Where was the dead body of Jesus? Did the disciples disappear it?

by opusdei1972 63 Replies latest watchtower bible

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  OnTheWayOut

  Perry, your "facts" in your link are fairy tales. Re-asserting what was written in the Gospels doesn't make it true.
  Let's just dismiss one of your facts right now. Although Paul does write of a supernatural experience, so do many others. Heck, many came here to JWN and claim an audience with Jesus-from-the-sky.

  But Paul never met Jesus beforehand and doesn't write of any of the events concerning the man Jesus that are in the Gospels. He could have met Allah or Satan or had some good mushrooms. To take seriously, Paul's claim about 500 eyewitnesses, begs the question, "Eyewitnesses to what?" Today, calling it a fact that 500 people are eyewitnesses because someone wrote that decades after the events supposedly took place is not proper. Paul did not list their names and talk of their individual stories at all. I could claim 500 eyewitnesses to Zeus appearing 30 years ago in the forests of Europe. It would be a bit harder today to make the claim because of media and communications and people demanding to know the names of those people, but maybe a few hundred years later, people would just accept what I claim.

  No information is provided concerning the "500" to show whether they had a visionary revelation or saw an actual appearance of Christ in the flesh, or for that matter- where this took place. Paul does not tell us if he was among the 500 or if he had just "heard" a story about them or from one of them, or if it was maybe just a circulating story among Christians. The story of 500 eyewitnesses is not part of the Gospels or the book of Acts. It could just be an overzealous preacher taking advantage of the poor communications available at the time to make checking his story difficult. Or it could be 500 Christians with completely different stories like Christians have today- "God cured my cancer." "God did not cure someone's cancer because God took his pain away and brought him to heaven." " God found me a job." "God kept me unemployed so that I would be forced to pursue my dreams."
  
  No matter the outcome, all glory to Jesus or God and all outcomes are a result of belief and prayer and sometimes divine intervention.
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  Perry

  Jesus didn't stay dead. This was the lighning rod that set the Roman world on fire through EYE WITNESS TESTIMONY.
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  Viviane

  Plenty of facts to consider here.

  You clearly don't know what facts are.

  Jesus didn't stay dead. This was the lighning rod that set the Roman world on fire through EYE WITNESS TESTIMONY.

  Case in point. As a side note, you also have a horrible understanding of history.
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  designs

  Jesus was a false Messiah and fulfilled none of the jewish beliefs in their Messiah figure.

  He failed to:

  Unit the Jewish people.

  Rebuild the Temple

  Bring world peace.

  If you think he was God then he was responsible for killing pregnant women and their unborn fetuses, young virgins, little children, men and women when he backed the Roman army that sacked Jerusalem.
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  Band on the Run

  Bart Ehrman is not the only New Testament scholar on earth. Pagels stressed Paul's insistence on the physicality of the Resurrection. It makes a great contrast to Gnostic belief. They hated physicality.
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  Band on the Run

  I've thought of this a bit more. The apostles are not very bright in the gospels. Their concept of a messiah would be very different from our notions. Jesus of Nazareth moves towards God in the church's belief with John and later writings. I don't think the grave was that important to them. Jesus is shown respect as a teacher but he is far from God in the synoptic gospels. They were Jewish so they would believe what Jews of their time believed.
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  designs

  To be the Jewish Messiah did not require you to be "veryGod/Man" as the Creeds assert.

  A son of a Jewish man is one requirement. If we were to accept the Gospels that rules out Jesus.

  You don't die for the sins of the world if you are the Jewish Messiah, that is a Pauline invention in Romans. If fact you are not suppose to die and get resurrected if you are the Jewish Messiah.

  Your body and blood are not some transubstantial sacred atonement if you are the Jewish Messiah- "Unless you eat the flesh and drink the blood of the Son of Man you have no life in yourself" is a big Jewish No No.
• 

  kaik

  designs, you are correct on that. NT does not fullfill OT Messiah. There was no restoration of the throne, temple, and state of the Jews, and ushering a period of peace for mankind.

  Jews do not believe in Devil. Satan is someone who works under supervision of God as a public accusser, and collector of evidence for anyone misdeed. This was/is his job. He is not tormentor of damned souls in hell as is invented by Christians. Some schools of Judaism have a similar version of purgatory, whee souls needs clensing and purification before they entered the holy stage. I remember being told that this process is like washing soul of any impurities and no punishment is ethernal. Some rabbis also believe that citizens of Sodom went through similar cleansing process after their death. From Jewish point of view and belief, Jesus sacrifice does not make sense. They do not have need for atonement, nor anyone can buy out anyone sins. Everybody is responsible for their own sins only.

  What happened to body of Jesus? If he was a real person, it decayed after his death as dead body tends to do.
• 

  Rattigan350

  Just search for the answer on jw.org. Afterall there is a worldwide campaign saying it has the answers.
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  OnTheWayOut

  Perry's deliberate ignorance which allows the so-called "empty tomb" to be a proof of divinity is the best example I can give of why it was convenient for Christianity to invent the "empty tomb."