Angel Eye needs an education on the identity and nature of Christ

jonathan dough

Angel eye wrote:

John 14 v 1 shows Jesus and Jehovah are not 1.

Acts 2 v 4 and 17 clearly show the Holy spirit isnt a person,its Gods active force.

John 14 v 28 is total proof,otherwise Jesus would clearly be insane saying such things

toomany scriptures to prove it...but just a few for you to recall,I guess its hard when your reading false claims to remember the truth.

REPLY:

I'm sorry but you don't have the slightest clue what the Trinity doctrine teaches. Re: John 14:1, Christians do not believe that the man of the God-man hypostatic union is the Almighty; the created humanity is not the Almighty, God the Father. That is the first deception your group perpetuates.

Secondly, you do not understand what the term "person" means in the trinitarian world. It is not a human being like you or I. The Holy Spirit is spirit, and even though it is also referred to as God's power or force, it also meets the definition of a trinitarian person, a Spirit person, which can fill an individual. If you are honest with yourself take a look at these pages for a clear explanation of the Holy Spirit and related topics.

http://144000.110mb.com/trinity/index.html#1

The mistake you are making is focusing on only one verse when there are many. You are wagging the dog by the tail, but even the Society encourages one to examine all of the evidence, right? And weigh it all?

Third, at John 14:28 where Jesus said that the "the Father is greater than I" it was the created creature Jesus, not God, who was speaking. This is elemental trinitarianism, basic Christianity, and the church fathers of the first centuries were fully aware of these apparent contradictions that you are stumbling over. You should educate yourself to the fundamentals rather than misleading people with the JWs' version of Trinitarianism which is patently false. They know that, and have managed to fool you as well. If you don't understand the difference between immanent and economic trinity you should probably stay out of the discussion until you get a better grasp.

Personally, I would start with proof texts that Jesus was, and is, God, right here. You might learn something of value. The Society is 1,000 percent wrong in this regard.

http://144000.110mb.com/trinity/index-5.html#20

JD II

avishai

Well, what she certainly does'nt need is more dogmatic crap shoved down her throat.

jonathan dough

The Bible is not dogmatic crap. Neither is the Trinity doctrine. And if you read the post you would understand that it is a matter of correction and clarification, and, no one is cramming anything down anyone's throat. It is a matter of setting the record straight. Angel Eye and Reniaa have gone out of their way to distort what the Trinity doctrine teaches and I'm within my rights to clarify things for the benefit of others out there who have been mislead by the Society. You have done the same.

yknot

.....umm last I checked the Arius/Athanasius debate was still raging on this forum with supporters on both sides.....

But seeing how both INTERPRETATIONS are not requirements for salvation perhaps you should be more concerning to address whether Angel Eyes really thinks 1914 and 1918-1919 actually happended as the WTS present the dates in current light or something that is not a stallmate debate but can easily be de-mythed by their own publications...

I am happy you have found peace in the profession of trinity......go with God and let the Arians do the same without making it a stumbling stone that causes divisions within the body of Christ

keyser soze

I wonder how long before this thread is locked.

jonathan dough

This isn't a stalemated debate but still has a lot of traction. It is a direct response to her statement that "I guess its hard when your reading false claims to remember the truth." The Trinity doctrine are not 'false claims,' and fairness dictates that I'm entitled to respond to that. And it is not just between and for the benefit of those debating but also the hundreds peering over our shoulders. The Trinity is the biggest obstacle for JWs in leaving the organization because they don't think there is any place else to turn to if theTrinity is false.

As for 1914, well, that is a bit off topic but easlily answered. 1914 is impossible because 607 is impossible and I've got ample proof written right here that buries their theory in its entirety with what amounts to mathematical certainty.

http://144000.110mb.com/144000/index.html

Lillith26

(lillith wipes snot on Jonathan) Nose-picker ( for being a total Loser!) Loser

keyser soze

The Trinity is the biggest obstacle for JWs in leaving the organization because they don't think there is any place else to turn to.

That's a matter of opinion. There are many who leave who still don't believe the trinity, or care, for that matter. Being shunned by family and friends is a far bigger obstacle.

jonathan dough

Being shunned by family and friends is a far bigger obstacle.

I was referring to intellectual and Biblical obstacles. 1) Trinity, 2) 144,000, and 3) 607

The Holy Trilogy of their faith, although some might disagree with this list. But the Trinity is the one that seems, in my opinion, to be the biggest stumbling block.

jonathan dough

(lillith wipes snot on Jonathan) ( for being a total Loser!)

Oh, come now. You can come up with better insults than that. Care to debate the issues?

JD II

Angel Eye needs an education on the identity and nature of Christ

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