Regulate Marijuana Like Wine (interesting article)

by sabastious 87 Replies latest jw friends

  • darth frosty
    darth frosty

    I was talking to my brother about this and he maintains this is the main reason they will not legalize maryJ:

    They cant make money off of it!

    It goes beyond mere manufacturing and taxation its all the ways the govt and local municipalities can get paid.

    Look at it this way the gov/auto makers could virtually eliminate drunk driving if they added a breath-alyzer to all cars. It would work like a kill switch and not allow the car to start till a breath with legal blood alchohol level was blown into device.

    The reason they will not add the device is that each DUI brings in at least $10000 in court cost and legal fee's.

    Now back to MaryJ they have no QUICK way to determine if a person is high off MaryJ.

  • dgp
    dgp

    Sabastious: I understand the theory behind making something legal and then eliminating overprices and the like. That is not the point.

    I have not discussed whether marijuana is a drug or a medication or whatever, or whether the decision regarding its use has been taken away from Americans. My point has consistenly been a different one.

    I have said that there will be no reduction in crime if marijuana becomes legal. I have also said that my regret, as a person who does not live in the United States and does not vote in America, is that, if you guys legalize the thing, we will pay for that in crime.

    Drug cartels will see the same thing you see. And then my expectation is that they will not gladly give up a profitable trade. I am yet to see a businessman who makes lots of money on something and gives it up just like that. Instead, they will sell the product and will bully others out of selling it. Something like "All right, now I can sell marijuana legally. I just won't let any stupid bastard take the business away from me, whatever is left of it". In the meantime, they will go on with their "other" businesses.

    It should be easy to understand this point.

    I know I will not convince anyone here, but I think I can give an opinion.

    Mr. What Happened is not happy with the fact that I do not think he is right. So he calls me a clown and a drug dealer in disguise. He also made blanket statements about Central Americans, which he cannot prove. None of that makes him right, or proves me wrong, or in any way advances the discussion. It does show us how uncomfortable he feels with different opinions.

  • darth frosty
    darth frosty

    1st and foremost DGP I have not read your complaint with sab.

    I would like to comment on your statement:

    Drug cartels will see the same thing you see. And then my expectation is that they will not gladly give up a profitable trade.

    I think maryJ is different due to the fact it can be so easily produced. A $1000 investment can set up a nice home grow operation.

    I dont know if where you live medicianal maryJ is legal but here after they legalized it there were grow supply stores on every corner.

  • sabastious
    sabastious
    Drug cartels will see the same thing you see. And then my expectation is that they will not gladly give up a profitable trade. I am yet to see a businessman who makes lots of money on something and gives it up just like that. Instead, they will sell the product and will bully others out of selling it. Something like "All right, now I can sell marijuana legally. I just won't let any stupid bastard take the business away from me, whatever is left of it". In the meantime, they will go on with their "other" businesses.

    Lets say I have a large parcel of land that has been proven to yield wonderful apple trees. The apples that come from my land are the best of the best and can only be grown in my general area. Now lets say you live in a place that is too cold year round to grow apple trees, much less the great apples that I grow on my plot. If you wanted to purchase my apples you'd have to pay a lucrative markup as I would have to get them to you. You love my apples enough to pay the extra for shipping as well as technology/energy to keep them fresh. Our business arrangement is contingent on the fact that you cannot obtain apples of similar quality without getting them from me.

    Then, suddenly, someone discovers a way to grow equivalent apples in an easy way and not requiring the perfect ground soil and weather. My business model has to then be refactored. The price I can set my apples at has been dramatically reduced because my past customers can now obtain what once was a rare product with ease.

    What drug cartels are going to have to do is start selling their weed to people within their country alone, where it still remains rare because of government prohibition and therefore can be marked up. Their market will be neutralized and no amount of extortion will make their weed products any less commonplace after the US prohibition is lifted.

    If the cartels really want to save their little niched black market they should infiltrate US congress, while they have to capital, and keep weed from becoming legal. Because once it is it will fall off their shelves along with all the capital that it gives. They'll have to start buying bathtubs for meth production to make up for the loss of profit from the legalization of weed. It would be nothing short of devistating, DGP, you WANT the US to legalize weed, believe me.

    -Sab

  • sabastious
    sabastious
    The reason they will not add the device is that each DUI brings in at least $10000 in court cost and legal fee's.

    If that's true I want off this rock!

    -Sab

  • talesin
    talesin

    1. Marijuana is NOT a drug.

    2. Prohibition is all about MONEY,,, follow the money, do your own research... just to get you started ---- WHY IS HEMP ILLEGAL??? HMM?

    tal

  • talesin
    talesin

    ps,, after reading other comments --- they can't successfully tax mj like booze b/c it's too easy to grow your own.

    ... just thoughts from a medical marijuana user who is sick of paying thru the nose for an herb that helps me more than any Rx drugs,,, without the side effects ...

    tal

    *waves at DGP hey!*

  • flipper
    flipper

    It's ridiculous the government is so into banning and regulating marijuana. It's just a plant for Christs sakes. It's all about control. The Feds don't want people selling it out here in California , even for medicinal purposes because they don't want ANYBODY earning $$$$ off of it before THEY do ! That's the bottom line. Same $hit went down during prohibition times. It's just another way for big government to control us . The pharmaceutical companies do the same thing in banning drugs which might really help defeat cancer . But if it comes from other countries they don't want it. Yet those same pharmaceutical companies continue selling and pushing drugs like Lipitor which has terrible side effects for many people dealing wth high cholesterol. Yet you don't see an outcry in the media over THAT ! You see advertisements for it becuse it's a big $$$$ maker for pharmacies and drug companys.

    Yet the medicinal value of marijuana is very obvious in that it's helped ease the pain of cancer patients and many other ailments . Yet the government refuses to legalize it. Yet if you look into history wasn't it the U.S. government that traded drugs for arms in Central America during Manuel Noriegas adventures in the early to mid 1990's ? It was exposed , yet the drug business continues to bring billions into the U.S. for our government. Yet they have the gall to hassle people over marijuana. Leaders of this country are hypocritical jerks

  • wha happened?
    wha happened?

    There are natural substances that people get high off of here in the US and I don't see sentances getting handed out. The gangs in the 20's seem to give up alcohol without much of a hitch, so much for that theory. All DGP can do is cite third world countries and somehow parallel their very corrupt culture, with a culture like that of the US. There's still corroption, but at least u can avoid getting a shakedown for cash if u commit a "crime". But it appears as a Christmas gift, we gave a very narrow minded individual a reason to get up in the morning. Merry Christmas DGP

  • dgp
    dgp

    Sabastious, I understand the logic. My concern is about how it would be possible to prevent drug gangs from taking control of the sale of marijuana.

    I'm currently reading this book:

    El Cartel de Sinaloa: Un Historia del Uso Politico del Narco

    http://www.amazon.com/El-Cartel-Sinaloa-Historia-Politico/dp/0307393305/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1324962444&sr=8-1

    (The Sinaloa Cartel: The history of the political use of trafficking in drugs)

    This book is in Spanish, so I don't expect most people on this forum to read it. Its author is a Mexican journalist who claims the current Mexican war on drugs is just a president with a legitimacy crisis trying to play the hero so he will get the recognition he craves. I disagree with that, but one thing about this book is that it addresses the multinational drug problem with Mexican eyes. The drug problem can be seen from different points of view.

    I am in chapter 2 of that book.

    The author says that Mexican drug gangs have been hit by the availability of designer drugs. They started as sellers of poppies, then marijuana, then cocaine. But designer drugs are -of course- other ways to get high, and they compete for the customer's money. Their profits have been reduced not because their sale prices or volumes have gone down, but because it doesn't make as much sense to to smuggle more drug into traditional consumer countries if it won't get sold anyways. So, now they are also selling locally.

    My point here is that these guys do know business. They don't do what they do because they are fools.

    And what does that have to do with the legalization of marijuana?

    Seen from "south of the border", whatever arguments there can be about whether marijuana is just a plant or not, whether it's not damaging or not, marijuana is business, and it would continue to be a business if it were legal. I haven't discussed whether marijuana is good or bad. I just said that legalizing it will not mean there will be less crime.

    The business is currently in the hands of the gangs. They will not give up that business if it's profitable enough. And, because it would be legal, at whatever prices you had it, then they would still be "in business". You could think that some of them would get away with selling marijuana.

    Let me make the point very simple. Al Capone may have died broke, but, did the mob disappear with the Prohibition?

    I can already hear the rumble of people saying that booze became less of a problem, et cetera, but I also hope that they will recognize that the mob did not disappear.

    Drug gangs will not disappear with the legalization of marijuana. They will just "diversify their product mix", which will, in my opinion, still include marijuana.

    One more thing. Suppose that Mexico decided to decriminalize cocaine. It's just a plant anyways, one with a long history of use in the Andes. What would happen in the United States if Colombian and Mexican gangs were absolutely free to take their product all the way to the border? No need for gang members to hide, or dig tunnels, or use secret compartments in planes, nothing. It would create formal jobs all the way from Colombia to the border. It could be taxed to finance education and food. It would give financial sense to be a farmer. Why bother with beans or fruits or even coffee if cocaine became a legal cash crop?

    I believe most Americans wouldn't like such a thing. It would create a huge problem. Well, this is what I have been trying to say, only with eyes "south of the border". The legalization of marijuana will make it harder for countries south of the border to control other drugs. Why would a Mexican or Guatemalan policeman risk his life trying to stop cocaine from reaching the United States, say, if the destination country could make it legal anyways? Why not just take the money?

    Please notice that I haven't discussed the medicinal properties of marijuana or whatever. Maybe my point of view is lacking in the sense that I am not considering those points. But I wish that people with serious interest in the matter would entertain an alternative point of view.

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