible debate about statistics.
Simon

You sound like Donald Trump. You just keep repeating the same nonsense over and over and over hoping it will stick.
No I don't, I've tried to explain to you why your stats are wrong. You just refuse to listen and consider the information.
I've provided the statistics to you showing that unarmed black people are six times more likely to be shot.
See ... now who's the one repeating the same nonsense? Your numbers don't show what you think they do. You appear to lack the skills to understand why even when it's explained in different ways.
I provided the names of the individuals and the date they were shot. You then accused me saying I had "no evidence". I then provided you with thecomprehensive database of news reports and public records that's been compiled.
Because a list of black people that have been shot doesn't = evidence that black people are more likely to be shot. It is just a record of those that have been shot. A more meaningful study looks are why - because what we should be concerned with is the unjustified shooting of anyone. Not just a headline figure.
Simply saying "the stats are incorrect" is not an argument. It's a Trumpism
Again and again I have explained to you why your stats are wrong. You have your hands over your ears because you don't want to listen to the facts, just repeat your nonsense claims.
Furthermore, I addressed your " study that takes all the factors into account". And it's very clear you didn't bother to read the paper. Because, once again, the only thing it says aboutunarmed persons is, "black civilians are 21.1 percent more likely to have force used against them compared to white civilians with the same reported compliance behavior."
Which supports MY POSITION. Not yours.
No, it doesn't. Having force used refers to being pushed or held, even just touched in some cases - not being shot. Unless you actually believe "he pushed me, therefore I've been shot" is credible.
The study shows that there is a discrepancy between race when it comes to being shot if you are unarmed - but it's that black cops are more likely to shoot black people than white cops are AND they are way more likely to shoot white people.
You haven't done your homework Simon and I'm calling you out on your BS. You want to continue to say I'm misrepresenting the stats? Fine, - prove it. Go into the research that's been done and show the figures I'm citing are wrong.
Just read any of my previous posts that explain it. I have explained it to you over and over again and don't see the point doing it again. YOU are the one who has simply resorted to personal attacks and insults because your wonky reasoning has been challenged.
But in the meantime - do us all a favor and stop claiming to know things you don't know.
How about you learn to be civil, learn to read and learn some basic stats. Then you might be able to take part in a discussion with the grown-ups.
never a jw

Whoever thinks that's is a fallacy black men are getting killed left and right, and that this country isn't full of racism and hate, lives like an ostrich.
Blacks may be killed left and right, but it's not by white cops. This is a small percentage. What is killing blacks left and right indirectly is their black leaders who have failed to address their biggest problems. Namely crime rates, school dropouts, fatherless homes.
Racism exist and it's still a problem, but nothing compared to 4 decades ago. it has diminished greatly. Iit may be going up again, but this time is fueled by the inability of both sides to have an honest talk. The white side often condescending, the black side often crying wolf.
redvip2000

This idea that cops regularly shoot black people is not proven. It's a narrative that at least a substantial number of the names held as examples have been proven to be false and discredited. It's more Black Lies Matter than Black Lives Matter.
Agreed. In fact cops don't regularly shoot black people more than white people Looking at the data for all police shooting deaths for last year, whites make up the majority as expected.
Now, of course when a white person is shot by the police, the media ignores it, it's not controversial, it's not exciting, it doesn't "sell". The media has the power to guide folks into hysteria. They decide what we know, what we are aware of, and ultimately what we care about.
This black sheriff is right. This attention to these "Police shootings" obfuscates the real issues in the black community.
The leading case of death for young black males in the US is gun violence in the black communities. Where are the protests? The outrage? Where is Black Lives Matter? But when the police causes the death of a few (in comparison) of a few members of the community, all bets are off. What hypocrisy.
In America, the line between when it's justified to use deadly force or not by the police is very thin. The police has very loose guidelines and this is a problem, but this is what they have been given.
When you see a suspect on the ground that has a gun in his pocket and is wrestling with the police, the justification for using deadly force can be as simple as him reaching his hand in this pocket for a second. Folks, the line is that thin, and videos don't always show all these details. If you disagree with these rules of engagement, don't blame the cops, blame the folks who regulate police procedure, for making the procedure too loose.
redvip2000

But the Implicit Bias isn't just on cops either. We also know that us citizens are more likely to call the cops on black people than we are on white people.
Yes so what? Us citizens are also most likely to suspect that a young muslim in an airport might be a terrorist, when compared to a black person, or asian, or white. Or that serial killer is most likely white. Or that a mobster is most likely Italian.
These connections are not imaginary, they are based on facts. There is a connection between the black communities and street crime, and this connection is not imaginary. Does this mean all blacks are criminals? No, but that's not the point. The reason for this fear is real.
Black communities are riddled with crime, and people are not blind to that. When you open the newspaper and story after story of shootings, robberies, gang violence shows a black suspect, this plays into the fear of people.
Pretending this is not a reality is not helpful to the conversation, because nobody is going to hand a certificate of respect to the black community. Respect is earned, not demanded, and skin color is not the issue. Many other communities of color in the US don't generate this fear.
This black sheriff is doing what what the black community should have been doing - having some introspection, and pointing out the obvious. But instead, the finger pointing will continue. The bad apples in the black community will continue rob and shoot, while the law abiding black folks ignore it, and the black activist will continue to pretend this doesn't happen, saving their energy for next police shooting.
DesirousOfChange

These connections are not imaginary, they are based on facts. There is a connection between the black communities and street crime, and this connection is not imaginary.~ RedVip2000
“There is nothing more painful to me at this stage in my life than to walk down the street and hear footsteps... then turn around and see somebody white and feel relieved.” ~ Jesse Jackson
Doc
OneGenTwoGroups

Seeing some really crappy arguments on this thread ... the worst of which is:
"Blacks kill each other all the time, what's the big deal if a few police officers get in on the action?"
LoveUniHateExams

"Blacks kill each other all the time, what's the big deal if a few police officers get in on the action?" - facile comment. You're better than this, OneGenTwoGroups.
Allow me to correct it: Myself and other posters aren't saying this.
What we're doing is scrutinizing dubious use of statistics that are being used to support the belief that Black people en mass are unfairly discriminated against by US law enforcement.
We're also scrutinizing the possible hypocrisy of the Black Lives Matter movement. They seem to care very much when a black man suffers from action by a cop. They seem to show little interest when a black guy suffers from action by another black man, despite the fact that black-on-black crime is much more prevalent than white cop-on-black racism.
For the record, any violence, killings, or any other suffering that black citizens suffer because of the colour of their skin is wrong and must stop, and the racist cops must be punished.
'Black Lives Matter'? Only when the killer is a white cop, it seems ...
Coded Logic

Racial Insensitivity

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