The elders came last night and i stood my NEW ground!!! be proud!

by New light for you 57 Replies latest jw friends

  • New light for you
    New light for you

    So yes, the brothers came for "encouragement" and of course, my husband is out of town on business... so it was me and the kids.

    SO i did let them in, i like these brothers...These are some things we discussed...

    1. I went over how that stupid "obey" email got all this started, got me to divulge to my girlfriend how i was feeling about the whole religion. About how at the end of the call she said that she can't associate with me anymore, and then RIGHT after that call/ 30seconds later while i'm crying a pioneer called and asked "do you consider yourself one of Jeh witnesses anymore??" and i thought that was CRAZY for someone to try to trap me when i was sitting crying on the phone, upset with the last call... i told them that for all purposes i am already DFed since NOONE will talk to me anymore, and only one friend called to see what happened, everyone else just listened to the GOSSIP of whatever spread, and wrote me off even though i'm technically in GOOD STANDING. I let them know this was making me SICK to lose all my friends over the past month and now i'm in therapy.

    2. We talked about the bookstudy change, and how it goes against everything I was taught since i came in the truth... and it's hard to swallow. they went thru a good 4 points as to why its "good" in their eyes... i can asnwer as to their reasoning if anyone wants to know....

    3. I told them outright that i do NOT believe this anymore. I do NOT believe in the "faithful and discreet slave" i do NOT believe it's spirit directed. I told them i do believe in God, Jesus, the bible, but thats all i have in common now.

    4. I then went over the fact that it's a cult. I told them when you see a list of 100 facts that make a group a cult, we do 99 of them- the one we leave out is we dont PHYSICALLY abuse our members. They loved this. First answer they had was "do you know the definition of a cult? it had to have ONE leader, therefore we cant be a cult. Then the other brother told me that the apostles were accused of being in a sect, and it was a good thing. They kept talking aobut how "YOU KNOW ITS JEH's DIRECTION because of all the wonderful clean up efforts after disasters, how the redcross comes in AFTER the witnesses.. and finds witnesses to know whats going on. about how we rebuild brothers houses at no cost to the brothers"... therefore, i had to bring up the cult issue. Of COURSE people in a cult take care of each other- that's why they feel special and stay in.

    5. I actually brought up the whole idea of the fact that when Jesus came for the inspection in 1919- which i believed when it was, they said "no it was 1914" that the teachings we were teaching then were SO off base, there is NO way we could have been appointed as gods mouthpiece. I told him as a witness, you never think about what we could have been teaching back then, but just accept that we were "chosen"- there was no way we could have been chosen. they also FOUGHT that we knew the date "1914 as end of gentile times" since everything started in 18XX whatever year... i said NO, we thought jesus had come in 1874 ( i thought it was) and by 1919, 1914, we weren't looking for him... they said, NO.

    6. I told them that i'm in a bad spot now because there is NO way to leave gracefully. That was the term i used. I said that if you feel the need to DF me i will DA, i'm not going to go thru that. Now i have to admit, these guys are GOOD people, and i told them i love everyone in, its not an issue of that. They basically told me NOT to DA, that there are groups of people that just dont attend that are "inactive" and i could do that. I told them the difference with someone "inactive" is that they still believe it's the truth, and i DO NOT. they still were supportive of letting me fade, which is amazing. They did say several times that you cant be on the fence though.

    7. They then stressed that we are the ONLY ones doing the preaching work, and that is what the bible is all a bout. I said there are actually lots of religions that go preaching. They said 'but we are the only ones organized".... so they asked for it. I said "do you think that the other religions just shoot people out of a cannon and preach to whomever they find when they land? you dont think it would be organized??" They kept making the point OVER AND OVER that then "where would you go? cuz if you can show us another religion that is doing the preaching work, and shows love among themselves.. we'll go there". YA.

    8. I told them that i completely disagree with the idea that your NOT supposed to investigate your own religion from the outside. i explained that any school i would send my kids to, even resturants have the "score" from the health department on the wall, to show from an OUTSIDERS view whats going on. its for our protection. They kept STRESSING " WHAT ARE THEIR MOTIVES????" i said, 'if they say something negitive, it cant be true cuz then it's from satan?" They said i should read the proclaimers book and it shows all their faults. I said i've seen the book and i have found many that arent in there.

    Sorry this is so long, i needed to vent. Even though these elders were very supportive of letting me fade,even after all i said was amazing. I realize that they now are going to report back.. and we'll see how nice the WHOLE body is.

    I was shaking and sweaty the whole time, but yet, i wasn't scared. I realized i've already lost my religion, lost my friends, and these poor guys are in a cult.

    ANy ideas how it will go when they report back? I'm really ok with any outcome. i'm glad husband wasn't here because it gave me a chance to stand up for myself completely on my own. I kept going over "what will i say if i see them?" in my head, and i think i was prepared enough.

    Thanks for listening!

  • megs
    megs

    Wow... Congratulations on taking a stand for yourself and what you believe! You should be very proud of yourself!!!

  • sacolton
    sacolton

    Don't get your hopes up that these brothers are going to keep this whole encounter mum. I'd be surprised if they just accepted you as "inactive". Most likely, they will be announcing you as disassociated.

    You did good. They are well prepared to counter-attack anything against the Society, but they speak with a loaded language. There is no doubt that their allegence is with the organization.

    "If a prophet, or one who foretells by dreams, appears among you and announces to you a miraculous sign or wonder, and if the sign or wonder of which he has spoken takes place, and he says, 'Let us follow other gods' (gods you have not known) 'and let us worship them,' you must not listen to the words of that prophet or dreamer. The Lord your God is testing you to find out whether you love him with all your heart and with all your soul. It is the Lord your God you must follow, and him you must revere. Keep his commands and obey him; serve him and hold fast to him. That prophet or dreamer must be put to death, because he preached rebellion against the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt and redeemed you from the land of slavery; he has tried to turn you from the way the Lord your God commanded you to follow. You must purge the evil from among you" (Deuteronomy 13:1-5 NIV).

  • Prov1320
    Prov1320

    Good for you newlight, you did very well.

    Their ignorance is truly amazing. Perhaps because of this very fact they perceive you as a "weak apostate" who doesn't have all the facts. And it might be this perception that may allow them to let you fade.

    I guess we'll know shortly what the outcome is going to be.

    Prov.

  • Metamorphosis
    Metamorphosis

    Congrats New Light. It's scary at first but in the end I've found be honest and true to ones self is the most refreshing thing there is. Best Wishes on your journey out and hopefully it won't get much more painful. It's hard sometimes to let go of the things we've known and loved for so long - including friends - but once we realize we no longer share a common goal and that life has a million more wonderful moments waiting for us, it helps ease the burden somewhat.

    Jeremiah

  • Sirona
    Sirona
    4. I then went over the fact that it's a cult. I told them when you see a list of 100 facts that make a group a cult, we do 99 of them- the one we leave out is we dont PHYSICALLY abuse our members. They loved this. First answer they had was "do you know the definition of a cult? it had to have ONE leader, therefore we cant be a cult. Then the other brother told me that the apostles were accused of being in a sect, and it was a good thing. They kept talking aobut how "YOU KNOW ITS JEH's DIRECTION because of all the wonderful clean up efforts after disasters, how the redcross comes in AFTER the witnesses.. and finds witnesses to know whats going on. about how we rebuild brothers houses at no cost to the brothers"... therefore, i had to bring up the cult issue. Of COURSE people in a cult take care of each other- that's why they feel special and stay in.

    Actually, cults can be run by a group of people. The point is that the followers are following HUMANS rather than god.

    5. I actually brought up the whole idea of the fact that when Jesus came for the inspection in 1919- which i believed when it was, they said "no it was 1914" that the teachings we were teaching then were SO off base, there is NO way we could have been appointed as gods mouthpiece. I told him as a witness, you never think about what we could have been teaching back then, but just accept that we were "chosen"- there was no way we could have been chosen. they also FOUGHT that we knew the date "1914 as end of gentile times" since everything started in 18XX whatever year... i said NO, we thought jesus had come in 1874 ( i thought it was) and by 1919, 1914, we weren't looking for him... they said, NO.

    Well they are either stupid, or they are liars.

    Zion's Watch Tower and Herald of Christ's Presence May 1 1881

    We would like to correct this misapprehension once for all, by stating that we do not expect Jesus to come this year, nor any other year, for we believe that all time prophecies (bearing upon Jesus' coming) ended at and before the fall of 1874, "

    Prophecy, 1929 , p. 65, 66

    "The Scriptural proof is that the second presence of the Lord Jesus Christ began in 1874 AD. This proof is specifically set out in the booklet entitled Our Lord's Return."

    http://www.quotes-watchtower.co.uk/1914.htm

  • New light for you
    New light for you

    THank you all! yes, the next week or 2 will be interesting i'm sure...

    Sirona... thank you SO much for putting it in print! Wow. i cant believe i know more about it than they do... and it took me to LEAVE the faith to learn more about it! I'm just walking around today proud as a peacock!

  • chickpea
    chickpea
    i stood my NEW ground!!! be proud!

    YOU be proud!!

    excellent integrity keeping!!
    (if i might borrow a phrase )

    i am expecting a show down
    sometime before year's end
    so maybe i will just bookmark
    your post and study up!

  • redredrose
    redredrose

    I am amazed at the courage it took to face them all on your own! You SHOULD be proud as a peacock. Hopefully someday I can be as brave.

    Its surprising that they would help you fade, it could be as Saltocon says: that the body may not agree, but I'm sure you are prepared for that.

    Congratulations!

  • Princess Daisy Boo
    Princess Daisy Boo

    Wow newlight - I think you should get a bravery award for standing up to them the way you did - well done!

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