Now this would make for an interesting family reunion! I wonder, Susan, is it just Mormons and JWs in your family or are there other religions represented? Also, where did the religious split occur? What's the religious family tree, if you will?
The mormons vs the jw?
by Nicolas 60 Replies latest jw friends
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Billygoat
Susan,
So it goes. I still go out of my way to congratulate my JW family members on every little accomplishment, honor, distinction, life step, etc., and still sting when it is not reciprocated. With all the hurt in the world, shouldn't good people go out of their way to make other people's lives a little brighter? Just a simple, "Wow, that's great! I'm so happy for you!" goes a mighty long way!
I'm sorry you have to endure that with family, especially! Trust me...so many of us totally understand. That's what many of us here have to do with our JW families too! One common thing I've noticed with JWs is that they are INCAPABLE of being happy for someone else. Why? Because it takes LOVE to do that. That is NOT something the WTS teaches by example. They only notice the tarnished side of a situation - never the good side...unless of course, when they're thinking of themselves!!!Andi
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alamb
Insight from the land of Zion:
1. Locals refer to Mormon garments as "angel schaps".
2. Alot of growth comes from their baptism for the dead. Did you know most dead presidents, movie stars, etc. are now Mormon? Some of my deceased JW relatives have been baptized by my Mormon relatives.
3. Mormons brag about their health but will not confess that Utah has the highest teen pregnancy rate in the nation.
4. Mormon legislature has agressively enforced a 4 year statute of limitation on incest, child sexual abuse, etc. If that changed, the church would be in big trouble...legal caca.
5. In the years surrounding Joseph's Smith's revelations with the gold plates, there were a dozen other churches with the same story of gold plates, seeing stones, etc. His just stuck. -
MoeJoJoJo
Our neighbors are Mormons, and a couple of weeks ago they invited us over to watch a video about how the religion got its start, I believe the video was called “Legacy”. We are not interested in being converted into another religion but decided to go because we wanted to know more about what their religion teaches, just for education value. And they are very nice people.
When they invited us they said that they were also inviting others from the community (no one else ended up showing up though). We were greeted at their door not only by the husband but also by four of their elders who were all dressed in suits with little name tags, they all introduced themselves as elder “so-and-so”. It made me a little nervous at first. The elders were all very polite and around the age of 19. So we made a little small talk and then watched the video.
We talked a long time about religion after the video. We wanted to know how their religion compared with the JW religion. We asked about their preaching work ,the elders said that they get up at 6:30 a.m. and read from the book of Mormon then they preach from 9:30 am to 9:00 pm. They preach like that for two years, our neighbor says that the preaching doesn’t stop at that though. He said that they regularly visit with people mostly with those who are Mormon but not attending church regularly- I guess those ones would be what the JWs call inactive.
It is true that they don’t drink any strong beverages. They served Kool Aid .
They also believe that there is one true religion. I couldn’t help but ask that question.
Joseph Smith was 14 years old when he had his first vision – I thought that was interesting.
They didn’t talk much about the Bible, only the Book of Mormon.
I think they really wanted to try and convert us, they probably thought, “they would make such a nice Mormon family”. I respect their religious beliefs but I am through with religion personally. Not God and Jesus - just religion.
I believe that the visit was not only enlightening for us but also maybe for them. -
plmkrzy
SusanHere
Thankyou susan for clearing that up for me. I did not ask her at the time if she was converting to another sect. I didn't even think of it at the time. That does make more sense.
plm
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Valis
We would definitely kick thier asses! We got to drive vans in service...hundreds of door to door borgs could pile out of one van, not to mention we could run them over while they pedaled away towards the next territory.
Sincerely,
District Overbeer
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GoldDustWoman
They didn't talk much about the bible, only the book of mormon
This makes me think of the TV commercials that I see run occasionally.Beautiful scenery is shown and Jesus is spoken of. The importance of the bible is mentioned. Very clever and sneaky. At the end of the ad it is noted at the bottom of the screen that this message is brought to you by The Church of Jesus Christ, Latter Day Saints. It just another way the LDS church attempts to lure mainstream christians to their beliefs. The book of mormon is never mentioned. A sort of religious "bait and switch".
Black Mormons couldn't go to heaven until 1970 or something
I guess this is true in a sense. Now, it has been awhile since I researched the LDS church. So, I am only going on memory. I may have some of the details wrong, but the outcome is the same. Like the polygamy issue, it's another skelton in the LDS churches closet.
Black men were not allow to become priests or hold any church authority position until the late 1960's.Because Mormons teach that all Blacks are descendants of Cain, and that their skin color reflects the mark of Cain, church doctrines denied blacks of the priesthood. That they should be kept separate. Even though they could not become priests, they still could enter "celestial heaven" (the highest level). As long as they were truly converted and served faithfully. However, upon arriving in celestial heaven, they were still expected to serve.
Just like the abolishment of polygamy was directly tied political pressure from the Federal government, and Utah's desire to become a state. The civil rights movement was also the impetus that forced the LDS church to allow Black males to become priests.
In this way, they are very much like the WTS. When a questionable doctrine is publicly exposed, and comes under political pressure to change, the LDS president, suddenly has a revelation. In Witnessland, this is also known as new light.
Andee
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Yadirf
SusanHere
Hi Susan, and thanks for replying to statements that I made here on the 1st page. I’m quite late in getting back around to this thread, but hopefully you will be checking back on it and notice my comments and questions here.
Our full-time missionaries serve FULL TIME for two years. 10,000 hours is typical, if you want to calculate hours. How many Saturday mornings equal 10,000 hours? Funny that none of my JW relatives EVER have responded to that, but will change the subject abruptly. I'd really like to know. My guess would be years. Many, many years. Maybe a lifetime.
Of course JWs have missionaries also. However, each and every individual of the Congregation of Jehovah’s Witnesses engage in the door-to-door disciple making work unless something like maybe health problems interfere with them doing so. Can you say as much for the individuals who comprise the Mormon Congregation? I mean, all whom I’ve EVER seen working the territories (in my hometown and elsewhere) were what appeared to be your Mormon missionaries. What keeps the average member of your religion from going door-to-door? Why is it ONLY the missionaries, whom serve full-time for a 2 year period, that go to peoples homes to spread the Mormon beliefs?Also, although I can’t say that I blame you for not addressing what the poster who goes by the name “Abaddon” said (due to the attitude he’s displayed) just the same I think he introduced some interesting aspects of the peculiar beliefs of the Mormon’s (if in fact you really do hold those beliefs). Would you consider addressing some of the things he mentioned just for information’s sake? … as I’m particularly interested in knowing whether or not you really hold to that which he’s asserted. I’ll quote part of his statement here for your convenience:
The Mormon god is on a planet somewhere; he has physical form, and has lots of babies with his wives; they are spirit babies and come to Earth to be given physical bodies, and if they are very good, they'll get their own planet and their own harem and start sending their spirit babies to another planet to be given bodies.
To what degree is this accurate, Susan? Do Mormons truly hold that God makes his home out on some planet in the universe? If so, is God himself a spirit person or a physical person? In your view, does God have wives … wives with whom he produces children, who, rather than being born physical are born as spiritual persons … children who are sent earthward so as to become human?If you decide to go ahead and address these intriguing questions I'm sure there are others besides me that would like to know. If you prefer not to, perhaps I will forgive you.
Yadirf
Daniel 11:35 ... a KEY prophecy that must be fulfilled before the "time of the end" gets underway.
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refiners fire
well the Mormons used to believe that God inhabited a physical body.
Whether they still believe that is a slippery issue.Joseph Smith, in "times and Seasons" Volume 5,page 613, said:
..."First, God Himself,who sits enthroned in yonder heavens,is a man like unto one of yourselves, that is the great secret...I am going to tell you how God came to be a God...God himself, the Father of us all dwelt on an earth...You have got to learn how to be Gods yourself".
Mormonism seems to hold a belief that a man, thru correct ritual, and obedience to the Church, can ascend into the rank of Godhood in the Afterlife. Assumedly becoming a creator God himself, creating his own planets, creations, etc.
Heber C Kimball (member of the Mormon 'GB')In "Journal of Discourses"
Volume 7, page 333,said:
..."then we shall go back to our Father and God,who is connected with one still further back,and this Father is connected with one still further back"....I believe this is known, in Church parlance, as "Eternal Progression".
A man, thru obedience, etc, can become a God,a creator, a more powerful God, and still MORE powerful, etc...Now I dont know if the Church still pushes these beliefs or not.
If they DO hold these beliefs still, they are covered over from public view. Anyone going to a Mormon meeting for the first time will hear nothing of such beliefs. He will only here about Jesus, Jesus, Jesus.
It is possible the Mormons have toned their belief in Eternal progression down, as too controversial, along with their former beliefs in polygamy and that Black people arent acceptable to enter Eternal progression.The Mormons main book of prophecy is called the "Doctrine and Covenants".
In the past 150 years there have only been TWO "revelations", given to the Church that are worthy to be added into the D/C.
The first was in 1890.It is entitled "Official Declaration 1".
The Ghist of it is that Polygamy has to be abandoned,because the U.S government is persecuting the Church out of existance over polygamy.The second added "revelation" in D/C was added in 1978.
It says Black people can now be members of the Priesthood (equal to a baptized publisher, no big deal)One wonders that the 60s Civil Rights Movement might have prompted this change in Doctrine. -
Abaddon
Ah, Yardif, is there no begining to your talents?
Also, although I can’t say that I blame you for not addressing what the poster who goes by the name “Abaddon” said (due to the attitude he’s displayed) ...
You addressing anyone about attitude is an absolute laugh, but as you obviously have the introspective ability of a bannana, it's hardly surprising. Thank you for bringing a little laughter to my day.Are you saying that anyone's beliefs or lifestyle, no matter how absurd, should be addressed in hushed, respectful, reverential tones?
You are entitled to think that. But you don't apply it to people YOU disagree with, do you? I'll quote the posts you've made which illustrate this if you like, but anyone whose come to this board regulary will know what I mean.
With Jehovah's Witnesses, the only way I find of coping with the mad religionist stuff is by treating the mad religionist and the person as two seperate entities. The same applies to Mormons and many religionists.
I am sure many Mormons are lovely, compassionate, sincere people. But that doesn't mean they don't believe mad things.
People living in glass paradigms shouldn't throw stones...