Is it just me or has this site become a Believer/Atheist warzone?

by BU2B 288 Replies latest jw friends

  • KateWild
    KateWild

    BU2B,

    Sorry I had to respond to cotfy, he just made me laugh. I disagree, I was online for a 3hr period yesterday, very upset about domestic abouse and violence. My whole situation.

    Bohm, cofty and Tammy, on the God vs Atheist threads also took the time to give me some support and encouragement. In fact I had 3 pages of encouragement. I can't remember all the posters and which threads they posted on. Adamh always has a supportive comment to make aswell.

    I fear that a doubting/struggling JW may come here and see the division-BU2B

    As a newbie this year that is not my veiw, it's the newbie's that start most of the threads.

    They are fun most of the time, when / if I get bored I just start my own topic

    Love Kate xx

  • Gopher
    Gopher

    I once was a first-time poster. Back then there were all sorts of nasty tiffs, name-calling and trolling here (at least for a while). I didn't care. I found information that helped me solidify my resolve to never go back to Watchtowerism. Also I found the freedom to express yourself here quite refreshing, even if sometimes it spilled over normal boundaries of mature conversation.

    I agree with Kate above:

    I fear that a doubting/struggling JW may come here and see the division-BU2B

    As a newbie this year that is not my view

    This forum has had at least one other thread recently address this very question (whether the atheist / believer debates drive away newbies). Until we see the number of newbies here drop dramatically, I cannot believe that the debates drive newbies away or discourage them from getting what they need from this forum.

  • LisaRose
    LisaRose

    I have noticed that there are a lot of believer/atheist threads right now. I don't think that is bad, in of itself, but I do think it could be done without the condescension. I was thinking about this lately and it occurred to me that one reason people keep fighting to hang on to their belief in a diety is that you are taking something away from them (faith) while giving nothing back other than cold, hard facts. If you do not understand that, then all the logic in the world will not work.

    When I realized TTATT, I feel as if I suffered a loss. My JW belief system was a construct that neatly explained all the bad in the world and gave me hope for the future. Losing that was uncomfortable, I had nothing to replace it with. Eventually I came to terms with it and realized no one had all the answers, and that was OK, but that took years.

    There is a reason why religious belief is so common, I think mankind has a need to believe in something greater than themselves, and to share that belief with others. Most studies show that people who are involved in a religious community are happier and healthier on average than those who don't. It's not surprising really, those in a religious community provide social contact with those of similar belief, it provides support to its members in times of trouble, helps them think about something other than themselves and engage in charitable works, which makes them feel better about themselves. Atheists are asking them to give that up because their belief is not logical. Of course they are going to push back.

    It doesn't mean you give up and don't discuss it. If the poster is not ready to give up on the idea of God, there may be others reading that are ready. But it might be good to keep in mind why others might cling to a belief that seems ridiculous to you. Most of here were believers at one point, so don't look down on someone that isn't giving that up as quickly as you did.

  • prologos
    prologos

    we get the discussion/ information here that is not be had at the kh, or even privately in wt "spiritual paradise".

    not everybody has personal iossues or needs support. just nourishment is enough.

  • BU2B
    BU2B

    Thanks for the imput everyone, I appreciate all of your thoughts. It is true that after finding out TTATT many take it to the next logical point, which is questioning the Bible, and then maybe the thought of God. Sometimes the doubts about the Bible, or God come first,then paving the way for the thinking individual to learn TTATT.

    Maybe I was wrong about scaring off newbies, after all this site helped wake me up slowly, and it didnt scare me away .

    I love all you guys here, we are really the only people in the world who can really relate to and understand just what being an awakened/Concious class/aware ex-JW is like. This place helps me survive mentally.. If I could I would buy a cold one for everyone here or a cocktail for those who would prefer

  • KateWild
    KateWild

    Maybe I was wrong about scaring off newbies, after all this site helped wake me up slowly, and it didnt scare me away -BU2B

    Well said, it's wonderful to chat with humble ones. Humility is a refreshing change from sitting with pharisees in a JC meeting Love Kate xx

  • trebor
  • Gopher
    Gopher

    According to Merriam-Webster, an agnostic is:

    a person who does not have a definite belief about whether God exists or not

    : a person who does not believe or is unsure of something

    So this definition focuses on whether or not a person has "belief".

    I think that definition may be flawed, because the word "agnostic" means "without knowledge" and not "without a definite belief". There is a difference.

    In reality, everyone is "without knowledge" because nobody living on earth can prove beyond doubt the existence or non-existence of God. That's why some of us atheists believe the term "agnostic" really applies to everyone living on earth and therefore differentiates nobody.

    What differentiates people is whether or not they believe in a supernatural realm that includes a deity. If you think there evidence for God is insufficient or nonexistenct, you are not a theist. If you take the leap of faith to believe, you are a theist.

  • cofty
    cofty

    The word has lost its meaning.

    People who haven't done the necessary work to investigate the evidence use it as an excuse.

  • J. Hofer
    J. Hofer

    agnosticism isn't some politically correct spot between believers and atheists. it covers a completely different topic. agnosticism states that we can't know if there's some kind of higher being out there. indeed, we can't know if there's some form of creative energy hiding away in a different galaxy, in fact we can't even know for sure if there's a very tiny teapot orbiting our planet.

    agnosticism is just a statement without a conclusion. the conclusions being: since there's no way to disprove god, i'll believe in him/her/it/them (which would be insane, but socially accepted in some western cultures), or: since there's no way to prove god, i won't believe in it (THIS being the only intellectual honest position to take).

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