by XJW4EVR 127 Replies latest watchtower bible
It is NOT aboiut Jesus came first since I didn't even mention that or any chronology.
It is, quite simply, because of the resurrection.
The apostles believed and went out preaching BECAUSE Jesus was resurrected and they saw Him.
The core of Christianity is, quite simply, the resurrection.
If it didn't happen then Christianity is false.
It is that simple.
go away
Ok then....
Terry, I find your posts extrememly difficult to read because you do not seem to know how to use paragraphs. While I am sure you have some cogent things to say, I just have a difficult time following your writing style. Nothing personal. Just observing.
Prodigal Son: Actually it was noticed by a number of ancient historians, Josephus being one. Now, I'm sure you'll bring up the interpolations, and fortunately non-Christian scholars have been able to determine what statements in Josephus about Jesus were added, and what were original. In what is deemed as original, there is no contradiction with the gospels.
The resurrection on the third day comes from older myths
You are still believing this nonsense? There is no evidence, whatso ever, that the resurrection story was borrowed from any pre-Christian myths. They aren't even close. Sadly, this lie continues to be perpetrated by ignorant or lazy skeptics.
J. Hofer: I will only respond to this point. Your other points are mocking, and are not fit for a response.
extraordinary claims need extraordinary evidence. a resurrection is extraordinary.
Really? If I make the claim that I won the lottery, an extraordinary claim, would I need to provide extraordinary evidence? No I would only need to provide sufficient evidence, the winning ticket. Extraordinary claims require no higher burden of proof than ordinary claims, yet the unbeliever feel impelled to place God in the dock and demand that God jump through hoops that the creation conjures up.
Theycant said:
XJW4EVR, I by no means seek to insult your beliefs or even question them, but your assertion that just because many started to believe in the years following the preaching of Christ and Paul is built on faulty logic because many believed Mohammed's claims, just as they do with the Governing Body or any other (insert false Messiah here). This in itself is not a reason to believe.
I never stated that just because many stated to have seen the risen Jesus is the reason I believe the resurrection account. I said that this must be accounted for as evidence that these believers experienced something, and that the best explanation is the resurrection of Jeus.
XJW: Because there is insufficient evidence that he rose from the dead.
If you want to quote eye-witness accounts (written down decades later), notice that IF we agree eye-witness accounts written down years after the fact is persuasive evidence, then we run into the many currently living eye-witness of the miracles of Sai Baba http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sathya_Sai_Baba which provide more evidence for him performing miracles, thus we are forced to accept him as a miracle-man as well.
Really? If I make the claim that I won the lottery, an extraordinary claim, would I need to provide extraordinary evidence? No I would only need to provide sufficient evidence, the winning ticket. Extraordinary claims require no higher burden of proof than ordinary claims, yet the unbeliever feel impelled to place God in the dock and demand that God jump through hoops that the creation conjures up.
Sufficient/extraordinary is just wordplay. If you wanted to proove you had won the lottery you would need to provide about 23 bits of evidence. If you wanted to claim you was a man you would need about 1 bit of evidence. If you wanted to claim some guy performed miracles, you would need more than 23 bits (in my oppinion). At any rate, you need to make clear what your evidence is and make sure that standard give consistent results when applied to jesus, muhammed and sai baba.
In your oppinion i bet living eye witness fail to meet that standard (sai baba). 1000 year old writings of eye witness fail to meet that standard (muhammed). i dont see why 1900 year old writings made years after the fact by secondary witness which is often in self-contradiction is a lot more convincing.
winning the lottery isn't all that extraordinary. we know that people win the lottery all the time. there's hundereds of lottery winners every week around the globe. and even though it isn't extraordinary, you wouldn't be able to collect your winnings if you just showed up and tell them that you won the lottery. you could even bring your family and a hundered friends to testify that you won it, it's still a matter of having the correct ticket, nothing more, nothing less.
on the other hand, seeing an alien, a chupacabra, a yeti, an angel, a demon or a resurrection is pretty much extraordinary, at least when it comes to sane people. actually UFO sightings seem to happen a lot more often than resurrections. even the moster of loch ness seems to have had more observers than any resurrection.
now i wonder if someone came along and even showed you a picture of an UFO (and there are plenty), would you just believe it? i mean, there are even pictures out there, not just ancient writings.
but as i said, even though UFOs are less extraordinary than resurrections, most would want extraordinary evidence, not just some interpreted pictures, to believe that they exist and are indeed visiting our planet. more so as we know by experience that such things often are tampered with.
"tell me why I should not believe that Jesus rose from the dead."
Honey, believe it all you want. Everyone has the right to believe or not to believe.
I don't believe it. I don't believe in Santa Claus either.
I don't care what you believe any more than you care about what I believe. And that's how it should be.
If christianity is so important to the salvation of mankind,and the resurrection is a core doctrine,then why is God (and or) jesus just interested in giving this" so important" information to a handfull of people in a minority religous sect in the middle east,then leaving it up to imperfect human beings to decipher,debate,question, it all for 2000 years .
Some things just don`t add up
smiddy
