If there is a god..

by snare&racket 94 Replies latest jw friends

  • snare&racket
    snare&racket

    Now we have to answer.....

    1) Is there more than one god? How do you choose the most senior god?

    2) If you chose religious texts to make this desicion, how do you know they are not purposfully misleading by an ill willed god?

    3) Does a god deserve to be Worshipped JUST because he exists and demands it?

    4) Do I use morals to decide which god will I align myself to?

    5) Is it ok for god to be immoral and commit what WE would consider evil acts just because he is god?

    6) What if the religious texts are immoral? Do we reject them if the charachters claim to be doing as the god asked of them, as without these texts there is no other source for this paticular chosen god ?

    "Now go and attack Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and do not spare them. But kill both man and woman, infant and nursing child.." 1 Samuel 15:3

    Numbers 31: "2 Then they brought the captives, the booty, and the spoil to Moses, to Eleazar the priest, and to the congregation of the children of Israel, to the camp in the plains of Moab by the Jordan, across from Jericho. 13 And Moses, Eleazar the priest, and all the leaders of the congregation, went to meet them outside the camp. 14 But Moses was angry with the officers of the army, with the captains over thousands and captains over hundreds, who had come from the battle.

    15 And Moses said to them: “Have you kept all the women alive? 16 Look, these women caused the children of Israel, through the counsel of Balaam, to trespass against the Lord in the incident of Peor, and there was a plague among the congregation of the Lord. 17 Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known a man intimately. 18 But keep alive for yourselves all the young girls who have not known a man intimatly."

    7) If we decide that there is a god as of the bible/quaran would it be reasonable to expect that some believers would choose to not worship him or even outright dispute supporting such a god for his acts in the bible/quaran , such as Genocide, Infanticide, Sexism, Racism, Murder, Kindap, Rape, Slavery, Sexual Slavery?

    8) Do you not question such immoral acts?

    9) Is it reasonable for that god to kill all people that worship other gods through sincere misguidance or kill atheists with sincere non belief?

    10) Why would he need to kill these men women and children? Why not present himself as the real god to them, explain why he asks for worship and also why it is deserved and let them decide? If they decide not to, he can be a merciful god who respects the free will of his creation. For he also worships nobody and should understand, for he made us in his image.

    11) Is the god of the bible a dictator who demands worship? Is that enough of a reason to worship him, fear?

    "Make no treaties with them and show them no mercy. Do not intermarry with them, and don't let your daughters and sons marry their sons and daughters. They will lead your young people away from me to worship other gods. Then the anger of the LORD will burn against you, and he will destroy you." Deuteronomy 7:1-4

    "I will sweep away everything in all your land," says the LORD. "I will sweep away both people and animals alike. Even the birds of the air and the fish in the sea will die. I will reduce the wicked to heaps of rubble, along with the rest of humanity," says the LORD. "I will crush Judah and Jerusalem with my fist and destroy every last trace of their Baal worship. I will put an end to all the idolatrous priests, so that even the memory of them will disappear. For they go up to their roofs and bow to the sun, moon, and stars. They claim to follow the LORD, but then they worship Molech, too. So now I will destroy them! And I will destroy those who used to worship me but now no longer do. They no longer ask for the LORD's guidance or seek my blessings." Zephaniah 1:2-6

    12) If there is a reason a god would deserve exclusive devotion and worship...what is it ?

    13) Humans created life in a labaratory 2 years ago, can we demand worship from objects and life we create?

    Just wondering how the theists have navigated these issues in their desicion to worship a specific god? Paiculalry the biblical god and his long rap sheet of acts that nay human would consider acts of immoral evil.....

    Snare xxx

  • braincleaned
    braincleaned

    Love your post! It's time people wake up and smell the man-invented god!
    You forgot another sweet demand from loving daddy in the sky:

    Hosea 13:16

    16 The people of Samaria must bear their guilt,
    because they have rebelled against their God.
    They will fall by the sword;
    their little ones will be dashed to the ground,
    their pregnant women ripped open.”

  • braincleaned
    braincleaned

    Ironically, Jehovah hated child sacrifice to Molech... and massacered those practicing the same vile thing he wanted exclusivity on, since he intended to sacricifice his own son — for his OWN glory! Mofo!!

  • snare&racket
    snare&racket

    Brain cleaned, I remove the hosea verses as I am sure these people have read them and know these immoral acts.

    Just wondering how they reason around them.

    I sincerely see no evidence of a god. But even if I did, I would have no clue how one can select a god out of them all as the most senior god.

    I also dont know how they go on to decide to align themselves to that god and whether they care how that god has behaved or not?

    I SINCERELY want to know how they have all negated this miefield, assuming they have not just taken the god of their local culture and upbringing which would be very illogical and unjustifiable.

    Snare x

  • Bugbear
    Bugbear

    I think, that if god does exist. He´s got a lot of explanations to be done. If he really does exist, I think that he/she really would be accused for a lot of crime with our present standard. I think that the court would find him insane, or more like a psycho. He would be imprissoned for lifetime or executed. Much better for him not to exist.

    Bugbear

  • snare&racket
    snare&racket

    If we exchanged the two terms used for god in the bible (Adonai & YHWH) with a name, such as BOB...

    If we read bout Bob and his actions we would consider him the worst being to have ever existed. He drowned his children in a flood because they displeased him! That alone is enough to want him restrained, would you go so far as to WORSHIP bob just because of his status?

    These are REALLY IMPORTANT questions !

  • Rip
    Rip

    I think you are a sincer atheist and you will one day find the answer to your questions. First of all the supposition of a God derives from human inner will of paternership. Now if any God we chose is our father, that means the essence of life, we must also be willing to ACCEPT that he fathered us for a PURPOSE. That purpose may justify all the actions he(the father) undertakes. So, from the point of view of a Jah worshiper my explaination to those acts that people rationally and simplistically humanly judge unacceptable (though too surrealistic) is: Jah created the earth to be inhabited the way he was thinking best by men he had created. Those men mistakenly failed to measure up to that purpose. Jah decided to give them a CHANCE, and Adam and Eve were allowed to "fill the world", still Adam's progeny had no idea of THE PURPOSE, for which they went against. Jah gave them a second CHANCE, by the means of the SEED of Abraham, a man he chose to take the lead in the PURPOSE, to enlight the rest of mankind and later extrapolate it to a nation whose LAWS (Mose's) influenced many constitutions of our days. Now in the establishment of the Nation, which was part of a plan, people residing those places were warned not to go against the plan, which they did and faced the consequences. A war was launched and women were killed and children too but this was collateral and God new why it was necessary in his capacity of omniscience. Once the nation was no more, Jah established christianity through Jesus, a man he sent to TEACH and expand the plan/PURPOSE to the entire GLOBE. The man was killed, not by God but by the Romans. If he wouldn't have been killed or hypothetically accepted, that would have been the shortcut leading the PURPOSE. Now that he was killed, Jah turned the value of his blood into sacrificial gift for atonment of the now to do sins. That is why the man is a GIFT to you and me. For those who do not believe in God, know that you are in disadvantage for there is No MORE CHANCE, there will not be no MORE Jesus. It is closed. Those who follow Jesus and his teachings have the advantage of avoiding destruction (their children included) if they do not leave by his standard. To add, if ever God didn't exist (for the doubters) they have nothing to loose. That is how I realy am a not doubting JAHTheist. THE PLAN continues and we are its last phase, Please wake up!! We are not trees!!

  • cofty
    cofty

    If we exchanged the two terms used for god in the bible (Adonai & YHWH) with a name, such as BOB...

    What if God was one of us?
    Just a slob like one of us
    Just a stranger on the bus
    Trying to make His way home
    If God had a face
    What would it look like? - Alanis Morisette

    It's a good point. Take away the obligatory reverence and Bob is such a knob.

    The rules of probability dictate that most believers are backing the wrong horse.

  • cofty
    cofty

    A war was launched and women were killed and children too but this was collateral - Rip

    No. The women and infants were specifically targeted for cold-blooded execution by your god. You need to read your bible more carefully.

  • tec
    tec

    Hope you don't mind if I attempt to answer your questions? I haven't read through them yet, so I'll just take them as they come:

    1) Is there more than one god? How do you choose the most senior god?

    There are 'gods'. But there is only one Almighty God, the Most Holy One of Israel. I did not 'choose' Him. I listened to the Truth (Christ) who spoke OF Him.

    2) If you chose religious texts to make this desicion, how do you know they are not purposfully misleading by an ill willed god?

    I listened to Christ... from the truth of his teachings; recognizing Him as the Truth... and then understanding that lies do not come from the Truth. Nothing He has ever said (be it written, or spoken as the Spirit), has ever been anything other than truth.

    3) Does a god deserve to be Worshipped JUST because he exists and demands it?

    Respected, yes, I would think so... as you would respect anyone/anything with great power that has given you and everyone else life. Of course, is it He who has demanded it for Himself, or those who have loved Him, demanding it for him?

    I mean... what IS worship?

    4) Do I use morals to decide which god will I align myself to?

    I would use Truth, personally.

    5) Is it ok for god to be immoral and commit what WE would consider evil acts just because he is god?

    Depends upon whether WE are right or not... doesn't it? So again, depends upon what the TRUTH is.

    6) What if the religious texts are immoral? Do we reject them if the charachters claim to be doing as the god asked of them, as without these texts there is no other source for this paticular chosen god ?

    The perhaps the religious texts are incorrect, and not the Truth. Perhaps we are misunderstanding the religious texts. Hold them up to the light of the Truth... to see if they are from God or not.

    "Now go and attack Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and do not spare them. But kill both man and woman, infant and nursing child.." 1 Samuel 15:3

    Numbers 31: "2 Then they brought the captives, the booty, and the spoil to Moses, to Eleazar the priest, and to the congregation of the children of Israel, to the camp in the plains of Moab by the Jordan, across from Jericho. 13 And Moses, Eleazar the priest, and all the leaders of the congregation, went to meet them outside the camp. 14 But Moses was angry with the officers of the army, with the captains over thousands and captains over hundreds, who had come from the battle.

    15 And Moses said to them: “Have you kept all the women alive? 16 Look, these women caused the children of Israel, through the counsel of Balaam, to trespass against the Lord in the incident of Peor, and there was a plague among the congregation of the Lord. 17 Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known a man intimately. 18 But keep alive for yourselves all the young girls who have not known a man intimatly."

    Again, as with these... hold them up to the Truth... that is from these religous texts... that Truth being Christ.

    7) If we decide that there is a god as of the bible/quaran would it be reasonable to expect that some believers would choose to not worship him or even outright dispute supporting such a god for his acts in the bible/quaran , such as Genocide, Infanticide, Sexism, Racism, Murder, Kindap, Rape, Slavery, Sexual Slavery?

    I think the above answers this question.

    8) Do you not question such immoral acts?

    I hold all up to the Truth. Since He reveals the Truth about God.

    9) Is it reasonable for that god to kill all people that worship other gods through sincere misguidance or kill atheists with sincere non belief?

    It might be reasonable for the god that people have invented... but it is not true of the God that Christ shows us.

    10) Why would he need to kill these men women and children? Why not present himself as the real god to them, explain why he asks for worship and also why it is deserved and let them decide? If they decide not to, he can be a merciful god who respects the free will of his creation. For he also worships nobody and should understand, for he made us in his image.

    He did present Himself... in Christ. But still, people look elsewhere to see/know Him. The exact opposite of what God and Christ said to do. So it is little wonder that so few people actually know Him.

    11) Is the god of the bible a dictator who demands worship? Is that enough of a reason to worship him, fear?

    "Make no treaties with them and show them no mercy. Do not intermarry with them, and don't let your daughters and sons marry their sons and daughters. They will lead your young people away from me to worship other gods. Then the anger of the LORD will burn against you, and he will destroy you." Deuteronomy 7:1-4

    "I will sweep away everything in all your land," says the LORD. "I will sweep away both people and animals alike. Even the birds of the air and the fish in the sea will die. I will reduce the wicked to heaps of rubble, along with the rest of humanity," says the LORD. "I will crush Judah and Jerusalem with my fist and destroy every last trace of their Baal worship. I will put an end to all the idolatrous priests, so that even the memory of them will disappear. For they go up to their roofs and bow to the sun, moon, and stars. They claim to follow the LORD, but then they worship Molech, too. So now I will destroy them! And I will destroy those who used to worship me but now no longer do. They no longer ask for the LORD's guidance or seek my blessings." Zephaniah 1:2-6

    Even you do not add in the Truth of God, in any of this... but look toward things other than Christ, to know Him.

    12) If there is a reason a god would deserve exclusive devotion and worship...what is it ?

    Life. Love. Truth. Mercy. Forgiveness.

    Though the worship that He seeks is that we show love and mercy and forgiveness; caring for those in need; loosening the chains of injustice; etc.

    13) Humans created life in a labaratory 2 years ago, can we demand worship from objects and life we create?

    We DO demand respect from those that we create/give birth to... at least as long as those ones are in our house, or want to be in our house. Do we not?

    Just wondering how the theists have navigated these issues in their desicion to worship a specific god? Paiculalry the biblical god and his long rap sheet of acts that nay human would consider acts of immoral evil.....

    Well, there you go.

    Though it really was not so much a decision, as it was following the Truth.

    Same as you follow evidence to lead you to a conclusion... rather than simply choosing the conclusion you like best, or fear the most.

    Peace to you!

    tammy

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