My questions for YOU

by Terry 42 Replies latest jw friends

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  Terry

  I'm curious about human intelligence and beliefs as a natural phenomenon.

  I've long suspected that even the most "normal" and well-educated person harbors "fringe" beliefs.

  The purpose of this thread is not to mock beliefs of any kind. Rather it is for all of us to toss in to a pile our own unprovables so

  we can, as a group, evaluate how natural and non-neurotic such thinking might well be.

  For example:

  1.UFO's.

  On the one hand, UFO's have been a source of fascination since the late 1940's and 70 years later all we have are personal testimonials and fuzzy videos. NO HARD EVIDENCE.

  I don't know what to make of this. I'm neither a believer nor a disbeliever. I guess I'm more of an open skeptic. How about you?

  2. Ancient Astronauts/Alien kidnappings

  Erich von Danniken had a series of popular books from the 1960's forward purporting to explain technological advances on earth with "interference" by Aliens.

  In the 1970's reports of people being kidnapped and "probed" began to make the news. I personally find this unbelievable, but, others do not. Do you?

  3.E.S.P. and Psychic powers

  So many tests have been conducted by Universities and independent researchers concerning psychic abilities. An avalanche of books have been released. The "Amazing" Randi (former magician turned Skeptic Investigator) has debunked these claims by pointing out the flaws in the testing and the naive assumption by investigators. Never-the-less, a majority of people strongly include psychic powers as part of their own belief system. I cannot accept any of it, but, I'd like to know your views.

  4. Conspiracy theories

  There are so many of these from time immemorial I can't begin to list them all. My own Grandfather believed the medical profession did not want people to be healthy because it would put them out of business! He was a vitamin fanatic and food faddist. 9/11 Truthers hold fast to strong assertions that the Bush Administration blew up the Twin Towers as pretext for starting wars in the Middle East. I can't figure out why a GREATER pretext was needed than the actual flying of passenger planes into buildings was necessary! But, beyond my skepticism....do you find any Conspiracy ideas so plausible you have to include them among your own beliefs?

  5.Angels

  In the 1990's every other book or TV show was about guardian angels. It was a huge fad. When I was a child, my Grandmother (a Catholic) told me I had a guardian angel until puberty! It comforted me. Now I can't begin to embrace such an idea--yet, many people do. What about you/

  6.Revelations by God

  Sincere, devout, pious and honest believers have been receiving "revelations" from god as far back as we care to look--yet, as far as I know, for all these assertions, claims and presentations: nothing awesome and credible has come of any of them. Predictions and assurances of dates-certain fall by the wayside one after the other. Do you still claim God reveals directly "inside information" to specially chosen ones? I can't. But, Do you?

  7.Any other belief

  What is it and could you describe it?

  Importantly: TELL US IF YOU FEEL THERE HAS BEEN EVIDENCE OR PROOF to encourage your deep convictions.

  Thanks!

  P.S. I don't really want this thread cluttered by nay-sayers and ridicule. Just simple statements of belief. Okay?
• 

  rip van winkle

  !- I have never dismissed the idea there could be other intelligent life out there... but I have never seen a UFO and the only creatures I've met from another planet were in my own Kingdom Hall , Assemblies, and at District Conventions!!!

  2-Alien probing- although sounds oddly interesting-I would check with Glander and his ideas of Alien anal probes.

  3- ESP and pyschic powers? Not yet.

  4- Pre or post Watergate? Ever see the JFK movie? Kinda makes you believe it is plausible. But, no, I don't believe in a 9/11 conspiracy.

  5- Some people believe a guardian angel is their dead loved one. No, I don't believe in Guardian Angels. Though if I do have one he is asleep at the wheel!!

  6- So far, the only receivers of inside info that I believed were Jehovah Witness false prophets: The Governing Body Of The WatchTower Society.

  7-Terry, I believe the children are our future. Teach them well and let them lead the way!
• 

  xchange

  I'm a NO on all accounts.
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  cobaltcupcake

  I'm a no on everything except #3 - ESP and psychic powers.

  My BFF lives 1000 miles away from me, but she knows, without any sort of communication from me, when I'm having a bad day. She'll call and say, "What's wrong?"

  I believe.
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  jgnat

  Pay it forward. No proof. I believe it because I think it inspires me to be better than myself.
• 

  Ding

  Just want to make an observation regarding the similarity of conspiracy theories and end times prophecies. The first time you hear one, it can sound quite plausible. You may even jump on the bandwagon. Then comes another... and another. Each one may seem plausible when considered in isolation, but when you view them all side-by-side, the more absurd the whole concept seems.

  Take the JFK assassination as an example. Someone comes up with a theory that Oswald was acting on orders from Castro, who was retaliating over the Bay of Pigs and the Cuban missle crisis. That sounds plausible.

  Then someone else posits that Oswald was completely innocent, that the real killer was a mob hit man located on the Grassy Knoll. The Zapruder film is cited to prove that the fatal bullet came from JFK's front and right. Theories start to multiply, with various shooter locations proposed -- Grassy Knoll, the overpass ahead of the limo, a storm sewer near the limo, etc. Each theorist adduces arguments in support of a different set of conspirators -- Clay Shaw, the CIA, the Pentagon, J. Edgar Hoover, the Soviets, LBJ, right wing fanatics, etc.

  Taken in isolation, any one of the theories can seem very persuasive. But when all are viewed together, side-by-side, the whole thing seems absurd because they are entirely contradictory. You start to realize that a skilled individual can "prove" almost anything by citing selective evidence or by making things up as they go along.

  End times prophecies are similar.

  As an example, go back and read Russell's end times writings. Look at his charts. He posits many different time line symmetries in support of his date system and argues that they can't possibly be coincidental. It's easy to see why many people in his day believed he was onto something with his 1874 and 1914 dates.

  Then you find out that there is no end to competing predictions. There's Nostradamus, the Mayans, Miller, Rutherford, Fred Franz, Harold Camping, and so on. If all you knew about was one of these prophets and their supporting "evidence," they can seem very persuasive. But when you put them all together, side-by-side, the whole things seems absurd because they are entirely contradictory. You start to realize that a skilled individual can "prove" almost anything by citing selective evidence or by making things up as they go along.

  This is one aspect of the false prophecy discussion that seems to get lost on JWs. They will talk about "failed expectations," but what they don't take into account is that the various WT leaders didn't just pick a date and say, "I expect the end will come then." Rather, each time, they professed to have superior insight and strong Bible evidence for their chronology. Each one in turn whipped sincere people into a frenzy by convincing them that they were presenting -- in Russell's words -- "God's dates, not ours."

  If only they would look at the total picture and see how many times sincere people like themselves have banked their futures on persuasive -- but completely erroneous -- evidence and arguments, perhaps they would be far more reluctant to commit the rest of their lives to following such self-proclaimed spokesmen of God.
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  Amelia Ashton

  No to everything in the list but I have as yet to hear a definitive explanation about the amazing Nazca Lines
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  jgnat

  Just goes to show, Ding, that we are all suckers for a compelling story.
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  cantleave

  No to them all except Angels.

  I am married to an Angel.........
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  james_woods

  No to everything, including the Loch Ness Monster (if that was on the list).

  A good book to read on this (two books, actually) is "The Physics of Star Trek" and "Beyond The Physics of Star Trek" by Lawrence Krauss.

  He basically lists the absurdity of UFOs (particularly SMALL UFOs travelling here incognito from other stars), teleportation, ESP, and kinetic object manipulation by "thought" in terms of basic physics.

  Of course, I might be convinced about Nessie if provided with the evidence of a bona-fide carcass.