I had a discussion with a JW sister today about miscarriage and the new WT

by BonaFide 63 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • reniaa

    Was moses God's channel? was king david God's channel? were the appostles Gods channel? forgive me but I don't see perfection as a requirement of God's channel? I only see having the blessing of holy spirit guidance which will show up in if your teachings reflect God's word the bible.

    We do not gain perfection until Jesus comes but that doesn't stop us being under the authority of our leaders! Who are allowed to have confidence in their message that they have been blessed by spirit into having the right one.

    I wouldn't be defending witnesses if I hadn't looked at other christian faiths and found they no longer teach God's word the bible!

    Refinement isn't an excuse but something we have to accept until Jesus comes.

    Our leaders are accountable to God not men.

  • hamsterbait

    REn -

    The WT teaches that jesus came in 1914. Why do you say you are still waiting?


    what does all this moaning about the rights and wrong actions of our leadership achieve?

    People suffered by this wrong teaching yes but it has changed are you not glad it changed?

    Does God make mistakes Reniaa?

    Does He continue to change his mind like WT Society?

    Does God get things wrong and would he serve bad food at the wrong time again and again?

    Or do these errors and changes indicate that God was never behind these decisions at all. That instead, perhaps these mistakes --many of which literally cost people their very lives--, have been the result of poor decisions made by fallible men who claim God is using them and only them today?

  • hamsterbait

    ( sorry petty vulgarity here in a serious post:

    Ah wants ta kip mi betch awaitin

    TWOOOOOOO tousand yeah man TWOOOOOOO tousand yeah man.

    Ma batch she beg me ta cumm.)


  • drwtsn32
    forgive me but I don't see perfection as a requirement of God's channel?

    Oh, so you can openly question any current teaching of the 'faithful slave', huh? You can come to a different understanding than them, since they're just imperfect, regular men..nothing more?

    Of course you can't. Because the 'current teaching' of the 'faithful slave' is viewed exactly as if God himself spoke it to the rank and file. You're right, the bible doesn't teach this type of behavior. It is definitely not a biblical teaching. It is a trait common among cults, however.

  • reniaa

    hamsterbait you missed my whole answer on structured leadership then?

    Romans 13:1
    Everyone must submit himself to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God.

    our 'old men' have the right to lead by virtue of being our leaders, show me a scripture that proves that we can ignore leadership given in Christs name over the flocks?

    Anti-leadership is unbiblical!

    If you followed Christ You would accept those men he gave authority as leaders over the flocks because that was his wishes and instructions.

    You can be a leader yourself but the warning is always that leaders bear the greater responsibility by virtue of being leaders.

    griping over leaders is easy but no one that recommends me to your viewpoint.

    Leaders are given a place in our congregation and by JESUS himself why are you ignoring his teaching on this?

  • drwtsn32


    you are missing our point. Our issue is not that you have leaders; it's that you have leaders that claim to be God's only channel of communication.

  • SnakesInTheTower

    good job bonafide.... waiting to hear about your fade imploding..lol

    reniaa... i dont respond to you often. I am, however, glad you are here. Your counterpoint arguments fuel debate and debate is good. Debate makes people think. Thinking leads to questioning. Questioning leads to an examination of one's beliefs. Examination can lead to change for the better...including leaving a cult....this site helped me do that...and I was an elder, pioneer, and MTS grad like Bonafide.

    Reniaa....You sound sooooo much like my JW mom, defending God's Organization™ even though she has obvious doubts about the ever shifting sands of the Watchtower doctrine.

    As an active JW on an anti-JW site, you subject yourself to an almost guaranteed JC by the rules of the religion. You not only lurk on an apostate (per JW rules) site, you are registered and posting, engaging apostates in discussion. You know this is grounds for apostasy. It is likely you would be difellowshipped. I sat on a JC for an apostasy. That brother did nothing apostate to be DF..there was no real "proof"....the PO had it in for him. The PO was not interested in evidence to the contrary. Inuendo and suspicioun was enough.

    YOU, on the other hand, have tons and tons and tons of proof against you for apostasy if anyone ever found out. I hope not for your sake. You seem to have a need to have one foot in the religion cult.

    I lurked here as an elder early on. Only when I was on my way out and fading did I register and post. I am done with the religion now. I don't do anything dub anymore. My JW mom is the only reason I don't just send a letter. For other reasons not apostate, I figure by Sept 1st I will be DF. I will DA first.

    sorry bonafide, I didn't intend to hijack your thread....I just had to comment on this within the context of the discussion. I wish reniaa only the best.

    Snakes ()

  • hamsterbait

    Ren - I read that.

    However as you must know Romans 13:1 is speaking of worldly authorities.

    I have every wish to follow Christ.

    These men YOU claim to have been given the leadership have shown by their lies, flip flop doctrines, UN membership, pedophile protection, shares in missile companies, tobacco companies kicking elderly ones from bethel to the kerb, that they do NOT follow Christ.

    I am Happy to follow Christ as the Holy Spirit reveals his will in the pages of the Bible. Is that a problem?


  • hamsterbait

    Ren -

    As for leaders being appointed by Christ via the apostles - by your argument we should all be Greek orthodox!!

    OH, what living in Yorkshire must be like!!


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