by jwfacts 34 Replies latest watchtower scandals
jwfacts, I just want to go on record that I am very proud of you for persisting in this matter. I had read Australian law that the WTBTS had to produce. I want to see them try and squirm out on a technicality.
Secrecy is the tool of the totalitarian state. You cannot have freedom while their actions remain hidden.
The United States is probably the farthest behind in privacy legislation.
This is GREAT NEWS!!!!
It should really make people wonder what it is that they're hiding? Why not just pony up the papers?
Lisa
Inbya
They get away with all the interest being tax free, even the several hundred thousand dollars of interest that has been earnt, under the status of being a non profit org. All that means is they do not distribute profit, not that they dont earn it.
You do have to wonder why they are so determined to hold on to these records, all they contain is mundane notes about my indiscretions and achievements.
You do have to wonder why they are so determined to hold on to these records, all they contain is mundane notes about my indiscretions and achievements.
I don't understand why they would WANT to keep notes on anyone who has 'left'. What FUTURE benefit is it to them? It's all history.
Thanks for update.
I don't think you can beat them because even if they have to hand over your records they can always alter them to remove anything in them that is damaging to the WTS. It will however be a psychological victory if they are forced to disclose.
Thankyou for posting this, jwfacts. Obtaining our records is something dedpoet and I sometimes discuss. We both dislike the idea of the wts having our personal information at their disposal, and have cosidered writing to the UK head office to ask for them. We realise they are entitled to keep our disassociation letters on file, but don't see why they would need to hold on to anything else.
We will both be following your progress with interest, good luck in your efforts.
Secrecy is the tool of the totalitarian state. You cannot have freedom while their actions remain hidden.The United States is probably the farthest behind in privacy legislation.
In a way, the US's stance is probably more freedom orientated - after all, demanding that all groups, private or public, cannot have any secrets, sounds more like a totalitarian govt's approach. However, in this case, where you have a business disguised as a religion which considers itself a government (the ONLY government!) in its own right, the right to keep secrets is the right to power without responsibility.
The US is pretty Federal in outlook - check out state privacy laws.
Thanks for the update. At this point, are you able to submit a written retort to the WTS' last response? I'm guessing the new law is being tested with your case & whatever happens will set a precedent. Kinda exciting.
If it were me responding, I'd research the philosophy and purpose behind the law. I'd quote the purpose and say the spirit of the law is to protect people's privacy etc etc, not to exclude a large organization simply on the technicality of whether or not most of their income is solicited vs. not solicited.
Then I'd go on to show from the litter-ature that they do solicit donations. One example is here: http://www.watchtower.org/library/w/2002/12/1/article_02.htm
Paul merely suggested that "on the first day of every week, each one . . . should set aside a sum of money in keeping with his income." (Italics ours; 1 Corinthians 16:2, NIV) By planning and reserving an amount on a regular basis, the Corinthians would not feel pressured into giving begrudgingly or on emotional impulse when Paul arrived. For each Christian, the decision of how much to give was to be a private matter, one that 'he had resolved in his own heart.'—2 Corinthians 9:5, 7.
Notice nowhere in that article do they say it is ok to give nothing. They say everyone should give something. Other teachings show they are supposed to do what the Bible and the GB says in the literature.
Keep trying jwfacts! They shouldn't be let off on a technicality!
Stephanus, I would agree when it comes to privacy and disclosure legislation, that the US is more freedom oriented...for the CORPORATION. Whether it be religious or otherwise. Nevertheless, the US is behind Europe, Canada, and Australia in protecting the individual.
Europe has a richer history of information abuse, and so they are more sensitive about how information is used, held, protected, and disclosed. Note how the Nazi regime, and the Communists, collected all sorts of information on private citizens without their explicit knowledge or consent.
Why? Information is power.
If an American on JWD would like to know how to ask for their personal information (you get a copy, not the original. The original is still owned by the WTBTS), let me know what State you are from and I'll try and track down the agency or the request form for you.
Why would you want a copy? You get to see what people wrote about you. People who made decisions on whether your time with their organization would be pleasant or painful. Once a corporation finds out that their decision-making records can be read by their victims, they tend to become much more circumspect about what they keep on file.
What prevents them from just destroying the records? Well, if you ever find evidence that documents are missing, say a letter or report that refers to additional information, you have them for deliberate destruction. Destruction of records to avoid criminal charges is an offence in itself here in Canada.
You can also protest misuse of information by Hospital Liaison Committee members, if you spent some time in the hospital and the administration gave HLC members medical information without consent. You can register a protest with the hospital under the HIPPA legislation. If you would like to know how to register a breach of HIPPA for your state, let me know. I would love to restrict the power of the HLC members over ailing and inactive JW's.
The only way there would be a HIPAA violation with the HLC is if detailed medical info was released by the hospital to the HLC without the patient's permission...& then you register the complaint with the federal office of civil rights. Contrary to "conventional wisdom", it is not a violation of federal law for the hospital to tell clergy or anyone else you are in the hospital & very general/basic info about your condition, unless you specifically ask to opt out. HLC members are not subject to HIPAA at all; they can do whatever they want with information they have, regardless of how they obtained the info. HIPAA applies only to healthcare providers and insurers. Sad but true.
State laws are a whole different ball game, but in all my years of studying this issue, I've never come across one that restricts the actions of clergy.
None of us in theory need to go through our governments to get our congregation records destroyed, because the elders are supposed to do that upon request as noted in the elders' handbook. IMO it is worthwhile to pursue privacy laws to get copies of records or what have you, because it puts the wts under legal scrutiny and kinda forces them to be consistent/honest, unlike the current system where it's all at the whim of the local boe.
Just some random thoughts....
