I cryed today...

by silentlambs 114 Replies latest watchtower scandals

  • Farkel

    : Hi Farkel
    : And you are funny--though intolerant of opposing viewpoints.

    Correction: I'm intolerant of bad arguments, opposing or otherwise.


  • larc

    Hey Farkle,

    Despite my cool headed and civil response above, I am about ready to go after lurker as I stated on the other thread, and I know just how to do it. I have enough data points from previous dialogue with him to fill in the blanks.

  • Tina

    Kis, Take my personal cause and angst elsewhere?
    No I wont. And it was no 'leap'..........look at your reponse,hit a nerve?
    I have no personal cause or angst,,,,thats your perception.
    And do you run this board to tell me to leave?
    And dont worry about my balance,try finding yours.
    Once again,you dont like my posts dont read em. SImple.
    You're anger over lack of moddy tools is showing. My approach offends you and there is nothing you can do about it.
    And as far as 'grade-school insult' it wasn't to me ,as it fit the nonsense per his posts,not that I owe you any explanation.
    Maybe you can explain this to me. I see folks getting called asshole fucker, making base remarks about farkels sick Dad,yet you zone in on me........ pretty revealing. I dont see you calling them to task(even tho you say you do) Dont bother to respond,I wont read it anyway. If you cant see that women leaving the wts have some special needs and issues,then you're really out of touch.
    PS I find your controlling attitude offensive.

  • freddi

    how can you say that a pedophile is not a child molester? how can you approve of the accused not being brought up on charges if he goes to the elders and confess? as a survivor of molestation i am deeply offended. i remember when i finally made it known to my mother about what was happening to me. it was humiliating. she made me leave the house to live on the street. i was branded by my family as a habitual liar all because this person was so respected by everyone in the community. he worked with children in grammar school. he was head of the p.t.a. he was at every function. he took care of his family to the utmost. all in all does make him a good person? he even broke down to me and apologized in his own perverted way on my wedding day. he claimed that his only crime was loving me too much. WHAT!!!!!! please.
    my friend's abuser was a ministerial servant in the kingdom hall and he still is. the elders chose to believe that he was not lying just because he was and still is so well respected. DIGUSTING!!!!!!!
    abuse takes place everywhere. it doesn't matter if the hand of god is supposed to guard an organization, but i do know that molesters can be men or women in the world or even in the kingdom hall. therefore, you should not blind yourself. the cases of it being lower amongst j.w.'s, yeah right. tell me something else.
    wake up and smell the coffee. fast!!!

  • freddi

    i am so happy to hear that you and your daughter found the courage to survive such an ordeal. i know that it will always be a part of you and your daughter but at least we can rely on the love from Jehovah. we know that he would never betray us; whether we are in the kingdom hall or not. i am glad that you are off the prozac. Jehovah's love, good therapy and some beautiful friends and loved ones is all that you need. not even the elders can save themselves so you have no need of returning to the hall. go on with your and be happy!

  • dedalus


    I appreciate what you're saying, and maybe it needs to be said.

    I do admire the patience and kindness and tolerance of people like Waiting, Larc, and others. Their methods may be more effective with some people ... but sometimes, arrgh!, a jerk needs to know he's being a jerk. Can you tell me that irritating people who put forth illogical arguments in the defence of something abominable don't get under your skin, too?

    But, like I said, I generally appreciate what you're saying.


  • Esmeralda

    As others have said, I just can't imagine why someone would so vehemently make excuses
    for sexual predators. I have to say that I think, personally, that the only difference between
    someone with 'pedophile tendencies' and actual 'molesters' is opportunity!

    Dedalus, there isn't anything I could add to your posts. You made every point that I thought
    of and then some. Thanks for being the champion of the children in the face of this guys
    twisted ideas.

    Wayne...just don't know what to say to you. Except that I think you would feel differently if
    someone had ever molested your own child. Then I don't think the semantics you're clinging
    to would be worth a damn to you.


    The Four Agreements:
    Be Impeccable With Your Word
    Don't Take Anything Personally
    Don't Make Assumptions
    Always Do Your Best

  • waiting

    hey freddi,

    Thank you for your thoughts - I appreciate them. My daughter has always had the type of personality that "will think about it tomorrow." Sometimes that pays off, if tomorrow never comes. Therapy helped her to establish some boundries & groundwork for her to see herself. And good friends helped her tremendously, as you've said. It took her a long time to get comfortable with herself. I think she's marvelous for a snot (I remember raising that girl.)

    As for me, that's not my personality - I remember and brood if I'm not careful. Too many things remind me of my daughter's, and my own, rapes. But I've got a fine family, including a marvelous (occasionally) husband. And I keep busy.

    I'm glad you've accomplished so much in your short time. I think family has a tremendous effect on the child - can emotionally break a child's self opinion of themselves. Congratulations on your accomplishments - many rape victims/survivors never get that far, no fault of their own sometimes.

    hey Kis - my Big Canadian

    I still feel that if we treat newcomers here with insults, we have missed one of the points of being here. We are not a closed country club allowing only "our kind" to enter. That doesn't mean we don't get heated - as I can sling on occasion too (history testifies to that.)

    But there are many issues with child molestation. We, as a people, do not understand all of them - no matter how educated, or how abused, we are/were. If we did have perfect understanding, perhaps we could end it.

    When in therapy, I would self-hypnotize myself and go back to "visit" my father. I got to the point that I could talk with him - see a little from the other side. I know it was my own memories of him - but it enabled me to see more of him. Of course, he was a monster, but he was also a person. I don't understand him - but, lord, I don't underestimate his power, or dismiss him with a classification. I would prefer to know his type than to throw him into the next neighborhood. Much too dangerous to the next child.

    I think talking, even when difficult, is much more beneficial than slinging insults - because the insulted is going to come back the same, imho. I know I do when insulted.

    As long as we can discuss - imho, the better the discussion, even if heated at times.


  • LDH

    Well since I haven't been feeling well lately I really haven't been too active on the board.But I have been reading this thread, and Wayne's justifications for his 'reasonings.'

    They really aren't valid reasonings, but more 'emotional defenses' to what he perceives as chinks in the JW armor.

    Wayne, you could quote all the CPT or DSM codes you want, but I'll tell you what. I'd like to SEE some pervert look at my daughter with that sparkle in his/her eye. I'd pay money to watch Jerry physically rip that person into very literal shreds.

    How much more so if that person then acted on those urges!

    Now I see your point, and we do live in the US where we are all 'innocent until proven guilty.' No one can be prosecuted for their sick thoughts, true enough. But your defense of even that classification of pedophile is unacceptable.

    Lat week when I was home sick there was an episode of "People's Court" I was watching. This landlord was the plaintiff and testified that he EVICTED his tenants (was suing for unpaid rent)because the 21 yr old son lured a 9 year old into his apartment "to play games and have ice cream and see something special." When the judge asked the 21-yr old about it, he said, "What does that have to do with the case?" EVEN a 'worldly' judge with no formal 'Elder's Training' [8>] could see the danger here even in a situation where no molestation occurred! And ruled on behalf of the plaintiff because she said he had a moral obligation to his neighbors to remove this tenant from his property.

    How much more so should Jehovah's people who speak on his behalf, and his elders who are appointed to protect the flock! How much more so do the elders have a moral obligation to remove these evil incarnates from the 'Christian Congregation.'

    Your doublespeak is quite frightening; I'm sure you wouldn't allow a pedophile to take your young son out to lunch just because you had no proof he'd acted on his urges! What kind of lunacy is that?!?!?!?

    Wayne you can't have it both ways. Either the Elders are there to protect the flock, or they're there to make sure the WBTS doesn't get sued for not following Caesar's law. Doesn't all of this 'Call the Society immediately' kind of make bells go off in your head?

  • stephenw20


    A bundle of thanks.........and the text was ... up to ....no above.....your usual standarD!


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