Why does god kill children?

by Comatose 269 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • tec

    Jesus and the god of the OT could not be more opposite! This is a massively failed argument. I would sure like to see the Biblical accounts recounting all the genocides, small-scale murders, plagues, blood lust and general mayhem recorded in Jesus' activities that have any

    resemblance to OT stories.

    Oh, you can find the Father of Christ (the God whose Image is Christ) in the OT also. As well as see how it is Israel who kept going astray and NOT acting in mercy and love. In passages like this (which apply to the people now as well):

    "Shout it aloud, do not hold back. Raise your voice like a trumpet.

    Declare to my people their rebellion and to the house of Jacob their sins.

    For day after day they seek me out; they seem eager to know my ways,

    as if they were a nation that does what is right and has not forsaken the commands of its God.

    They ask me for just decisons and seem eager for God to come near them.

    Why have we fasted, they say, and you have not seen it?

    Why have we humbled ourselves, and you have not noticed?

    Yet on the day of your fasting, you do as you please and exploit all your workers.

    Your fasting ends in quarreling and strife, and in striking each other with wicked fists.

    You cannot fast as you do today and expect your voice to be heard on high.

    is this the kind of fast I have chosen, only a day for a man to humble himself?

    Is it only for bowing one's head like a reed and for lying on sackcloth an ashes?

    Is that what you call a fast, a day acceptable to the LORD?

    Is this not the kind of fasting I have chosen:

    to loose the chains of injustice and untie the cords of the yoke,

    to set the oppressed free and break every yoke?

    Is it not to share your food with the hungry and to provide the poor wanderer with shelter-

    when you see the naked, to clothe him, and not to turn away from your own flesh and blood?

    Then your light will break forth like the dawn, and your healing will quickly apper;

    then your righteousness will go before you and the glory of hte LORD will be your rear guard

    Then you will call, and the LORD will answer;

    you will cry for help, and he will say: Here am I.

    It continues, but I hope you get the point that God always asked for mercy, for justice, that the oppressed be set free, and the poor cared for, etc.

    This is the God who sent Christ, who Christ loved and said was His Father, who Christ is the IMAGE of, and who Christ learned FROM. The same God who gave the law... love God, and love your neighbor as yourself; and these are the two laws that all other laws stem from. The law of love; that men twist to their own ends.

    This is why I reject some (or at least the interpretation some give... knowing that we do not have all the facts from this one book) Because it is Christ and HIS Father, who I follow. God, as shown and known and seen ... by looking at Christ.

    Why would God send the Truth, ADCMS... if people already knew the truth? Why would Christ have had to correct people in their understanding... and lack of mercy, if they were already doing everything as God decreed?



  • tec

    How do you get color in your text? I can't figure it out...

  • ozbrad
  • AndDontCallMeShirley


    How do you get color in your text? I can't figure it out...

    Ask Jesus. Apparently he tells you everything else.

  • frankiespeakin

    If we look at religion as a evolutionary developement that led better survival rates and passing on DNA. Then a murdering diety that can muster up clan members to kill the other guys not in the clan along with their infant progeny seems to increase their rate of their survival and DNA sharring as apposed to a peaceful diety who is against all forms of violence. Seems like a natural development just like morals which develope that make clan life more successful.

    We being meat eaters would be inclinded towards fighting each other and chowing down on the losers as still practiced in some remote regions of the world where canabals exist. So a deity that encourages murdering the "other" guy and his progeny could be seen as a natural outcome do to the selectivity of survival of the fitest.

  • Comatose

    Interesting Frankie.

  • Comatose

    Tec- I spelled his name wrong. It's Achan, and here is the relevant info. http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Joshua+7&version=NIV

    I do already foresee what your response will be. No need to type a lengthy rebuttal.

    I am hoping people with questions or lurkers will find the topic and discussion interesting. Not really looking to have lengthy postings back and forth with those who do not believe the ENTIRE bible is inspired. For those like you, none of these accounts matter. But, for those who are current JW or just in fading, the concept of ignoring parts of the bible is foreign and doesn't make sense. So it is the searching ones who may find this concept of god killing kids for poor reasons interesting.

    For example with Michelle. She seems to believe the entire bible is inspired and true. It is her I hope to get thinking about how this type of god could be loving.


  • frankiespeakin

    Being that we have many primative instincts towards violence, a natural outcome of a predator species like our own. The human consciousness that is developing in our species gives us some freedom from these primative predatory instincts and so we can slow down anger with reason and so forth. We are not completely free from these ancient instincts but have a limited measure of control over them but sometimes they can seize us before we are aware.

    This is also what is happening to religion among our species the more conscious we become the less influence it is having just like an old dying instinct that is no longer valuable for survival of the fitest it fades out thru natural selection.

  • AndDontCallMeShirley

    For example with Michelle. She seems to believe the entire bible is inspired and true. It is her I hope to get thinking about how this type of god could be loving.


    Michelle makes that claim, Comatose, but did you notice how many qualifiers, such as, 'could have', 'maybe' and "I think" that both she and tec/Tammy included in their replies? What it comes down to, especially with Michelle, is the Bible accounts as written make her so uncomfortable she's forced to make all kinds of assumptions, speculations, excuses and outright fantasizing in order to accept them. Taken as written, the accounts offend anyone with even a moderately developed sense of morals and are impossible to defend as-is.

    Tec just dismisses anything she doesn't like with the excuse that the scribes made mistakes, the account doesn't REALLY say what it does, we're just misinterpretting it, not all the OT is inspired, it's just bad writing, crucial details were left out that would explain it all, etc. Or, tec has the audacity to simply say she doesn't care about the Egyptian parents or their firstborns that were killed- they had it coming. Since "firstborn" doesn't necessarily mean a small child, then to her the death of another human being is irrelevant. Really nice example of Christian love. Tec/Tammy seems to ignore her friend Jesus' command to pray for your enemies and show love toward your persecutors. She likes when her enemies get what's coming to them and feels no love or mercy for anyone she thinks doesn't deserve it.

    Of course, neither offered a shred of proof for any of their claims. Just lots of personal opinions and excuses.

    Tec claimed that there are "many" books besides the Bible that tell us about Jesus' life. I asked for evidence and a list of such books to back up her claim. I'm still waiting.....

    As you said, comatose, their responses are totally predictable and will not answer anything in the long run.

  • cofty
    Tec claimed that there are "many" books besides the Bible that tell us about Jesus' life. I asked for evidence and a list of such books to back up her claim. I'm still waiting.....

    Tammy has been down that road before so she should know better than to raise it again.

    Its a common feature of the intellectual dishonesty of believers.

    1. They make far-fetched assertions.

    2. Somebody either asks for a reference or offers compelling counter-evidence.

    3. They ignore the response.

    4. Weeks or months later they make the same assertion again.

    Isn't it so refreshing not to have to defend the indefensible anymore?

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