A Sincere Questions for Current/Former WTBTS Elders/Pioneers...

by AGuest 41 Replies latest jw friends

  • Aussie Oz
    Aussie Oz

    Hi Shelby

    I regular pioneered as a m/s for about 3 years and stayed a m/s till my leaving it.

    I was as dumb as most. Excepted we had 'the truth' and that the faithful slave knew it all, that freddy shoe shuffle was truly the greatest bible scholar ever and that all the publications were all i needed...bought into the idea that we JWs were really blessed to be the only ones with the insider knowledge about the future.

    Even in my dying time as a jw i did not see the reality. I 'studied' the publications harder than ever to save myself and sunk lower and lower all the time till i self destructed.

    The reality was that i, like most JWs, thought i was bloody clever with my superior theocratic education!

    Becoming a pioneer and a m/s had nothing to do with what i knew nor how much i was a spiritual person, in fact i was 'sinning' in a manner that should have precluded me from both services! I was appointed becuause it looked like i was 'spiritual'.


  • AGuest

    Dear Ozzie... peace to you... and thank you for that! I actually came to know personally that a lot of that took place (folks being appointed because of appearances) when they wanted to make my ex an MS. Okay, this was a guy who, at home, openly stated that he HATED JWs ("They're cons, Shel. I know because I used to be a con. And we know our kind"). But since he was the epitome of attentiveness during his Bible Study sessions, well... He actually conned a couple/few JWs (because "they wanted it, Shel. I tried to tell them that it wasn't a good deal, but they GAVE it to me!") - and they did!

    He even eventually sunk to using drugs (with other MSs... who were also patrons of prostitution)... and drinking (with elders who, IMHO, were full on alcoholics any time except meeting time). But that didn't matter: he was a tall, VERY good-looking (lick your lips, ladies, 'cause here comes Bro. J!) charismatic guy who "came up from the streets" to be a JW! They LOVED him. From the tiniest child... to the oldest relic. Single "sisters" AND married (the way some of the "sisters" acted when he came around... single OR married... OMG. Scandalous!) The "brothers" thought he was the "sh*t"... cause he could beat the sh*t out of any one of them... and they knew it. And once or twice he came close to showing them. He was their local "Lion to a Lamb" pariah (yes, we both "came up hard", dear Oz... but because he was a man, his story was more intriguing to them... and I didn't tell much of mine).

    So, yep, he was the "man" for them... because everyone listened to him. No, seriously. Not just JWs, either. I remember once, he took the kids to the local library. He just happened to have on some yellow sweat pants and a "Lakers" tank top. According to the kids... virtually everyone at the library SWARMED him... child AND adult... asking for his autograph (he was 6'4" and weighed about 240 at the time). I said, "You told them you weren't a Laker, right?" Of course, he didn't. He signed autographs for about an hour. Seriously!

    So, I can totally relate to your story: they will take anyone that "looks" like they need them to look... and can place magazines even with the illiterate (which my ex could).

    Again, thank you for sharing!

    A slave of Christ,


  • cantleave

    Hey Shelby - lotsaluv to you!!

    I was appointed because I was consistently out on field service, gave good talks and answered at the meetings.

    I knew the Watchtower theology and could explain it. I read the bible through Watchtower tinted spectacles, and knew how to highlight scriptures to back up my indoctrination.

    I was a good JW elder because I knew sweet nothing about the bible but could still convince people the Wtachtower was right.

    I hope that answers your question.

    Take Care


  • AGuest
    I was a good JW elder because I knew sweet nothing about the bible but could still convince people the Wtachtower was right.

    And that truly is the criteria, isn't it, dear Angus (the greatest of love and peace to you, dear one!)?

    Thank you for your response and, again, peace to you!

    A slave of Christ,


  • BluesBrother

    I used to be a "student" so I thought.. My Large Print NW Bible was well underlined and a lot of notes in the margin..Like many others though, I had a lot less time when I was an elder. I spent more time just preparing pointless Service Meeting items and doing paper work.

    As far as really thinking about it? No..Everything was read through the mental filter of WT teaching.

    Eg. If I read a scripture where Jesus said "All those believing in me will be saved", I read it as knowing that it really meant "All those believing in (the true Christian religion of Jehovah's Witnesses) will be saved"..I never stopped to see it as it really was

    So, like some described in Scripture I thought I understood but I did not.....

  • AGuest

    Thank you for your comment, dear BB (peace to you!). Glad to see you learned to "see" a little better! LOLOL!

    Again, peace to you!

    A slave of Christ,


  • Lozhasleft

    Excellent thread Shelby... after my anointing I read lots of older publications which were 'meatier' somehow. I got chastised for that, on the basis that they were 'old light'. I was frowned upon for chatting about spiritual things so often, even on the ministry. Elders always looked embarrassed if I tried to engage them. By the time I left I'd come to detest the meetings which felt so barren of any holy spirit or spiritual food at all.

    Glad to hear you're feeling a bit better btw.

    Loz x

  • AGuest

    Loz, luv! Greetings and peace to you, dear one! Thanks for your comments and GLAD you were able to see who they were and what they weren't! And what they truly didn't/don't have!

    BTW - You do know, now, though, that it was only a matter of time... that you COULDN'T have stayed there, even if you wanted to... because the very "water" by which you live... is lacking? They are, indeed, a "dry land"!

    Thank you for sharing that and, again, peace to you!

    Your servant, sister, and fellow slave of Christ,


  • rebel8

    To what extent did you, as a JW... read/know the contents of the Bible?

    I read it cover to cover twice. I was known for my knowledge of it.

    Did you look things up on your own to see if they were "so"... or did you just take the WTBTS's "word" for it that it said... and meant... what they said it did?

    Yes I looked it up myself. I also looked up the secular references they quoted. I quickly realized they took things out of context, made assumptions based on nothing, and misquoted.

    That is why I did not actually pioneer. I was physically and financially abused so I did not have much of a choice in my appointment to the rank, but I most certainly did not get my hours in or espouse the religion much. I never had a bible study, rarely placed literature and would only knock on doors if I knew they weren't home or couldn't hear me knocking. Otherwise I'd not go out, hoping to be removed b/c I didn't get my hours in. No such luck.

    I knew it wasn't "thee truth" well before being appointed as pioneer. I was plotting my physical escape for a while. Financial and physical abuse kept me in. I eventually refused to go in fs and was thrown out of the house with no cash or home in the dead of winter. That is the extent to which I felt I should go in order to avoid being killed by the cult.

    No, the thread was asking for honesty and candor, Jer, and I just thought you might like to be honest and candid for a change (you know, let folks know that you know you misled them... and take SOME personal responsibility for that).

    I do believe in taking personal responsibility for the roles we all have/do play in promoting the cult, even in small ways. All I can say is I did what I thought I could do at the time, with many more obstacles than most people ever experience in their lifetimes, and afterward I tried to make amends by anti-witnessing.

    I have helped more out of the cult than I helped in, and I'm proud of that, at least.

  • Farkel

    To crystallize what I said, I want to say this:

    Shelby is NOT a crusader. She may be a preacher, but she is NOT a crusader. There is a difference, because she is freely willing to hear and not judge ANY point of view, including mine, which is much different from hers.

    To know Shelby personally is to love her.

    Jesus was like that you know, except for the Pharisees and Sadducees. But they were assholes. I guess condemming assholes is ok then, but even Shelby doesn't do that.

    At least I've never seen her do that in 11 years. I would. I don't suffer assholes at all.


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