If there is a god.. (page 8)

Monsieur

Monsieur - The Jesus portrayed in the bible is an egocentric family-destroying cult-leader.

How closely the Jesus portrayed in the bible resembles the historical Jesus is a different question.

Why is that difficult?

cofty

it isn't, im only stressing here that you are stating an opinion on a FICTITIOUS character.

much the same as if i said 'Santa Claus is a gift giving fat man whipping reindeer left and right on Christmas day'.

in other words, it's a non-argument since the character doesnt even EXIST, and thus it is the epitome of absurdity to blame a fictitious character for the actions of those that do belong in a harmful cult.

Now, you mention a 'historical' character named Jesus. You mention a 'balance of evidence'. Where can I go to read about this 'historical' Jesus??

Because my research has produced absolutely zero evidence that such a man ever existed.

cofty

The obvious difference is that no sane adult argues that Santa is a real person or that followers of Santa deserve to have their delusions respected.

Millions of people believe that the Jesus described in the gospels was the epitome of all that is virtuous. That is only possible by ignoring much of what is written and by Tammy's sort of special pleading.

Whether or not there is a historical person behind the gospel stories is an intersting question. I am persuaded that there was but that is a different thread.

Monsieur

stating an opinion on Santa holds as much water as stating an opinion on the Biblical Jesus regardless of what the world thinks of them. (may i add that folks like Bill oReilly have in fact defended Santa and have demanded that we respect him, look it up on youtube. it's there.)

But let's use your argument and let's take the Devil for example. Plenty of people belive in the Biblical Satan, yet no one has ever taken of picture with him, dined with him, held a conversation with him. But they swear he exists. He is in fact blamed for the evil in this world. (a lot more evil than what Jesus is attributed with)

Yet how is arguing for/against Satan, any different than arguing for/against Jesus? Without evidence of either, WHAT is the argument?

70wksfyrs

Phizzy said

In fact I rather feel that the evidence is stronger that if god exists,then he is Evil God.

What's his name? Satan? 1John 5:19

Monsieur

Phizzy said

In fact I rather feel that the evidence is stronger that if god exists,then he is Evil God.

What's his name? Satan? 1John 5:19

70wksfyrs-

what evidence did Phizzy ACTUALLY produce?

70wksfyrs

snare,

You have 13 very good questions. I can't possibly answer all of them in one go. But question 3 is interesting

3) Does a god deserve to be Worshipped JUST because he exists and demands it?

Jehovah in Rev4:11 certainly demands it!!! I don't wnat to get into semantics of correct phrases. He demands it full stop, period. In my opinion NO he doesn't deserve it at all

70wks....

cofty

Monsieur whatever your point is is lost on me.

I adressing those who believe that JC existed and that the gospels tell us real historical facts about him. I contend that if they read those stories more carefully they will see that thete is little to admire or imitate. It's a provisional argument.

I am not blaming Jesus for anything, I am blaming those who follow him - or the myths surrounding him - uncritically.

70wksfyrs

Cofty and Tammy,

You had a great 3hour exchange. Very funny you both make good points. Both winners this time. Good clean debate.

70wks...

70wksfyrs

cofty- one of your points about Jesus having charisma and using it in a decptive way is interesting. I think Matt chapters 5-7 have a lot of good advice. Don't you?

Monsieur

I am not blaming Jesus for anything, I am blaming those who follow him - or the myths surrounding him - uncritically.

-

cofty

exactly. Jesus has nothing to do with it. Myths are just that, myths. They are not living, breathing intelligent entities that can correspond with us, however much we wish they were so we could punch them in the face. Unfortunately, man is the culprit.

i get what you are saying.

If there is a god..

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